France to link food prices to farmers’ cost of production!!!

[unlacedgecko]

Strange how I put more value on my head than my back!

Not at all. I'll drive your lorry for £200/day. But if you want me to consult on your operations legal compliance than that's £300/day.

 

[Hilly]

Which is why most of our produce is exported - agriculture is our biggest earner, still no support though.

Next?

You get support just a different kind.

 

[Farmer Roy]

You get support just a different kind.

How?

 

[Kiwi Pete]

Not at all. I'll drive your lorry for £200/day. But if you want me to consult on your operations legal compliance than that's £300/day.

Aye.
But I only invoice my company for time actually spent working in the business, as I never stop working on the business.
Remember "you're thinking like an employee"?
Well, sometimes I am, too.
But to charge my farm business for the time I spend in improvement, research and design, would cripple it (much as my kids can't afford to pay Dad to be at home) so not all time is created equal.

You have to remember that money and time are only man made constructs.

 

[Dave645]

Make your mind up - you are either running a business or providing a social service - which is it?
.

Both, if you haven't worked that out yet. It has to be a business because I am not state owned earning civil servant wage and pension, but we provide an essential service.
name one thing more essential than food.

 

[unlacedgecko]

Both, if you haven't worked that out yet. It has to be a business because I am not state owned earring civil servant wage and pention, but we provide an essential service.
name one thing more essential than food.

Transport

Every farmer in the UK could disappeared overnight yet the country would still be fed by haulage firms bringing in food.

However, if the haulage industry disappeared there would be riots within 3 days. Producing grain at 10t/acre is no good if it sits and rots because there is nothing to take it for onward processing. The last time there was widespread panic buying in the UK was during the fuel crisis.

Haulier are also price takers, yet they receive no direct subs at all (they even have to use white diesel!).

 

[Kiwi Pete]

How?

Our supportive government, weak economy, lack of rulebooks, and Mediterranean climate.

Are you just new here or something?

 

[digger64]

Both, if you haven't worked that out yet. It has to be a business because I am not state owned earring civil servant wage and pention, but we provide an essential service.
name one thing more essential than food.

But you are manageing your business for your tenant -the state

 

[Farmer Roy]

I think Brit farmers should just resign themselves to the fact that their payments, subsidies, farmer dole, welfare . . . whatever you want to call it, is just an alternative to working for the National Trust or English Heritage or whatever you call it, it's only to keep the countryside looking nice & pleasant & traditional so people have somewhere to walk their dogs

This food security & feeding the masses crap is just bulls**t. Where the f**k do you people hide? Crawl out & look at the real world

 

[bobk]

I think Brit farmers should just resign themselves to the fact that their payments, subsidies, farmer dole, welfare . . . whatever you want to call it, is just an alternative to working for the National Trust or English Heritage or whatever you call it, it's only to keep the countryside looking nice & pleasant & traditional so people have somewhere to walk their dogs

This food security & feeding the masses crap is just bullpoo. Where the fudge do you people hide? Crawl out & look at the real world

Busting a few tins Roy

 

[Kiwi Pete]

Busting a few tins Roy

 

[Farmer Roy]

But you are manageing your business for your tenant -the state

that doesn't even make sense . . .

 

[unlacedgecko]

I still haven't any takers for my offer of a swop from anyone if you think it's so good on this side of the fence you should be jumping at the chance.
The fact your not speaks volumes you can see it's not an actual investable industry, and you think we should not exist or get support to keep existing, well tell that to the other service industries as well you don't stand on your own 2 feet so up the road.

I'm not jumping at the chance because I don't have £4mil. Send me all the relevant details and paperwork for your family farm. I will perform due diligence on it. If I think it is a workable solution, I will offer to pay you your £4mil in monthly instalments over a 30year term, provided that the farm is on a walk in walk out basis (e.g. All plant and crops are included).

I do think that UK Ag is a liveable industry, that's why 2 years ago I started my livestock contracting business.

There's no envy/jealousy from me. I am grateful that I have inherited no land, as it means I will have to be more imaginative and hard working to buy my own land. But till that time I will make do with the seasonal lets that I can access at the moment. I will just have to structure my business in a way which takes maximum advantage of the land that I can access, when I can access it.

And BTW I don't have a job. I've been self employed since 2012. But even if I was in a PAYE employed position, my income could be stopped at any time by someone telling me "you're fired". I am sure many of the employees of Lehman Brothers or BHS thought they had guaranteed incomes. And they did, until they didn't.

 

[Bossfarmer]

What,s a normal business? Many do not make any money at all the difference is if they're not profitable they go out of business. If you're a landowner and can't farm profitably you get to stay in business because of the sub or the fact you own the land means you can sell it or rent it out and still make money, where as "normal businesses" are still bankrupt.

