Future Farm Subsidy Scheme?

Worsall

Member
Arable Farmer
This is what I believe is proposed.
Draft DEFRA recommendations:
Key Points
1.BPS to be phased out over three years,at 70%/50%/30% current value.
Future claim as previously in May on occupied land.
2.Three year Tiered Hardship payment based on past BPS claim years 2017/2018/2019
Average of the three years claim at 30% for each year.
Future claim will not require any land.
Capped value.
Opportunity for Farmer retirement or cease farming.
3.Future Farm Management Plan payments to replace BPS
 

Brisel

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Midlands
I agree about the phasing out of BPS but no idea of timeline.
Capping will be real and aggressive. Defra will have to administer it at their own expense so any Treasury budget allocation will have to consider that. Under the CAP they could not slice any payments off to cover admin costs.
There will have to be some qualifying criteria or the scheme will be indefensible as any payments disappear from the land.
I agree that there will be an opportunity for a one off retirement payment.
Probably some kind of tradable entitlement scheme or new entrant system with limited funds.
Any future payments post BPS will be based on Greening/Public Goods/ELMS. Measurement for a results based payment is difficult! Expect a form to be filled in annually by 15th May...
 

Still Farming

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
South Wales UK
I agree about the phasing out of BPS but no idea of timeline.
Capping will be real and aggressive. Defra will have to administer it at their own expense so any Treasury budget allocation will have to consider that. Under the CAP they could not slice any payments off to cover admin costs.
There will have to be some qualifying criteria or the scheme will be indefensible as any payments disappear from the land.
I agree that there will be an opportunity for a one off retirement payment.
Probably some kind of tradable entitlement scheme or new entrant system with limited funds.
Any future payments post BPS will be based on Greening/Public Goods/ELMS. Measurement for a results based payment is difficult! Expect a form to be filled in annually by 15th May...
Wales different possibly.
 

Frank-the-Wool

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
East Sussex
Unless we leave the EU none of this will happen.

Until there is a clear direction of what happens here we will not be in a position to know what any future scheme will be. If we remain then we will continue with a system based on what the EU agrees.

If we leave then we will have a system where we are forced to de-stock and become park keepers, there will be no payments for productivity only conservation.
The British system that has been proposed is to remove direct payments over a 7 year period.

But lets not speculate as none of us knows!
If we are outside of the EU it will be incredibly difficult for the farming community to have much influence.
 

Brisel

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Midlands
The farming community has no influence now. It's only Brussels that paid out BPS/Pillar 1 and Pillar 2.

Whilst I really don't want this to turn into a Brexit thread I suspect we will leave enough of the EU to sever the CAP payments link. IMO there is no guarantee that Westminster will wait as long as 7 years to phase direct payments out. That was only Gove saying that with a caveat about the length of this Parliament & no guarantees from the Treasury either. I agree about there being no incentive to stock or crop land unless it is managing environmental features. Lots of nesting habitat depends on grazing. I doubt they'd design an ELM scheme that basically pays farmers to rewild the lot if they chose to.
 

steveR

Member
Mixed Farmer
The farming community has no influence now. It's only Brussels that paid out BPS/Pillar 1 and Pillar 2.

Whilst I really don't want this to turn into a Brexit thread I suspect we will leave enough of the EU to sever the CAP payments link. IMO there is no guarantee that Westminster will wait as long as 7 years to phase direct payments out. That was only Gove saying that with a caveat about the length of this Parliament & no guarantees from the Treasury either. I agree about there being no incentive to stock or crop land unless it is managing environmental features. Lots of nesting habitat depends on grazing. I doubt they'd design an ELM scheme that basically pays farmers to rewild the lot if they chose to.

Yet a nearby area of thin G3 arable land has an asking price in excess of 10K/ac...:unsure:
 

glasshouse

Member
Location
lothians
The farming community has no influence now. It's only Brussels that paid out BPS/Pillar 1 and Pillar 2.

