Getting concerned

DRC

Member
Can't make my mind up to be honest. I will need 5 good drying days to even attempt direct drilling. And as said, it's what happens weatherwise after drilling that has just as much effect. So really a 10 day window needed and a calm dry leaf day to spray it off and slug pellet pre-drilling. We need a blocking high pressure system to settle in and we could do somthing. I don't like ordering seed without having some certainty that I can drill it. We carry all the risk as usual but C'est la vie.

Ploughing might work but it will still need time to dry off the surface a bit before ploughing then it will have to weather and dry a bit after ploughing. Won't combi straight in. Then if it rains heavily after ploughing it's game over till spring. If it rains heavily after ploughing and drilling some considerable patches will turn to slop, run together and drown. Ploughed and drilled land won't travel well here either. Spraying it would be a nightmare. Then there are the slugs.

Direct drilling is the least damaging and least expensive, least time consuming option if it fails. Ploughing could either be very good or a disaster. It's expensive and high risk here and has the potential to do more damage than a quick rush over with the direct drill

That's why I am going to do one field ploughed, the other direct drilled, but it does need to dry up a bit for either to stand a chance.

Then I also need to start harvesting beet. When does the factory close? March, I hope.
If it dries up enough to plough my remaining fields, I would definitely do it and hopefully frosts and weathering will turn it into a seedbed by the spring
 

Renaultman

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Darlington
Thought I ought to report in, when I started this thread some 6 weeks ago it was partly in jest although I was slightly concerned as we prefer a dryish autumn, on the 22nd Sept we were set up well, nearly all the ground was trioed, fields which were a bit tough had been cultipressed and with some weather on them we would of had perfect seedbed conditions for this land,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, but,,,,,,,,,,,,, we have passed 9 inches of rainfall since mid Sept and will more than likely go past the 10 inch rainfall later today , having watched and contributed to various threads on here it is very interesting to see how certain parts of the country have missed some of the major rainfall events and have managed to get some crops in. It always makes me chuckle when I look at posts and folks say that they have been drilling on some very heavy clay yet they are drilling straight behind the plough, yes it's ploughing up shiny but probably because of the traffic it has endured.
As always, you wonder if another system would have worked, I have seen a couple of weaving gd drills working but on the very best land in the area, does not look pretty but time will tell.
We still have nothing planted and to be honest I'm glad I haven't as they would struggle with this amount of water about on this land.
Saving grace for us is that we have had a good harvest, we have more in the grain stores from this harvest than 2012 / 2013 combined., we also had a good harvest last year which other areas didn't.
I'm certainly glad I planted 7 acres of linseed for seed , I have at least got the option of planting a crop cheaply ,
So yes I am concerned,, I have divorce proceedings against me, parents with health issues and over the next few years I will see some big changes in my life but I always look forwards to the future
 

Renaultman

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Darlington
Yes, when this thread started the concensus was it would buck up. It hasn't. It has got worse.

What's been interesting to me has been the comparison to other years. And more noticeably just how many "bad" years we have had in the last 25 years. It's looking like a bad year at least every five years, often followed by a poor one. And "good" years like last year having poor prices. The number of years that have decent cash outputs where both good yields and prices happen at the same time are not often enough to make a good average.

Not wanting to set us up for a dull winter, but are you all aiming for a spring crop when there will be huge oversupply, or a fallow, and how does that square with paying the rent or bank manager? The latter is due on Tuesday and I'm inclined to suggest that the only income will be bps and stewardship.
I was beginning to wonder if you were some kind of prophet and my reply at FFS it's only the beginning of November doesn't sound as good as my first on this thread. Good luck with your other problems. If all else fails you could maybe take up soothsaying?
 

teslacoils

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lincolnshire
The river Rase (I think) that runs along the roadside there looks very high in that area as if it's blocked or backing up for some reason, which can't be helping the drainage in that area. The fields around it look waterlogged. Maybe it's a water vole hotspot!

Maybe stops the water flooding Brigg?
I was beginning to wonder if you were some kind of prophet and my reply at FFS it's only the beginning of November doesn't sound as good as my first on this thread. Good luck with your other problems. If all else fails you could maybe take up soothsaying?

Then I'd have both the world's smallest violin playing the saddest song, and the world's crappiest crystal ball making the shittest predictions.
 

Hindsight

Member
Location
Lincolnshire
Sorry, but look at that soil.

Yes. I noted the amount of free chalk on the surface and also that the poster has Berkshire as his location and am assuming it is the chalk Chilterns.
The three main reasons people haven’t been able to get on in this wet autumn are some, one, or all of the following:

1. People who have bloody great big heavy kit who are set up to go for max acres per day, but instead they’re unable to move.

