Farming without subsidies

Doc

Member
Livestock Farmer
Around here ‘in bye’ land is that near the buildings or steadings, walled and demarcated. It has traditionally been more intensively farmed due to its handy location to the buildings (foot +/- horse) and hence drained, levelled and worked. The term predates machinery.
I’m sure people have expanded their ‘in bye’ land amount simply by improving adjacent parcels over the centuries for farming purposes.
 

7610 super q

Never Forgotten
Honorary Member
If you need to ask that question perhaps you are not cut out to run a business, have you considered going into full time employment? You would then be able to get a 2019 wage.

It was a genuine question, which so far has only had one answer. My suspicions have been confirmed that some only post to wind folks up, and don't contribute anything to the forum.
 

jendan

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Northumberland
aren’t you even the littlest bit curious?
I spent many years in my youth strip grazing our dairy cows on Italian,starting beginning April.It was great! and shortened the Winter up here by about 3 weeks.After that i strip grazed around the farm through the day,and set stocked at night.It was considered fairy intensive in those days,and i think many of the suckler men further up the valley were just a little bit jealous.Happy days!
 

glasshouse

Member
Location
lothians
How are the cows doing that, loosening the soil with their horns and kicking it back down the hill with their feet?

Surely, in bye land has to be level enough to carry machinery?
Churning it up with their feet and chewing off the rough stuff.
In bye means enclosed land, not necessarily flat or level or anything.
It comes from the ancient infield and outfield system of 400 yrs ago
 

stewart

Member
Horticulture
Location
Bay of Plenty NZ
It was a genuine question, which so far has only had one answer. My suspicions have been confirmed that some only post to wind folks up, and don't contribute anything to the forum.
It was a genuine reply to your "genuine question" There are several suggestions on this thread and others to potential improvements that can be made to increase income. The clip put up earlier with Lockwood Smith was an indicator of what can be achieved, the majority of comments posted on that clip were negative, why?
 

7610 super q

Never Forgotten
Honorary Member
It was a genuine reply to your "genuine question" There are several suggestions on this thread and others to potential improvements that can be made to increase income. The clip put up earlier with Lockwood Smith was an indicator of what can be achieved, the majority of comments posted on that clip were negative, why?
Not seen the clip, nor commented on it. The opinion of some on here is that we should be ashamed to ask more for our produce, nobody owes us a living, and that we're " commies ", and should get a job elsewhere.....

Fine, I couldn't care less, I'm semi retired from farming, but still manage to turn a profit to remain where I live. If things get worse, I'll retire completely.
If we want a vibrant industry that will attract new blood though, we need 21st century prices, not gimmicks and niche markets, that keep 5% viable. Or the industry could go the same way as coal mining, manufacturing, ship building etc,etc.......
 

egbert

Member
Livestock Farmer
I've no idea. I'm not a hill farmer.

There's some land near me thats too steep for machines. Does that make it hill ground?

It's too big a subject to give short simple answer, but i'll have a go. feel free to correct me!

In General....
Trad UK hill farms will feature a small block of improved 'inbye' -and often the better ground anyway, although the historic management might have as great an effect as land type.Shelter and rising water was often as important for the location of the farmstead.
Adjoining unimproved ground, whether common or enclosed, was used to extensively graze stock. Cows were seldom strictly sucklers, but milked/dual purpose, and numbers often small for obvious reasons of winter fodder availability.
Where there was more useful land available, there were often just more farmsteads, rather than larger farmsteads.

Upland farms are now typically wholly livestock operations.
But pre-war (to pick a time frame, although it's been on/off for a lot longer) many were still 'mixed farms', utilising their meagre 'in bye' to grow a few crops, both as stock feed, and as a limited cash/subsistence crop.
The increasing mechanisation/specialisation of crop growing, -and various political/international trade aspects- were bound to leave behind small/difficult cropping operations.
If you could reliably buy a few sacks of flour, why go to the trouble of trying to grow corn?
During the war, the push to grow crops saw in bye on many hill farms ploughed again -often with dismally wasted results, although some of that was resistance to outside instructions!

Post war, subs and rapidly specialising systems everywhere saw the lean toward livestock grow.
At the same time, 'improving' unimproved ground through mechanical drainage and easier logistics to transport lime/ferts saw outlying poorer ground altered.
(sometimes successfully!).

Generally, the inbye remains the best ground surrounding the farmstead.
Soggy peat is wanting to remain soggy peat as hard as you try to convince it otherwise.
 

glasshouse

Member
Location
lothians
It was a genuine reply to your "genuine question" There are several suggestions on this thread and others to potential improvements that can be made to increase income. The clip put up earlier with Lockwood Smith was an indicator of what can be achieved, the majority of comments posted on that clip were negative, why?
Probably because we are all sick of know it all smartarses from other countries who spout of at dickheads conventions. Especially thosewho have sir as a first name.
 

Hilly

Member
Round here inby land is what we make hay silage grow kale rape etc , hill land is too ruff for machines used only for grazing sheep cattle, i have 140 acre of inby land and the rest is hill land, in the main untouched , i spread lime and muck on the bits i can dirve on , a very small %
 

TREVD

New Member
Location
Powys
We would all like to farm without subs but is it really feasible when most other countries are supporting their farmer indirectly/ directly.
I would love to be paid probably for what I produce! Food has never been so cheap and the general public thinks it will always be that way, but with out subs they will be in for a big shock ! First of all we won’t be able to do it and secondly won’t want to do it !!!!
 

Hilly

Member
We would all like to farm without subs but is it really feasible when most other countries are supporting their farmer indirectly/ directly.
I would love to be paid probably for what I produce! Food has never been so cheap and the general public thinks it will always be that way, but with out subs they will be in for a big shock ! First of all we won’t be able to do it and secondly won’t want to do it !!!!
I think our Public relations has hit an all time low, Vegans have never been short of food if they had they wouldn't be vegan very long etc etc etc we are hated by a huge % of public, victims of our success id say , a good starving of the public would us alot of good, sad to say.
 
Well as long as it makes you happy you think
I spent many years in my youth strip grazing our dairy cows on Italian,starting beginning April.It was great! and shortened the Winter up here by about 3 weeks.After that i strip grazed around the farm through the day,and set stocked at night.It was considered fairy intensive in those days,and i think many of the suckler men further up the valley were just a little bit jealous.Happy days!
we are not talking about strip grazing which is a skill you already have.
 
It was a genuine reply to your "genuine question" There are several suggestions on this thread and others to potential improvements that can be made to increase income. The clip put up earlier with Lockwood Smith was an indicator of what can be achieved, the majority of comments posted on that clip were negative, why?
It's a "mindset" thing, much easier to be like herd of sheep following the leader than to analysise the content in the context that it was submitted and to make a rational conclusion.
Sometimes No8 needs to be used.:sneaky:
 
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SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

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Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

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As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
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