If food production is such an important matter of national security maybe the government should take back all food producing land so they can control exactly what's produced if there's ever a huge shortage.

if youre a farmer given the economics the sub is part of the profit equation, if you cant farm profitably with sub yes you will go out of business and many do, taking away the sub would foolishly hit most farmers in the business ruining farms and businesses right up the supply chain and making it even less attractive to our kids

 

[Bossfarmer]

If it's so God awful, and you make such little money, why are you doing it? Why not cash in that asset of £4mil and enjoy a life of luxury?

because were happy to do it its a family business and a way of life, mabye some appreciation for the farmers wouldnt go a miss we all work a lot harder than we have to to help feed the nation we are decent people and a lot of the public dont grudge us support but the bitter ones do

 

[unlacedgecko]

because were happy to do it its a family business and a way of life, mabye some appreciation for the farmers wouldnt go a miss we all work a lot harder than we have to to help feed the nation we are decent people and a lot of the public dont grudge us support but the bitter ones do

Has there been any kind of survey done to find out what the public think of farmers receiving subsidies? I think the answers may surprise you, especially in light of Jeremy Corbyn's ever increasing popularity...

 

[Bossfarmer]

Surely this just proves the point about the system operating here with cash subsidy. Lack of outside investment and profitability reigns.
I know there are loads of serious outside investors pouring money into Ag in other countries because they smell tax efficient profit and security of the investment. But this is where its all been pared down and businesses renovated so that they are genuinely profitable on global trade indices for what they can produce with long term viewing- calculating demand, market growth at home and abroad, averaging seasons, using technology etc etc.
I assume that the imported products we all use all the time (look in your kitchen, garage, shed, office) are exempt from this protectionist thinking pattern. They may be able to be produced here if the Govt gave the manufacturers money to prop them up to be able to do so but they don't so they improve or dissapear. My brother in law is on plastics. They used to supply Lucas for switches etc but now can't compete, so have sought other markets (including sheep eid tags). Adapt and survive.
There has been misguided talk of home food production protecting us against hypothetical war starvation. Think of all the everyday things which are imported from light switches to washing machines, tractors to cars, that would also stop. Never mind food, you won't be able to pick it up, see it, cook it or heat your home, fuel your car or machinery if there is import blockage or embargo like has been alluded to.
Look at retail/service. Your family have run a shop for generations and you love it and the shop keeping lifestyle. The supermarkets,say those annoying Americans at ASDA, or the foreign internet providers, are overwhelming you. Should you receive an annual cash injection from tax payers to continue running your shop?
It's a good, local British shop mind and you are a frontline food provider.

so if we stopped importing plastic switches would the country be in uproar at empty shelves 3 months later? shops qued out the door? people fighting over the last of the plastic switches in the shop? theft and violence everywhere? get a grip!!

 

[unlacedgecko]

so if we stopped importing plastic switches would the country be in uproar at empty shelves 3 months later? shops qued out the door? people fighting over the last of the plastic switches in the shop? theft and violence everywhere? get a grip!!

All major supermarkets have deliveries every 24hrs. If the UK haulage industry stopped moving for 72hrs there would be widespread rioting and looting.

Truckers subsidy? Ability to run an HGV on red diesel? Payment to haulage companies for every unit they have on the road? Subsidy for haulage companies which protect the environment by running their trucks at 10mph below the speed limit?

 

[Bossfarmer]

I'm not jumping at the chance because I don't have £4mil. Send me all the relevant details and paperwork for your family farm. I will perform due diligence on it. If I think it is a workable solution, I will offer to pay you your £4mil in monthly instalments over a 30year term, provided that the farm is on a walk in walk out basis (e.g. All plant and crops are included).

I do think that UK Ag is a liveable industry, that's why 2 years ago I started my livestock contracting business.

There's no envy/jealousy from me. I am grateful that I have inherited no land, as it means I will have to be more imaginative and hard working to buy my own land. But till that time I will make do with the seasonal lets that I can access at the moment. I will just have to structure my business in a way which takes maximum advantage of the land that I can access, when I can access it.

And BTW I don't have a job. I've been self employed since 2012. But even if I was in a PAYE employed position, my income could be stopped at any time by someone telling me "you're fired". I am sure many of the employees of Lehman Brothers or BHS thought they had guaranteed incomes. And they did, until they didn't.

There's no envy/jealousy from me????????????????????????????????????

just you keep telling yourself that i find it odd that most of the folk on here asking for subs to go arent getting much/any and happy to see the industry fail, coiincidence??? hmm

 

[Bossfarmer]

Has there been any kind of survey done to find out what the public think of farmers receiving subsidies? I think the answers may surprise you, especially in light of Jeremy Corbyn's ever increasing popularity...

yes there was a while back i even quoted it on here around the brexit time i believe it was about 75% in favour of farmers getting continued support