First time lambing ewe hogs

[DartmoorEwe]

Oh heck, what have I done? They've only gone and done it by the book and got up the duff. It all seemed like a fun game when the ram went in. ... it was bound not to work "because our sheep never read the instructions" but now that the results are back and ...

I was planning on lambing the hogs indoors where I can keep an eye on them, in fact I was prepared to have them in from now till they give birth so I can keep an eye on their weight gain. I usually lamb outside. Now neighbors are saying they are better off in a quiet field left to their own devices. Its the same haylage either way. Its only a small number - just 20 of them.

Opinions???

 

[neilo]

Oh heck, what have I done? They've only gone and done it by the book and got up the duff. It all seemed like a fun game when the ram went in. ... it was bound not to work "because our sheep never read the instructions" but now that the results are back and ...

I was planning on lambing the hogs indoors where I can keep an eye on them, in fact I was prepared to have them in from now till they give birth so I can keep an eye on their weight gain. I usually lamb outside. Now neighbors are saying they are better off in a quiet field left to their own devices. Its the same haylage either way. Its only a small number - just 20 of them.

Opinions???

Ewe lamb breed? Ram breed & type? Size of ewe lambs currently? All would make a difference to advice.

Personally, mine lamb outside, but problems come in. They are a maternal breed bred for easy lambing (Highlander), put to an easy lambing ram (Beltex) and mostly around 50kg at lambing.

If I was lambing Texel X ewe lambs to a Texel tup, I would have a different approach.

It’s a bit more work than lambing ewes, but a pleasure when you see those that just get on with it, and an even greater pleasure when the6 lamb next year. Enjoy.

 

[Al R]

Always used to lamb them out and hope for the best, 25%+ wouldn’t have a lamb without us bringing them in and skinning the lamb, I decided to move them inside as the tailenders from the outdoor flock came in to save field space, losses on ewe lambs are under 15% and that’s including a lot of twins.
The main problem with them is they lamb and run away in a field, in a shed they can’t run as far. Be prepared that standard hurdles may not keep them in, if you can put some 5/6year old ewes in with them to keep them calmer when they see you. My ewe lambs get filtered into the main flock’s single bunch and ewe lamb twins join the main flocks triplets(fed same amount) so it keeps them quiet with 30-40% joining every few days so they get calmer and then more join them. Easier to keep 50 at a time quiet than 250 in 1 go. I’ve moved to cattle gates to hold them in or doubled up the hurdles incase a dog spooks them.

Feed your ewe lamb twins as much as you’d feed a triplet ewe and single the same as a single( maintanance). They can be cracking mothers but do need patience, I won’t keep anything which hasn’t lambed first year, it’s easier to restrain a 50kg ewe lamb so the lamb can suck compared to a 90kg yearling which has never lambed before which can jump higher,faster and are wilder!

 

[neilo]

Always used to lamb them out and hope for the best, 25%+ wouldn’t have a lamb without us bringing them in and skinning the lamb, I decided to move them inside as the tailenders from the outdoor flock came in to save field space, losses on ewe lambs are under 15% and that’s including a lot of twins.
The main problem with them is they lamb and run away in a field, in a shed they can’t run as far. Be prepared that standard hurdles may not keep them in, if you can put some 5/6year old ewes in with them to keep them calmer when they see you. My ewe lambs get filtered into the main flock’s single bunch and ewe lamb twins join the main flocks triplets(fed same amount) so it keeps them quiet with 30-40% joining every few days so they get calmer and then more join them. Easier to keep 50 at a time quiet than 250 in 1 go. I’ve moved to cattle gates to hold them in or doubled up the hurdles incase a dog spooks them.

Feed your ewe lamb twins as much as you’d feed a triplet ewe and single the same as a single( maintanance). They can be cracking mothers but do need patience, I won’t keep anything which hasn’t lambed first year, it’s easier to restrain a 50kg ewe lamb so the lamb can suck compared to a 90kg yearling which has never lambed before which can jump higher,faster and are wilder!

90kg yearlings?

I leave my twin bearing ewe lambs on the same ration as the singles.....forage only. I tried putting them on better grass with my triplet ewes one year, and ended up getting loads hung.

They now stay in the single paddock with the ewes, stocked as tight as over lambing, then stay with that mob right through. If they have two and are making a decent job of them, they keep two. For simplicity, they are reared as the single ewes, no feed/creep/early weaning, and they seem to cope just fine.

 

[tr250]

We are lambing these to a texel on 10th April we have also got another 80 texels to a charalais tup. Tups were only in 10 days. We haven't scanned yet so don't know for sure but 150 have raddle marks on them out of 180. We are planning not to feed at all.

 

[neilo]

We are lambing these to a texel on 10th April we have also got another 80 texels to a charalais tup. Tups were only in 10 days. We haven't scanned yet so don't know for sure but 150 have raddle marks on them out of 180. We are planning not to feed at all. View attachment 757192

With grass like that in front of them, why would you want to feed them?

 

[DartmoorEwe]

Ewe lamb breed? Ram breed & type? Size of ewe lambs currently? All would make a difference to advice. ... . Enjoy.

We've been concentrating on easy lambing for generations of sbf and lleyn. The ram is exlana and the hogs are first cross bred in line. He's not too big for the composite and already proven easy peasy so no anticipated problems with the dimensions of the lambs on exit (I've no idea yet about his influence on her pelvis but this is the best way I can think of to find out). I will get my hands on them properly tomorrow when I have a first sort out to condition score and weigh.

