George Eustice's announcement "The path to sustainable farming." 2021-2024

[Mixedupfarmer]

I don’t understand people that still think Elms will replace BPS, unless in a very simplified form, ie- get paid a few pounds for low input pp, or not cutting hedges every year. The current environmental schemes and the good old HLS we once had, allow you to get paid for the option, like 6m margins or wild bird seed plots, whilst crucially still getting the BPS on top.
So say £125 acre for the option plus the £90 bps, gives £215,/ minus cost of establishing/ seed etc, maybe leaving £150 acre before rent( if your lucky)
new Elms scheme £125 acre, no bps, same costs, is £35 before rent, which will put you in a loss making scenario .

Maybe those who don't understand don't have rent to pay?

 

[onthehoof]

So say £125 acre for the option

What option pays that?

 

[gone up the hill]

exactly and what I cant understand is why folks havnt realised that they are soon going to be around £90/acre short of income ,I can only assume that many think the price of outputs will increase and the price of inputs will decrease which over time has never happened

More likely that we will lose the £90 acre and at the same time the price of outputs will decrease and the price of inputs will increase!

 

[DRC]

The only thing that really paid for us, was in the old HLS , when we had fields in arable reversion paying £140 acre, which we then grazed with heifers we were contract rearing and obviously claimed the old IACs payment .

 

[DRC]

What option pays that?

I think there’s a few options, like arable reversion, herb rich leys etc.
2 yr legume fallow is £211 acre, but seed is quite expensive.

 

[farmerm]

a fair number of folks seem to have rec the last full payment today . how many have worked out how they are going to replace that amount after costs and what are they /we/us thinking of doing

I am working on the premise that the older partners might meet their end before the BPS payment...

 

[farmerm]

I think there’s a few options, like arable reversion, herb rich leys etc.
2 yr legume fallow is £211 acre, but seed is quite expensive.

You think seed is expensive now.... just wait until we all want it....

 

[DrWazzock]

Spoke to my old neighbour about the changes today. He said he's just going to keep doing what he's doing till somebody comes round and tells him to stop. Its a formula that has served him well so far.

 

[gone up the hill]

Also another question :

They are talking about paying out a lump sum but will that only be for people that retire from the industry or for people who want to carry on farming but happy to take the one large lump sum and not claim in future years??

 

[Mixedupfarmer]

I can see the possibility that existing new entrants, and tenant farmers (many who have entered the industry over recent years), particularly on FBT's, could be pushed out of the industry first with the loss of BPS so quickly, and in practice little to replace it financially, which doesn't seem to meet the objectives of encouraging new entrants into the industry?

 

[Johnnyboxer]

What are the % reductions for the BPS for 2021/22/23 years?

Are they still going to pay some of the BPS from 2024 to and including 2027?

Can you still apply for Mid/ Higher Tier next year for a start date in early 2022?

Rates are published in the first few posts of this thread, plus all the rules that you require

Have you not read the policy document and guidance booklet yet?

 

[B'o'B]

Also another question :

They are talking about paying out a lump sum but will that only be for people that retire from the industry or for people who want to carry on farming but happy to take the one large lump sum and not claim in future years??

Conditional on leaving the industry.

 

[gone up the hill]

Rates are published in the first few posts of this threa, plus all the rules that you require

Have you not read the policy document and guidance booklet yet?

No

There is 49 pages of waffle and more waffle and just one page that will tell us what they intend to do and life is far too short to waste reading all that drivel to come across that one page!

 

[farmerm]

Also another question :

They are talking about paying out a lump sum but will that only be for people that retire from the industry or for people who want to carry on farming but happy to take the one large lump sum and not claim in future years??

Payments from 2024 are to be delinked from land ownership so one can take the money as a lump and run or take the money as a lump and carry on or carry on and take the annual drip until it runs out 2027 though the finer details are not yet worked out and still in consultation....

 

[farmerm]

Conditional on leaving the industry.

not how I read it?

 

[gone up the hill]

Conditional on leaving the industry.

How do they police that thou?

You could for example now claim in your own name, claim the one lump sum and then start up a business in another name and carry on claiming..

 

[B'o'B]

How do they police that thou?

You could for example now claim in your own name, claim the one lump sum and then start up a business in another name and carry on claiming..

How are you going to carry on claiming with no entitlements?

 

[gone up the hill]

Payments from 2024 are to be delinked from land ownership so one can take the money as a lump and run or take the money as a lump and carry on or carry on and take the annual drip until it runs out 2027 though the finer details are not yet worked out and still in consultation....

Only problem would be is that the small print ( but added after you take the lump sum ) might say if you claim the lump sum before 2027 you are excluded from claiming under the new ELMS scheme if it ever happens.

 

[gone up the hill]

How are you going to carry on claiming with no entitlements?

Buy them.

 

[DRC]

Buy them.

But there won’t be need for any entitlements after 2027.