Ford 4100 connection to hydraulic tipping transport box

Fordskin

Member
Horticulture
Hi,
This maybe a daft question but I’ve not connected any hydraulic kit to the back of this tractor before.
I’ve recently bought a secondhand Fleming hydraulic tipping box that has two hoses from the ram. One from the top and the other from the bottom.
Does the one that comes off the top of the ram go into the main hydraulic drive valve on the back of the tractor and the hose from the bottom of the boxes ram go to the dump (return) connection back to the rear axle on the tractor?
Clear as mud?? Thanks in advance
Pete
 

Fordskin

Member
Horticulture
Thanks Peewit, I’m not sure if what I have is a double acting spool or not. If I have a DA spool would I have two valves plus the return back to the axle reservoir?
 

peewit

Member
A double acting valve usually has an inlet/outlet close to each other. Freeflow return is usually separate and dumps oil unrestricted back to the gearbox for running hydraulic motors etc.
 
Thanks Peewit, I’m not sure if what I have is a double acting spool or not. If I have a DA spool would I have two valves plus the return back to the axle reservoir?
I'd be very surprised if you've got a D/A spool valve on a 4100: not impossible, but very unlikely. Normally just fitted with a Auxiliary Services / Linkage Isolator valve to lock the 3pt linkage & let you operate/pressurise the (single-acting) trailer tipping pipe using the normal 3pt linkage lever(s).

Confusing thing is that the lever which works this valve on those tractors looks similar to a D/A spool valve lever:confused:
 

Fordskin

Member
Horticulture
Thanks Peewit, Lake Nash and Captain sensible.
Captain sensible - that’s what confused me, my manual says that a single acting/single spools are generally controlled by a asc valve whereas mine has a remote control valve that I’d associate with a double acting single spool.
Is it much of a job to upgrade to a D.A?
 

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Thanks Peewit, Lake Nash and Captain sensible.
Captain sensible - that’s what confused me, my manual says that a single acting/single spools are generally controlled by a asc valve whereas mine has a remote control valve that I’d associate with a double acting single spool.
Is it much of a job to upgrade to a D.A?
A mate of mine has a Ford 4110 ... a later version of your tractor. Its got a lever coming out of the transmission tunnel just like the one in your post ...... I thought it was for a D/A spool valve like on the 7600s I used to drive. Not So :ROFLMAO: Ford used the same lever on some (later, smaller) models to make it more convenient to operate the Aux Valve, so no Spool Valve there.

But it may not be the case on your tractor. What hydraulic outlets have you got at the back? Are they fitted in next pairs? If so, you may have a spool valve. Does the lever move easily to & fro ... and have 3 distinct positions? If so you may have a spool valve. If it moves in one solid shift, there & back, it's probably an Aux / ESC valve.

You can buy kits to add a D/A spool valve (I've seen them on eBay), but they're not cheap (£350-400 I think). They fit onto the front/top of hydraulic top cover. Alternatively find one from a Breaker. Not exactly easy but totally possible. When you find out how to do it, let me know :)
 

Fordskin

Member
Horticulture
Thanks again Captain Sensible, this is what I have on the back of the tractor. I’ll take note of the remote lever positions and report back
 

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Thanks again Captain Sensible, this is what I have on the back of the tractor. I’ll take note of the remote lever positions and report back
Hi,

Sorry .... Difficult to tell from that picture, but you may just be in luck. Are they 1/2" Quick Release couplers which have lost their dust covers or something else. Really need a better pic, from straight behind the tractor, to be able to tell. Genuine Ford D/A valve outlets from tractors of that period tended to be in a paired aluminium-type housing, side-by-side, but that's not to say that your tractor hasn't been retrofitted with something else.
 

Fordskin

Member
Horticulture
Another pic, not great but straight rear. The other coupler is behind the top link arm. The hydraulic hoses from the box fit the tractors couplers fine but I’ve not livened her up whilst connected as I wanted to check I had it right
 

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Think that is probably a Single-Acting trailer tipping pipe outlet controlled by your hydraulic linkage levers.