...The main problem with them is they lamb and run away in a field ... you can put some 5/6year old ewes in with them to keep them calmer ... I’ve moved to cattle gates to hold them in or doubled up the hurdles ...!

Your sheep sound like the original sbf flock that I took on 10 years ago - except they took one of their lambs when they ran off. Thanks for the tip about keeping them with older ewes, hadn't thought of that, was thinking of the adults as competition for food rather than helpful calming influence.

 

[Al R]

We've been concentrating on easy lambing for generations of sbf and lleyn. The ram is exlana and the hogs are first cross bred in line. He's not too big for the composite and already proven easy peasy so no anticipated problems with the dimensions of the lambs on exit (I've no idea yet about his influence on her pelvis but this is the best way I can think of to find out). I will get my hands on them properly tomorrow when I have a first sort out to condition score and weigh.


Your sheep sound like the original sbf flock that I took on 10 years ago - except they took one of their lambs when they ran off. Thanks for the tip about keeping them with older ewes, hadn't thought of that, was thinking of the adults as competition for food rather than helpful calming influence.

Pick the thinnest ewes you can find if you were going to feed them inside, if on no special diet use the oldest you can find.

 

[Greythundercloudys]

Jesus, that picture can't be taken today? I don't have grass like that in June. No feeding needed for along time, lucky man.

 

[neilo]

Jesus, that picture can't be taken today? I don't have grass like that in June. No feeding needed for along time, lucky man.

To be fair, it’s probably less to do with luck and more to do with having a lot of cattle on the farm that have been housed, followed by an open Autumn/early Winter.

Good chance to make use of it by cheaper sheep keep though.

 

[tr250]

Jesus, that picture can't be taken today? I don't have grass like that in June. No feeding needed for along time, lucky man.

The picture was taken on fri 11 Jan it's actually oats cover crop being grazed. But as @neilo says we do also have a lot of cattle that are housed and free up acres in winter

 

[Bill dog]

The picture was taken on fri 11 Jan it's actually oats cover crop being grazed. But as @neilo says we do also have a lot of cattle that are housed and free up acres in winter

That’s some crop of oats !
How was it established ? I spoke to a guy last week who was suggesting oats as a grazing cover, but I never expected them to look as good as yours !!

 

[Guiggs]

I'm always really pleased with my ewe lambs, lleyn bred pure, I leave them outside to get on with it on their own, just keep an eye on how much cake thry get and the vast majority just get on and do the job themselves.
Very rewarding to turn up to check them and find a new lamb with its young mum close at hand.

 

[DartmoorEwe]

I'm always really pleased with my ewe lambs ... just keep an eye on how much cake they get ... .

I was thinking of Rumenco's giant biscuits if anything at all.

Any other year (when they are not pregnant) I run the hogs with the ewes eating ad lib from the same ring feeders and split them off when it comes time to start feeding the ewes concentrates. I'll know more after I've had my hands on them.

 

[tr250]

That’s some crop of oats !
How was it established ? I spoke to a guy last week who was suggesting oats as a grazing cover, but I never expected them to look as good as yours !!

It was cultivated after wheat to try to get blackgrass to grow with the oats and will be direct drilled into barley in the spring. It's ok but been held back by drought this is them last year

 

[puppet]

It was cultivated after wheat to try to get blackgrass to grow with the oats and will be direct drilled into barley in the spring. It's ok but been held back by drought this is them last year View attachment 757308

Impressive crop but if you are not lambing hoggs until April I would be having them on something a lot barer or some big lambs due

 

[andybk]

Impressive crop but if you are not lambing hoggs until April I would be having them on something a lot barer or some big lambs due

no they will be ok if a long way out , ewe hoggs will use that to get some condition on them which will help milk ,(unless yoru lambing texel types ) bit more careful 4 weeks out though , I have lambed hoggs last few years , they dont get treated any different than the killers out on keep , all lambed outside in may , then fed for 4 weeks after lambing , get lambs on creep and wean at 100 days regardless , or will drag mum down to much for next year

 

[DartmoorEwe]

Here's some sheep and hogs. Not much grass.

The best hog topped the scale (and scanned with twins) at 43kg. The worst one with a single is 31kg. For context an average gimmer in good condition went through the scales carrying twins and she weighed 41kg. Condition wise they are not so bad so for the time being I'll keep them with the ewes on ad lib haylage and reevaluate in a few weeks. Thanks for your help.

 

[Devil's advocate]

90kg yearlings?

I leave my twin bearing ewe lambs on the same ration as the singles.....forage only. I tried putting them on better grass with my triplet ewes one year, and ended up getting loads hung.

They now stay in the single paddock with the ewes, stocked as tight as over lambing, then stay with that mob right through. If they have two and are making a decent job of them, they keep two. For simplicity, they are reared as the single ewes, no feed/creep/early weaning, and they seem to cope just fine.

I agree, I'd rather a twin bearer had little kittens, that need lots of help to live or even die. Twin bearing hoggs don't recover well from prolapsed cervixs.

 

[neilo]

I agree, I'd rather a twin bearer had little kittens, that need lots of help to live or even die. Twin bearing hoggs don't recover well from prolapsed cervixs.

I certainly don't want them having lambs 'that need lots of help to live'. I expect them to have two on their own, mother up and look after them, as an older ewe would. Certainly happier for them to be 4 kg rather than 5 though.
I would never leave a fast growing lamb like a Charollais on a hogg as twins, but slower growing Beltexes seem to work OK, without dragging the hogg down too much.