Fencing Stock in or Fencing Stock Out - Clarification

[Penmoel]

The law in scotland says that animals need to be fenced out, not in.
Our cattle once destroyed a garden during the night, but the owners failed to have a stockproof fence so the case against our insurers was dismissed.
If you desired a good relationship with your neighbour, you would pay half as that is the law.

The law here is that I don't have to fence my cabbages, wheat or flower borders in, you are responsible for your livestock and any damage they do should they escape and cause damage.

What is the position in Scotland with cattle that stray onto the highway and cause an accident? Are you not then liable for the damage caused due to your negligence. Again here roadside fencing is the landowner responsibility, unlike railway where the fence is the responsibility of the railways.

 

[glasshouse]

Animals have right of way on the highway.
If a car hits a cow , its their own fault. end of.

 

[Dry Rot]

The law in scotland says that animals need to be fenced out, not in.
Our cattle once destroyed a garden during the night, but the owners failed to have a stockproof fence so the case against our insurers was dismissed.
If you desired a good relationship with your neighbour, you would pay half as that is the law.

That's what I believe too, but a boundary fence is considered a MUTUAL fence so repairs or replacement have to be agreed. If one party goes ahead and does something to the fence, the other party is not bound to pay 50% unless the repair/replacement was agreed between them beforehand.

 

[Dry Rot]

Animals have right of way on the highway.
If a car hits a cow , its their own fault. end of.

There was a fatal accident inquiry locally when a motorcyclist hit a cow and was killed. Black cow on a dark night. The owner had a history of neglecting his fences but got off with no more than a slap on the wrist. It may be the law but the cow's owner was lucky the motorcycling fraternity did not get to hear about it! Those guys tend to stick together and rather enjoy exacting revenge.

The police have since confirmed that allowing livestock to stray on a turn pike road (i.e. with fences on either side) is an offence under the road traffic acts. The law has since been changed but I doubt it is now legal to allow animals to stray on the road, except adjacent to open moorland. or everyone would be grazing "the long acre" as they call it in Ireland. Of course, cattle driven along the road are not strays and that is different but there will still be a duty of care, I'd have thought.

 

[Penmoel]

I remember one claim a black cow had got on the A487 just south of Aberystwyth at about 1:00am in the morning, a nurse driving home hit the cow and killed it. Farmer obviously had 3rd party straying cover which covered both the value of the cow and any liability against him, all fences were in very good order but someone had left a gate open which allowed the animal out.

Since the fences and gates were all in good order, the liability defended that the farmer had not been negligent in any way and never paid for the total loss car for the poor nurse. Legal liability not moral.

 

[Henarar]

I remember one claim a black cow had got on the A487 just south of Aberystwyth at about 1:00am in the morning, a nurse driving home hit the cow and killed it. Farmer obviously had 3rd party straying cover which covered both the value of the cow and any liability against him, all fences were in very good order but someone had left a gate open which allowed the animal out.

Since the fences and gates were all in good order, the liability defended that the farmer had not been negligent in any way and never paid for the total loss car for the poor nurse. Legal liability not moral.

The fault would be with whoever left the gate open, did they come forward ?

 

[Greenhorn]

It is there responsibility to keep there animals on there land

*their

 

[glasshouse]

If you hit a deer its the same story.
animals get places they shouldnt, and motorists need to look out.
I have farmed all my life against houses. Some bright sparks just cut our fence and erect 15yds of wooden fence, but leave 200yds of fence knackered.
thereafter the phone rings off the hook, and i have to read out the definition of a garden to them.
We also get cars through fences at night, and even the police dont bother to tell you.

 

[Exfarmer]

In England you have to fence your stock in unless it is common land.
If you live, farm whatever alongside a common you will have to fence out.
Roads are another interesting point as you are obliged to fence against stock ingress ing your property from the road.
It is still perfectly legal to drove stock and if they damage property in the process it is the landowners responsibility.

 

[Penmoel]

The fault would be with whoever left the gate open, did they come forward ?

no

 

[Henarar]

no

No morals there then

 

[Penmoel]

In England you have to fence your stock in unless it is common land.
If you live, farm whatever alongside a common you will have to fence out.
Roads are another interesting point as you are obliged to fence against stock ingress ing your property from the road.
It is still perfectly legal to drove stock and if they damage property in the process it is the landowners responsibility.

Are you sure?
I have seen a few claims where farms who have always driven stock along the road, the route now passes several houses recently built with "open plan" gardens, claims have been for sheep straying off the road, out of his control, onto flower beds and lawns and the subsequent damage.

If I were to buy an arable farm in the east of England, I would need to fence the stock in yet, I could walk a bunch of cattle down the road where there are no fences and not be liable for them straying into some one's 100 acre field of wheat?

 

[Exfarmer]

Fairly certain this is the case. It certainly was when I last kept stock, when we had at least one very irate man try to take us through the courts. Stupidly he had left his electric gates open!
We also had a new housing development in a village where our cows went past on a regular basis, in their wisdom the developer had made it open plan it made some interesting discussions with the new incoming occupants.
However the law may have changed but I don't think so. If you do move stock along roads I would check with a solicitor experienced in these matters

 

[Pasty]

Hypothetical situation. You sell some land and there are devon banks as hedges. The purchaser now owns those hedges through the deed of sale, presumably to the bottom on the hedge on our side. The deed also says he must keep all boundaries stock proof. Obviously has to fence his side but what about our side? Yes, you should fence against your own stock but does that over-ride the responsibility in the deed of sale for him to keep the boundary stock proof? Easy with a post and wire fence as it'll be as stock proof on one side as the other in most cases. But a hedge needs 2 fences in most cases.