Easiest way to check. With engine on tick-over, lower the 3pt linkage right down & put (both) levers to the bottom of the Hyd Quadrant. Then operate you 'suspect' Spool valve lever & see if anything happens .... Change in engine note, hyd relief valve blowing, oil spurting out somewhere? (Hope Not!).

If no 'action', raise the Quadrant levers & try again. If you get something now, it's an Aux Services Valve. If you got something the first time around, it's got a Spool Valve.
 

7610 super q

Member
Arable Farmer
As above, you could use a single acting ram on the transport box ( I assume the ram is the top link ? ). Plug into the trailer tipping outlet, raise quadrant lever to pull in, lower lever and the weight should tip the box ?
Other than that, you'll have to fit a spool valve, fed from the tipping trailer outlet, with a return back in via the filler cap on the housing.
 

Fordskin

Member
Horticulture
Ok. Some pics attached. I have two connections one being the hydraulic return back to the rear axle.
I’ve idled the tractor and carried out ‘Captain Sensible’s’ checks. The control valve lever seems to have detents or positions. When I push the lever one way there’s a change in the engine note (bogs down). Does this give any clues as to whether I have one single acting spool, a single double acting spool. Fleming say a double acting spool is required for the hydraulic box.
Any info, any recommendations appreciated.
Thanks
Pete
 

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Ok. Some pics attached. I have two connections one being the hydraulic return back to the rear axle.
I’ve idled the tractor and carried out ‘Captain Sensible’s’ checks. The control valve lever seems to have detents or positions. When I push the lever one way there’s a change in the engine note (bogs down). Does this give any clues as to whether I have one single acting spool, a single double acting spool. Fleming say a double acting spool is required for the hydraulic box.
Any info, any recommendations appreciated.
Thanks
Pete
Pete,

Were the main hydraulic control levers 'Up' or 'Down' when you did your test & the engine note changed? If you can't remember, try again with them 'Down'. Reason is that a Spool Valve receives & directs hyd pressure independently of the 3pt linkage controls, whereas an Aux valve is just a diverter & linkage isolator valve ...... Once the External Service is selected, the main hyd levers control the flow to it.

So if the engine note also changes when the hyd levers are down, you have indeed got a spool valve under there somewhere. If not, you haven't.

Whatever the outcome, you've only got a single-acting outlet at the moment. The 2nd (lower) connector is a free return back into the rear axle / hydraulic reservoir.
 

Fordskin

Member
Horticulture
Thanks CS. I’m almost sure that both pos and draft levers were down but I’ll check when I’m next there.
If so how can I find out if it’s single or double acting?
 
Thanks CS. I’m almost sure that both pos and draft levers were down but I’ll check when I’m next there.
If so how can I find out if it’s single or double acting?
If it's a Spool Valve then it's currently plumbed up as Single-Acting (there's only one pipe coming from it). Most Spool Valve's can be configured to be either Single or Double Acting and that's the case with genuine Ford spool valves of the period.

Yes, they need a 2nd hose & coupling attached to the correct (spare) outlet, but then a 'Float Valve' on the back (or perhaps the front?) of the spool valve body has to be screwed in (Items 12 & 15 on the attached pic.) When it's 'out' the valve is single-acting; when it's 'in' the valve becomes double-acting. Simples! ....... well perhaps :rolleyes:

Remove the metal inspection panel on the cab floor, just below the front of the seat, and see what you've got hiding away in there. Suggest you also go on eBay & buy a CD Workshop Manual. They're money well spent & they provide all the setup info for the valves. That's where I got it from.

Ford Spool Valve.JPG
 

Lazy Sod

Member
Location
Warminster
You could just get a stand alone spool valve with a single slice and mount it in a convenient position. Take an oil supply from your single outlet to supply the valve and the return back to the rear axle. Plug your ram pipes into the spool outlets and you're good to go.
 
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