2. People who have cultivated behind the combine.

3. People who’ve gone down the DD route but with overly complicated six figure drills that have been developed during the last few dusty and easy autumns.

I’ve been on drilling last week and got another 200 acres in for other farmers on heavy land that hasn’t been moved until the drill went in the field. It went in well. That’s 1100 acres drilled so far. Heavy land is not a reason not to be drilling in a damp year if the soil has been left well alone post-harvest and the overall structure is good.

I’ve watched people in the last month wait to get their cultivated soil to a moisture level that they’re happy to work it in front of the drill, and then get rained off yet again after they’ve done yet another pass, and I can fully understand their frustration.

Unmoved ground drills at least 75% sooner than moved ground, and it’s largely the awkward timing of the rain in October that caused the problems and not just the volume.

I’ve learned that my choice of system in 2015 has been a lucky one for me this year, and whilst there’s no right or wrong way, one thing for sure is that when it comes to working with the soil, sometimes less really is more.

It’s not all good though. Unable to get aphicide on is a worry, especially with the mild weather we’ve had.

View attachment 841608

Hi great crops. Well done.

Fourth reason up here is delayed sowing for blackgrass reasons.

And a comment, I note the amount of free chalk on the surface and also that Berkshire is your location and thus am assuming you are on the chalk Chilterns. If so may I suggest bit different to some Ragdale / Denchworth or Wallasea series soils up here in Lincolnshire. The Elmton series Lincs limestone soils have been drilled, as probably nearest to yours. Another problem this past 35 days has not only been exceptional amount of near 200mm rain but that it has rained nearly every day. If that quantity of rain had fallen split with 8 dry days after then more would have been sown here on heavier soils. All pretty awful but good for you.

Note your concern about aphids - I assume you sowed around October 1st - use the AHB aphid model - link below

https://ahdb.org.uk/bydv

Using High Wycombe met station and Oct 10 emergence date Tsum 170 has oonly just been reached, so there is all of November I would suggest to treat satisfactorily, assuming any aphids in the crop, and that they carry BYDV.

Hey ho. Cheers.
 

Hindsight

Member
Location
Lincolnshire
The river Rase (I think) that runs along the roadside there looks very high in that area as if it's blocked or backing up for some reason, which can't be helping the drainage in that area. The fields around it look waterlogged. Maybe it's a water vole hotspot!

C/mon Dr. W those voles may irritate you but they are not responsible for the saturated state of land locally. Give them a break. Appreciate every farmer will be demanding the EA straighten , widen and canalise every brook and beck in Lincolnshire after this. But the reality is it is just an exceptional period of weather. But maybe it is not that exceptional if occurs every 10 years or so. Hey ho.
 

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
many years ago, when we had ploughed ground, unable to work as sodden, mid nov , spread 2 cwt seed wheat an acre, with our vicon fert spinner, very rough harrow afterwards, thought my old man was mad, but he quoted old saying,, you can sow wheat in mud. To my surprise, yielded 3 1/2 ton, never done it since. Soil would have been brashy, but it was wet.
 

bankrupt

Member
Location
EX17/20
many years ago, when we had ploughed ground, unable to work as sodden, mid nov , spread 2 cwt seed wheat an acre, with our vicon fert spinner, very rough harrow afterwards, thought my old man was mad, but he quoted old saying,, you can sow wheat in mud. To my surprise, yielded 3 1/2 ton, never done it since. Soil would have been brashy, but it was wet.

:D:D

Those were certainly the days, som farmer.


Vari-spreader, Maris Huntsman, 3 1/2 ton @ £600 (in today's money).

Hardly any chemistry to pay for, AN same price per ton as barley and negative depreciation on all one's m/cs because they appreciated in (nominal) value every year..

:angelic:
 
Last edited:

turbo

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
lincs
C/mon Dr. W those voles may irritate you but they are not responsible for the saturated state of land locally. Give them a break. Appreciate every farmer will be demanding the EA straighten , widen and canalise every brook and beck in Lincolnshire after this. But the reality is it is just an exceptional period of weather. But maybe it is not that exceptional if occurs every 10 years or so. Hey ho.
All they need to do is clean the rivers out,they were designed to carry water away not to be wildlife corridors. The ea river that runs through my land hasn’t been dredged for about 40 years and has about 5 foot of rubbish in the bottom so much so that during the dry weather last summer they had to oxygenate the water because all the fish were dying
 

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
:D:D

Those were certainly the days, som farmer.


Vari-spreader, Maris Huntsman, 3 1/2 ton @ £600 (in today's money).

Hardly any chemistry to pay for, AN same price per ton as barley and negative depreciation on all one's m/cs because they appreciated in (nominal) value every year..

