Fungicide on first spray

[Brisel]

CTL is only preventative...

 

[robbie]

Yes I know it's no good using my strategy of missing a spray and still only using ctl but if your going to do a preplanned t1 and t2 that would give you the best margin.

 

[Brisel]

Agreed, but on a limited disease spectrum. Ramularia only?

 

[Chae1]

I always thought ramularia risk was later on GS 45-49 booting. So only worth putting on 2nd application.

https://cereals.ahdb.org.uk/publications/2018/january/11/ramularia-leaf-spot-in-barley.aspx

 

[Brisel]

If you were only going to do it once, you'd do it at T2. This will be a moot point next year...

 

[cricketandcrops]

Two different thoughts from me on this, “normal” spring barley land, grown for malting with traditional seed rates, and arguably lower yielding sites with less N applied then responses to fungicides marginal but more often than not still pay.

Then we have the new generation spring barley on the heavy land targeting black grass, sown much thicker (450 seeds plus), fed with higher rates of N to smoother black grass and as such hopefully yield more, this creates as different climate for the disease.

That said my bog standard recommendation on spring barley was 0.75-1.0 Kayak plus 0.75-1.0 Amistar Opti isn’t bank breaking and didn’t let me down cost circa £18-22 / ha

Plenty of options for under £25 / ha

 

[robbie]

It does a bit for ryncho and abiotic spotting , which seems to be a big thing in spring barley this last few years. That was the main reason I started adding ctl to spring barley fungicides but not anymore.

 

[ollie989898]

Two different thoughts from me on this, “normal” spring barley land, grown for malting with traditional seed rates, and arguably lower yielding sites with less N applied then responses to fungicides marginal but more often than not still pay.

Then we have the new generation spring barley on the heavy land targeting black grass, sown much thicker (450 seeds plus), fed with higher rates of N to smoother black grass and as such hopefully yield more, this creates as different climate for the disease.

That said my bog standard recommendation on spring barley was 0.75-1.0 Kayak plus 0.75-1.0 Amistar Opti isn’t bank breaking and didn’t let me down cost circa £18-22 / ha

Plenty of options for under £25 / ha

Virtually any spring barley I ever grew had access to near unlimited nutrients and was always thick as sin. I used to go 2 passes with just zephyr Job done.

 

[Brisel]

What’s in Zephyr?

 

[Sandy]

What’s in Zephyr?

Expensive

 

[robbie]

What’s in Zephyr?

It's a distributer leg lifter fandango type product.

Proline and trifluoxystrobine.

 

[teslacoils]

Spring barley here is split into three ideas.

1) Beat BG. So it's all drilled into land that was lightly tilled land in the autumn. That reduces new weed growth. And stops moisture loss. Half to all the fert goes in the seedbed. 200kg of seed would be normal..

2) get it thick. Tillers pay. So spray at this point is about getting it growing fast, rooting well, and growing like bushes.

3) Make it yield. Most of the £££ come from keeping the flag and ear clean. So it will get a proline and strob or similar later on.

Any earlier sprayer pass will be the only ones that can be tweeked really. We often "roll the crap out of it" so may roll twice before stem extension which often means later blw control required. The first fungicide is often a response to the season but is mainly there to set up the second.

 

[Grass And Grain]

Does anyone think there is much economic difference between using a proline+strobe programme vs straight Siltra, or cheap and chearful.

 

[robbie]

Does anyone think there is much economic difference between using a proline+strobe programme vs straight Siltra, or cheap and chearful.

What would be the cheap and cheerful? Teb or opus + amistar?
Proline is the dogs danglies on barley so anything with a good slug of that is the best but weather it's with a stobe or bixafen doesn't really make much difference price wise.
I always try to avoid siltra on principal, it annoys me the same product for wheat is £80+ a can cheaper.

 

[ollie989898]

What’s in Zephyr?

Proline + Strobilurin. Worked well on barley and absolutely no need to make anything more complicated in my book. Using it twice greatly simplified spray programs.

 

[ollie989898]

It wasn't even that expensive given the rates used and as with anything I am sure you can find a range of prices for these things. Other similar products exist no doubt. Two actives in one can suited what I needed from it. Was spring barley worth SDHI, always had my doubts. Also the rate vs can size was handy for the bits I had to do.

 

[Happy]

Does anyone think there is much economic difference between using a proline+strobe programme vs straight Siltra, or cheap and chearful.

Can’t see it.
Yield difference between treated and untreated on the current recommended spring barley varieties is only 10%.
Would think cheep and cheerful would cover you for the majority of that 10% yield loss.

 

[juke]

is a tenner an acre to much to spend on a barley fungicide.. especially when the crops are full of potential

 

[ollie989898]

is a tenner an acre to much to spend on a barley fungicide.. especially when the crops are full of potential

I agree. Either spray em to protect from disease or don't bother at all. I've never bothered using CTL on spring barley and would never just spray with it.

Spring barley for me was basically a two-pass job.

1st application at the end of tiller/very beginning of stem extension or as late as I could leave the weeds- basically an SU (+/- a small dose of starane if cleavers about) with zephyr or similar in it. Manganese/Magphos K can go in if you want.

2nd application just before awns visible, same fungicide again. Terpal if necessary but would need to go a snitch earlier.

Strobilurin would keep the crop green for that bit longer and help keep the rust out if the weather turned sticky. Tried to avoid Syngenta stuff generally, siltra possibly around the same money but zephyr always worked in terms of can sizes, very scarce memory now but I think a can did enough for 25 acres, I can't remember.

Only time I deviated from the above was if the crop looked poorly just after emergence or if wild oats were an issue.

 

[juke]

I agree. Either spray em to protect from disease or don't bother at all. I've never bothered using CTL on spring barley and would never just spray with it.

Spring barley for me was basically a two-pass job.

1st application at the end of tiller/very beginning of stem extension or as late as I could leave the weeds- basically an SU (+/- a small dose of starane if cleavers about) with zephyr or similar in it. Manganese/Magphos K can go in if you want.

2nd application just before awns visible, same fungicide again. Terpal if necessary but would need to go a snitch earlier.

Strobilurin would keep the crop green for that bit longer and help keep the rust out if the weather turned sticky. Tried to avoid Syngenta stuff generally, siltra possibly around the same money but zephyr always worked in terms of can sizes, very scarce memory now but I think a can did enough for 25 acres, I can't remember.

Only time I deviated from the above was if the crop looked poorly just after emergence or if wild oats were an issue.

We use mobius (zephyr) and siltra in winter barley will do the same likely in the spring drilled.. I don't really think these chems are too cost prohibitive when your pushing yields around 4 ton and 3 ton in spring crops ..

Could the cheap alternatives actually be the products that cost you alot more as we are seeing in the wheat crops round here . The ones sprayed with let's call it a stronger package are clean.. those that went for a cheaper option full of yellow rust now .. those cheaper options surley have to be a waste of money over the more robust clean crops