Whilst I really don't want this to turn into a Brexit thread I suspect we will leave enough of the EU to sever the CAP payments link. IMO there is no guarantee that Westminster will wait as long as 7 years to phase direct payments out. That was only Gove saying that with a caveat about the length of this Parliament & no guarantees from the Treasury either. I agree about there being no incentive to stock or crop land unless it is managing environmental features. Lots of nesting habitat depends on grazing. I doubt they'd design an ELM scheme that basically pays farmers to rewild the lot if they chose to.
Its the european farming communities that get us subsidies because they have influence
 

soilbug

Member
Subsidies - SFP et al - scrap 'em all, I say! They are of no value but to keep uneconomic units inbusiness and economic ones on a knife edge because the supermarkets pay less and less for our produce knowing the SFP will keep us (just) alive.

When I was a kid after the war the fields were bursting with wildlife - birds, butterflies, insects of every sort, even 'though dad kept 28 milkers plus youngstock on 25 acres. But of course we used soil to feed the crops, not as a rooting material to keep plants upright whilst Big Pharma sterilised and fed everything by chemical inputs with most of the profit going to them. The educational establishments, thinking 'hi-tech' is what it is all about, have taught us how to boost yields at the expense of chemical damage and without bottom line financial gain. The big arable boys work for the Fendt 'balloon' system and the big livestock boys wear themselves out faster than the guy who had to walk behind the horse.

The ray of hope is that the colleges will discover the secret of the 'bottom line' and Harper Adams will perfect the little driverless gantry to work the land whilst we grab some 'family time', cutting down capital costs and improving soil quality, leaving us to co-operate by opening 'farm shops' under our own control - at the roadside or as a westcountry 'mole-valley' model [thank you John James RIP]
soilbug.
 

steveR

Member
Mixed Farmer
Subsidies - SFP et al - scrap 'em all, I say! They are of no value but to keep uneconomic units inbusiness and economic ones on a knife edge because the supermarkets pay less and less for our produce knowing the SFP will keep us (just) alive.

When I was a kid after the war the fields were bursting with wildlife - birds, butterflies, insects of every sort, even 'though dad kept 28 milkers plus youngstock on 25 acres. But of course we used soil to feed the crops, not as a rooting material to keep plants upright whilst Big Pharma sterilised and fed everything by chemical inputs with most of the profit going to them. The educational establishments, thinking 'hi-tech' is what it is all about, have taught us how to boost yields at the expense of chemical damage and without bottom line financial gain. The big arable boys work for the Fendt 'balloon' system and the big livestock boys wear themselves out faster than the guy who had to walk behind the horse.

The ray of hope is that the colleges will discover the secret of the 'bottom line' and Harper Adams will perfect the little driverless gantry to work the land whilst we grab some 'family time', cutting down capital costs and improving soil quality, leaving us to co-operate by opening 'farm shops' under our own control - at the roadside or as a westcountry 'mole-valley' model [thank you John James RIP]
soilbug.

Very nice idea and equally nice memories. Sadly, I think the rose tuinted specs have obscured the view somewhat!

I would love to take my family farm back to what it was when I arrived here at 17 in the mid 70s. 3 blokes kept in employment and a great, mixed arable farm using a traditional rotation
 

soilbug

Member
SteveR - yes you have a big point but dreams can be made into reality when the sticky stuff hits the fan. When the gov (and most of consumers) realise that the big five supermarkets and couple of discounters are not in fact farms, but only middle men who set prices at around the cost of production and keep farmers as 'lorry loaders' who survive only thanks to the farm subsidies, those prices will have to become realistic, especially when Africa wakes up to the politics of feeding itself after kicking the Chinese off their land.

UK farmers only have one problem - we will not co-operate to build and retain control of the food processing sector to set our own prices based on quality, provenance and cost of production. Sad i'nit? - soilbug
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

  • 0 %

    Votes: 80 42.3%
  • Up to 25%

    Votes: 66 34.9%
  • 25-50%

    Votes: 30 15.9%
  • 50-75%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 75-100%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 100% I’ve had enough of farming!

    Votes: 7 3.7%

Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

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  • 1
As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
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