:angelic:
perhaps we have gone wrong somewhere along the line, we used to make really good profits then. Can't remember what sprays we used, I reckon we only went through once, might have been twice. I can remember the f'ing couch, todays younger farmers probably haven't seen couch, but if round-up banned, it may be interesting to see how they cope with it >
 

bankrupt

Member
Location
EX17/20
todays younger farmers probably haven't seen couch, but if round-up banned, it may be interesting to see how they cope with it >

Funnily enough, som farmer, we had more couch about this autumn than for forty years or so, due to the prolonged drought in 2018 making routine control ineffective.

Hopefully, that's all been fixed now - if not they'll be another chance in the spring - worst couch this time was in the half-a-dozen wettest fields now abandoned until then.
 
Last edited:

DrWazzock

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lincolnshire
All they need to do is clean the rivers out,they were designed to carry water away not to be wildlife corridors. The ea river that runs through my land hasn’t been dredged for about 40 years and has about 5 foot of rubbish in the bottom so much so that during the dry weather last summer they had to oxygenate the water because all the fish were dying

That's what I was alluding to. I can understand river and tributary levels rising temporarily after one of these deluges but some here seem to have been stuck at high level for quite a long time now. When the watercourse level is only about 18" below field surface you have a hell of job draining your land, however good your drains are. I think the EA (or whoever it is now) could do more to be honest, though its easy to comment from an armchair. We do pay a drainage rate here.
 

Hindsight

Member
Location
Lincolnshire
All they need to do is clean the rivers out,they were designed to carry water away not to be wildlife corridors. The ea river that runs through my land hasn’t been dredged for about 40 years and has about 5 foot of rubbish in the bottom so much so that during the dry weather last summer they had to oxygenate the water because all the fish were dying

Here have measured 200 mm including the 20mm yesterday in period 23 September to November 3rd. And in those 40 days only had 9 days without some rain falling. Those 40 days coinciding with the exact period for sowing autumn cereals. Local long term annual average rainfall is 580mm. So a third of the annual average rainfall in 40 days bang when want to sow winter wheat and barley.

While some river drainage maintenance possibly due any amount of dredging would not have prevented soil saturation on clay soils with the exceptional amounts and periodicity of rainfall in South Lincolnshire in the past 40 days.
 

Hindsight

Member
Location
Lincolnshire
That's what I was alluding to. I can understand river and tributary levels rising temporarily after one of these deluges but some here seem to have been stuck at high level for quite a long time now. When the watercourse level is only about 18" below field surface you have a hell of job draining your land, however good your drains are. I think the EA (or whoever it is now) could do more to be honest, though its easy to comment from an armchair. We do pay a drainage rate here.

But these 'temporary' deluges now total one third of the local annual rainfall in a 40 days period. Following exceptionally 150mm in June, a dry July and then 100mm in August (forgotten the delayed harvest threads on here?). And then a fortunately dry period for end August and first three weeks September. So since June 10th I have measured nigh on 480 mm rain which is almost the annual rainfall. But am sure widescale dredging and river widening will solve the saturated soils. Hey ho.
 

Wombat

Member
BASIS
Location
East yorks
But these 'temporary' deluges now total one third of the local annual rainfall in a 40 days period. Following exceptionally 150mm in June, a dry July and then 100mm in August (forgotten the delayed harvest threads on here?). And then a fortunately dry period for end August and first three weeks September. So since June 10th I have measured nigh on 480 mm rain which is almost the annual rainfall. But am sure widescale dredging and river widening will solve the saturated soils. Hey ho.

We have had 233mm with 2 days without any rainfall since the 23rd sept but I have spent the last 2 yrs cleaning all our ditches and making sure every drain outfall is ok plus putting 6” pipe into the worst areas. We farm snotty flat high mg clays and it’s wet but I am very surprised how well it’s taken it. If we had got 3 more dry days over this weekend most of it would have gone.
 

radar

Member
Mixed Farmer
That's what I was alluding to. I can understand river and tributary levels rising temporarily after one of these deluges but some here seem to have been stuck at high level for quite a long time now. When the watercourse level is only about 18" below field surface you have a hell of job draining your land, however good your drains are. I think the EA (or whoever it is now) could do more to be honest, though its easy to comment from an armchair. We do pay a drainage rate here.
Where they do weed the bottoms out it does annoy me that they pull the weed up and block the drain outfalls!
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

  • 0 %

    Votes: 81 42.2%
  • Up to 25%

    Votes: 68 35.4%
  • 25-50%

    Votes: 30 15.6%
  • 50-75%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 75-100%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 100% I’ve had enough of farming!

    Votes: 7 3.6%

Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

  • 1,294
  • 1
As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
Top