 

[Henarar]

if you sell the hedge with the land then the hedge is no longer your land so you should keep your animals on your land and not let them get in the hedge which is not your land, if you don't like this don't sell the hedge keep it yourself

 

[Y Fan Wen]

In England you have to fence your stock in unless it is common land.
If you live, farm whatever alongside a common you will have to fence out.
Roads are another interesting point as you are obliged to fence against stock ingress ing your property from the road.
It is still perfectly legal to drove stock and if they damage property in the process it is the landowners responsibility.

I'm not sure you are right about commons. We have a common boundary but no rights on that common. At the time of their registering Dad found out that if you are a commoner with a boundary on that common you are indeed responsible for maintaining it. However, if you have no common right, the commoners themselves are responsible for the maintenance of your boundary. Indeed this is what happens here.

 

[llamedos]

Commons; From Animals Act 1971 as amended,

Animals straying on to highway
8Duty to take care to prevent damage from animals straying on to the highway.
(1)So much of the rules of the common law relating to liability for negligence as excludes or restricts the duty which a person might owe to others to take such care as is reasonable to see that damage is not caused by animals straying on to a highway is hereby abolished.

(2)Where damage is caused by animals straying from unfenced land to a highway a person who placed them on the land shall not be regarded as having committed a breach of the duty to take care by reason only of placing them there if—

(a)the land is common land, or is land situated in an area where fencing is not customary, or is a town or village green; and

(b)he had a right to place the animals on that land.

General interpretation.
In this Act—

• [F14 “ common land ” means—
  
  (a)
  land registered as common land in a register of common land kept under Part 1 of the Commons Act 2006;
  
  (b)
  land to which Part 1 of that Act does not apply and which is subject to rights of common within the meaning of that Act;
  
  
• “ town or village green ” means land registered as a town or village green in a register of town or village greens kept under Part 1 of the Commons Act 2006; ]
  

• “livestock” means cattle, horses, F16... sheep, pigs, goats and poultry, and also deer not in the wild state and, in sections 3 and 9, also, while in captivity, pheasants, partridges and grouse;
  
  
• “poultry” means the domestic varieties of the following, that is to say, fowls, turkeys, geese, ducks, guinea-fowls, pigeons, peacocks and quails; and
  
  
• [F17 “ public place ” includes—
  
  (a)
  any common land or town or village green;
  
  (b)
  any highway (and the verges of any highway);]
  
  
• “species” includes sub-species and variety.
  

You also still have the 'right of detention' NB my own warning. follow this to the letter of the law! and seek further advice if it is a horse,(this section has been amended further due to fly grazing) and make sure any police officer who may attend is also aware of the Law.

• 7Detention and sale of trespassing livestock.
  (1)The right to seize and detain any animal by way of distress damage feasant is hereby abolished.
  
  (2)Where any livestock strays on to any land and is not then under the control of any person the occupier of the land may detain it, subject to subsection (3) of this section, unless ordered to return it by a court.
  
  (3)Where any livestock is detained in pursuance of this section the right to detain it ceases—
  
  (a)at the end of a period of forty-eight hours, unless within that period notice of the detention has been given to the officer in charge of a police station and also, if the person detaining the livestock knows to whom it belongs, to that person; or
  
  (b)when such amount is tendered to the person detaining the livestock as is sufficient to satisfy any claim he may have under section 4 of this Act in respect of the livestock; or
  
  (c)if he has no such claim, when the livestock is claimed by a person entitled to its possession.
  
  (4)Where livestock has been detained in pursuance of this section for a period of not less than fourteen days the person detaining it may sell it at a market or by public auction, unless proceedings are then pending for the return of the livestock or for any claim under section 4 of this Act in respect of it.
  
  (5)Where any livestock is sold in the exercise of the right conferred by this section and the proceeds of the sale, less the costs thereof and any costs incurred in connection with it, exceed the amount of any claim under section 4 of this Act which the vendor had in respect of the livestock, the excess shall be recoverable from him by the person who would be entitled to the possession of the livestock but for the sale.
  
  (6)A person detaining any livestock in pursuance of this section is liable for any damage caused to it by a failure to treat it with reasonable care and supply it with adequate food and water while it is so detained.
  
  (7)References in this section to a claim under section 4 of this Act in respect of any livestock do not include any claim under that section for damage done by or expenses incurred in respect of the livestock before the straying in connection with which it is detained under this section.

 

[Pasty]

if you sell the hedge with the land then the hedge is no longer your land so you should keep your animals on your land and not let them get in the hedge which is not your land, if you don't like this don't sell the hedge keep it yourself

Sold before my time. I always keep the hedges and have done on any land sold in my ownership / interest. I agree with you. The flip side is, if I sell land and keep the hedge, am I responsible for fencing the other side?

 

[Henarar]

Sold before my time. I always keep the hedges and have done on any land sold in my ownership / interest. I agree with you. The flip side is, if I sell land and keep the hedge, am I responsible for fencing the other side?

no you wouldn't be it would be your hedge you could do what you liked with it

 

[damaged]

On a lighter note.
I received a call from a neighbouring farmer telling me that "your sheep have got out and are now in our field"
I said that I don't have any sheep, where upon he informed me that a flock sheep had been grazing my field for the last two weeks .
I still have no idea who's they were but no harm done.