For those farming less than 200 acres.

[Jackov Altraids]

1 yes
2 yes
3 Spend less, risk less, work less, produce less and try and worry less.

And stack the shelves in Tesco's at the weekend?

Because I could agree with the rest if so, because I can't make it add up otherwise.

 

[Jimdog1]

sounds like the road to nowhere

 

[Jimdog1]

Seems an appropriate time to revisit this, with invitations to apply for SFI now out there.

We were told on Day 1 that a central aim of ELMS was to address the fact that 50% of BPS went to 10% of farmers. To achieve that, those farming less than 200 acres will need to receive more via ELMS than they did via BPS. So:

1) Have you been invited to apply for SFI ?
2) Do you see SFI giving you more than you got via BPS ?
3) What, if anything, are you currently doing to address your declining BPS ?

No, not yet invited.
Current mid-tier agreement ends 12/24. Potentially more money to be had in sfi than bps.
Was planning 15 years ago for declining subs. Surprised there are still any to be honest.

 

[Jackov Altraids]

sounds like the road to nowhere

It's that thought that keeps farmers keeping more, spending more, borrowing more and worker harder to get by and keep the rest of the supply chain in manner to which they have accustomed.
For most, that is ultimately the road to nowhere.
I think @Humble Village Farmer is right, the point of highest profitability and low work load is before you standing buying alot of inputs. The problem is finding another income stream to meet the probable shortfall.

 

[Dave645]

Seems an appropriate time to revisit this, with invitations to apply for SFI now out there.

We were told on Day 1 that a central aim of ELMS was to address the fact that 50% of BPS went to 10% of farmers. To achieve that, those farming less than 200 acres will need to receive more via ELMS than they did via BPS. So:

1) Have you been invited to apply for SFI ?
2) Do you see SFI giving you more than you got via BPS ?
3) What, if anything, are you currently doing to address your declining BPS ?

Yes
No.
the only money under SFI on arable land is land testing or hedges, so unless you want to stop growing crops.

I will add it has bugs some fields were blocked from all option even when the fields were still suitable for most of them.

a bug on the payment page turned what I estimated to be a £10k option pack into £27k I made a small change it jumped again by far more than it should so buggy and not working.
Grass offers options but limited to low input and bird feed options that block later cutting.

I see no chance iit in its current from that it can go live, and when it does it will not offer payment rates close to bps.
If you want to grow crops it’s not for you.
Hedges are low payments but they can add up but only if you have a lot of them.

As for the decline, I have setup the farm to shift with the wind, if that’s not cropping then so be it.
I am in as good a position as I can be, but if the tide really does go out and stays out, then no options are off the table.

 

[Dave645]

1 yes
2 yes
3 Spend less, risk less, work less, produce less and try and worry less.

Have you priced some of those cover mixes?
And the money may not be accurate, I have 20ha of grass in an option paying 444ha yet it gave me £27k total. for that option so it should have been £8,888 ish. Winter Bird grass seed. So it’s payment estimates may be wrong.

I do see if you don’t want to work and put the full farm down to options that you could be right.
but will they let you take it out of the scheme at the end, when the 3 years is up, and the money stops under this agreement?
The grass option is rotational and doesn’t effect it’s productivity much for me, as second cut has been a very hit and miss game this last few years. So not taking that cut doesn’t seem a bad option.

 

[Canada Farmer]

Purely for those farming less than 200 acres * please :

1) Have you been invited to be a pilot for the SFI ? Will you be taking up the invitation ?
2) How important are current BPS payments to your business ?
3) From what you know to date, do you see the SFI as being of relevance to your business ?
4) If it's not too intrusive, where do you see your farming business being in 5 years time ?

* Average farm size in England.

Eh??? Why measure anything by 0.4 ha???

 

[Jimdog1]

Eh??? Why measure anything by 0.4 ha???

Why measure anything by 2.471 of an acre?

 

[Canada Farmer]

Why measure anything by 2.471 of an acre?

Because of 10,000m 2 eh.
What did the French ever do for us that was right???

 

[B'o'B]

Have you priced some of those cover mixes?
And the money may not be accurate, I have 20ha of grass in an option paying 444ha yet it gave me £27k total. for that option so it should have been £8,888 ish. Winter Bird grass seed. So it’s payment estimates may be wrong.

I do see if you don’t want to work and put the full farm down to options that you could be right.
but will they let you take it out of the scheme at the end, when the 3 years is up, and the money stops under this agreement?
The grass option is rotational and doesn’t effect it’s productivity much for me, as second cut has been a very hit and miss game this last few years. So not taking that cut doesn’t seem a bad option.

Is it displaying the total income for the 3years of the agreement? £8,888 x 3= £26,664

 

[Jimdog1]

Because of 10,000m 2 eh.
What did the French ever do for us that was right???

I feel so much smaller when I talk in hectare’s though.
(I like that you type with a Canadian accent,eh.)

 

[Dave645]

Is it displaying the total income for the 3years of the agreement? £8,888 x 3= £26,664

Maybe that is correct, but it doesn’t actually explain that, someone filling it out may make the wrong assumption that it’s an annual payment.

 

[DrWazzock]

I haven’t been invited.
I’m less than 200 acres.
Priority really is to make the farm as little work and as simple as possible without it becoming financially unsustainable or not worthwhile.
That way I free up time for a part time job. We are getting there. But messing about with SFI doesn’t really fit in to that plan for us. The options just don’t deliver enough income for the clat, stress, time, seed, wearing parts involved particularly on small areas. So the farm arable will run from March to October. Then other work through the winter.
I suppose we could put the whole farm in some more permanent scheme that doesn’t need much attention but I reckon that would gross £80 an acre and we’d have no production income from it, so much worse than carrying on farming without BPS.

 

[Bossfarmer]

It's that thought that keeps farmers keeping more, spending more, borrowing more and worker harder to get by and keep the rest of the supply chain in manner to which they have accustomed.
For most, that is ultimately the road to nowhere.
I think @Humble Village Farmer is right, the point of highest profitability and low work load is before you standing buying alot of inputs. The problem is finding another income stream to meet the probable shortfall.

theres still a chance to progress a business i you take risks and push on, theres no chance if you just sit back

 

[Jimdog1]

theres still a chance to progress a business i you take risks and push on, theres no chance if you just sit back

What’s your next move?

 

[Canada Farmer]

I feel so much smaller when I talk in hectare’s though.
(I like that you type with a Canadian accent,eh.)

They say I have an accent but I don't hear it....