Getting problem cows in calf

[William Mellor]

ive got around 3 or 4 cows that are causing issues getting back in calf, vary from 3-6 months since they last calved one is a 1st calf heifer that had a caesarean. I ai everything and aren’t particularly difficult to serve, I’ve got no intentions of trying to breed replacements off these cows but trying for a “more bums in the seat” approach and just want them in calf. If I get a cow that’s causing issues as such to back in calf I serve them to fertility plus beef, maybe twice, once at 12 hours after standing then again 12 hours later but these still haven’t held in calf. Was talking to another farmer recently and he said about Welsh Black semen being some off the best at getting cows incalf has anyone else heard this??
The other thing I was thinking is maybe an ov-sync programme, maybe something simple like the one my vet uses a lot on other farms which is ovaraline, then ovaraline again 7 days later, then estrumate 7 days later, ovaraline 2 days later, then serve the following day.
Any other thoughts? Would rather get these cows in calf as although I don’t want the breed of them they are good milkers, one is doing over 40 litres and the other are doing near 30 and seem to good the let go barren.

 

[Rossymons]

Synch programmes don't get poor breeders incalf. What they do do however is get them cycling at a time to suit you. So if you're struggling to get them incalf now through conventional heat detection and AI then a synch programme won't improve that.

From personal experience I doubt you will get your 1st calver pregnant again. Looking through our herd there's a clear trend between problem free calving and subsequent fertility.

If they are yielding as you say then they aren't harming anyone so keep them going. But the longer it takes to get them incalf the longer the dry period. So what is a decent lactation now needs to be measured against how many days she isn't producing. A 10k cow is useless if her lactation is 18 months.

 

[Spear]

Had one old cow was a bit of a pet. Decided not to get her in calf again as udder was to big and low so just kept milking her......6 years.....and up until the last 2 months before we lost her when she slipped and hurt herself she was still giving 30+ litres a day.

Sometimes just milking them on is more profitable than trying to get them in calf

 

[borderterribles]

ive got around 3 or 4 cows that are causing issues getting back in calf, vary from 3-6 months since they last calved one is a 1st calf heifer that had a caesarean. I ai everything and aren’t particularly difficult to serve, I’ve got no intentions of trying to breed replacements off these cows but trying for a “more bums in the seat” approach and just want them in calf. If I get a cow that’s causing issues as such to back in calf I serve them to fertility plus beef, maybe twice, once at 12 hours after standing then again 12 hours later but these still haven’t held in calf. Was talking to another farmer recently and he said about Welsh Black semen being some off the best at getting cows incalf has anyone else heard this??
The other thing I was thinking is maybe an ov-sync programme, maybe something simple like the one my vet uses a lot on other farms which is ovaraline, then ovaraline again 7 days later, then estrumate 7 days later, ovaraline 2 days later, then serve the following day.
Any other thoughts? Would rather get these cows in calf as although I don’t want the breed of them they are good milkers, one is doing over 40 litres and the other are doing near 30 and seem to good the let go barren.

When I was milking in Staffordshire, it was pretty widely believed there that a Welsh Black would get in calf some cows that others wouldn't. I tried it, and found it worked, but after having the Vet to calve( or to be more accurate, cut out) two out of three of them, I wished I hadn't done it

 

[farmer JD]

Just put a stock bull on them

 

[mixed farm]

What's a welsh black? Similar to an Aberdeen Angus or a British blue ?

 

[mixed farm]

Oh and omega fish minerals apparently work.

 

[Happy hillbily]

Yes welsh black works here, if they dont stand to fertility plus, its welsh black or down the road. Using Bedwyr from genus, cant say i have had any difficult calvings off him (he says touching a large piece of wood !)

 

[William Mellor]

When I was milking in Staffordshire, it was pretty widely believed there that a Welsh Black would get in calf some cows that others wouldn't. I tried it, and found it worked, but after having the Vet to calve( or to be more accurate, cut out) two out of three of them, I wished I hadn't done it

Was told Welsh black was easy calving, obviously not

Just put a stock bull on them

dont have one although it has crossed my mind but not really worth it for just 3 or 4 tho

Synch programmes don't get poor breeders incalf. What they do do however is get them cycling at a time to suit you. So if you're struggling to get them incalf now through conventional heat detection and AI then a synch programme won't improve that.

From personal experience I doubt you will get your 1st calver pregnant again. Looking through our herd there's a clear trend between problem free calving and subsequent fertility.

If they are yielding as you say then they aren't harming anyone so keep them going. But the longer it takes to get them incalf the longer the dry period. So what is a decent lactation now needs to be measured against how many days she isn't producing. A 10k cow is useless if her lactation is 18 months.

Never synced before so thanks for the advance wasn’t sure how a sync program worked really

 

[Sid]

Murray Grey was another AI mans favourite to get them in calf.

Obvious question. Has the vet checked them? Are they clean inside?

 

[William Mellor]

Murray Grey was another AI mans favourite to get them in calf.

Obvious question. Has the vet checked them? Are they clean inside?

Yes scanned by vet, asked him what I could be doing to get them in calf and he suggested an ov-sync program would increase my chances but he also said I could be wasting my money

 

[Sid]

Yes scanned by vet, asked him what I could be doing to get them in calf and he suggested an ov-sync program would increase my chances but he also said I could be wasting my money

My vet has mentioned Embryos before for the odd cow. Maybe worth an ask?

 

[William Mellor]

I wonder why if Welsh black and Murray grey are so good fertility wise why they haven’t been put in any fertility plus mixes?

 

[dinderleat]

If they are over 250dim get rid you will only get issues at next calving

 

[AGN76]

As @Happy hillbily has already said it's well known around here to try Welsh Black on problem cows.
It won't be in fertility plus due to the poor calf value I'm guessing.
Fertility plus Native (3 Angus) is doing a job on one farm I know of.

 

[Holsteinfriesian90]

As @Happy hillbily has already said it's well known around here to try Welsh Black on problem cows.
It won't be in fertility plus due to the poor calf value I'm guessing.
Fertility plus Native (3 Angus) is doing a job on one farm I know of.

Fertility plus native has worked well here on stopping problem cows as well.

 

[HasthorpeGrange]

Genus guy said welsh black to me or jersey apparently
But from experience if they have got to this stage just milk them until they don't cover there costs

 

[William Mellor]

Ordered 20 straws of Welsh black so giving it ago

 

[sidjon]

On the our other farm dad would use Murray greys as stoppers and seem to work well, only problem was they were worth bugger all as calves or store cattle, (did milk 2 for a couple of years and were okish)

 

[countryman765]

Used to say Welsh black sticks like sh!t to a blanket!. Have used it in the past. We now use a hereford ai bull solpol Kyle. He was in a mix we were using with an Aberdeen Angus but didn't get any Angus calves. We also double up sometimes on straws so will give a cow fertility plus and a straw of hereford