Going to have a Swale of a time! (I hope)

[livestock 1]

Didn’t try the Maize this time

 

[unlacedgecko]

View attachment 1036246

What's your farm details? Height? Acreage? Stocking level? Rough location?

 

[livestock 1]

What's your farm details? Height? Acreage? Stocking level? Rough location?

There’s a few farms. Need a big area to achieve anything

 

[unlacedgecko]

There’s a few farms. Need a big area to achieve anything

Ah land baron eh? Hill farming's answer to @Bossfarmer

 

[livestock 1]

Ah land baron eh? Hill farming's answer to @Bossfarmer

Well me and Barclays Bank I suppose yes!

 

[CopperBeech]

Buying feed and fertiliser is a perfectly sound business decision if it is costed properly against the alternatives, renting more land being the obvious one. It's usually cheaper to buy feed than acres. The way rents for eatage have gone up this year it probably still is. I think on these types of farms which need these inputs you will see a move towards better quality stock because it costs the same to feed a good one as an average one. It's already happening I think, because the quality of stock certainly in northern marts seems to get better every year.

Quality or profitability ? That’s the interesting question.

 

[livestock 1]

Quality or profitability ? That’s the interesting question.

If you don’t sell quality how far are you going to be discounted or can you even sell it?

 

[CopperBeech]

If you don’t sell quality how far are you going to be discounted or can you even sell it?

Sorry think you missed my angle. For example a 3/4 beltex 1/4 texel lamb will be a better ‘quality’ of lamb to many compared to my exlana lamb. But that wouldn’t necessarily mean it’s a lamb which returns the higher profit.

 

[CopperBeech]

On that note I made a fortune after brexit on sh!t runty hill lambs. Bought 40k worth of them before brexit vote and they went up 3-4 times in value after

 

[livestock 1]

Sorry think you missed my angle. For example a 3/4 beltex 1/4 texel lamb will be a better ‘quality’ of lamb to many compared to my exlana lamb. But that wouldn’t necessarily mean it’s a lamb which returns the higher profit.

Well he might mean that the feed for my mule hoggs which made £105/£115 costs the same as the feed for his Beltex x at £140/£160
That sort of thing?

 

[will6910]

If you decided to buy feed and or fert it doesn’t mean you have to ‘prop up a few second rate ewes’ as you put it, that’s more of a management decision on your sheep enterprise than anything else.
We’ve improved acres of rough poor grazing to good grass with tsp 20/10/10 25/5/5 mag lime and the rest. Some of our grazing land bears no resemblance to what’s over the wall and carries up to three times the stock. A bit of cost initially then just a top up of near 1 cwt acre of fert usually 25/5/5 s as a maintenance.
This may look like expensive but it’s cheaper than renting or buying more land which I’ve done both of in the past. The grass that grows on this improved land does stock much better than the rubbish belly fill that we have on our unimproved land. I don’t swallow your ‘addicted to fert’ story because even land initially improved then missed out on annual maintenance still way out performs the rest on the basis of what type of grass grows.
Fields which have had hoppers in are growing grass like mad now and have had no fert on as yet. Dark green thick mat growing fast. We put a small amount of Yara Stockbooster with Selinium on in March on some grazing ground, on these areas we have had no black quarter but suffered it on the unfertilised lots. East wind has blown cold for weeks. Also the lambs on the fertilised land are doing better than the unfertilised land.
As I said feed and fert are there to help farming economics it just depends how much you buy as to wether it helps profit margins or not and if what’s using it is worth feeding

Have to say I agree with fert and feed issues. I’d be lost without feed definitely with the way I have my set up

 

[Estate fencing.]

View attachment 1036243

The principles of grazing management apply at all heights

I’m with the comment “for how many days”.

 

[livestock 1]

I’m with the comment “for how many days”.

Angus cattle

 

[Estate fencing.]

Angus cattle

It’s bull shite, how could anyone stock that for 12 months.

 

[unlacedgecko]

It’s bull shite, how could anyone stock that for 12 months.

I don't think there's a suggestion it's for 12 months.

 

[livestock 1]

I don't think there's a suggestion it's for 12 months.

So it’s bullshite anyhow typical FW bollix

 

[Estate fencing.]

Oh and I can spot the creep feeder, naughty naughty.

 

[Top Tip.]

It’s bull shite, how could anyone stock that for 12 months.

It does make a difference when the grass doesn’t start growing till the middle of May in a good year and June in a bad one. I have a friend who went all out on rotational grazing but has now gone back to set stocking as he felt the rotational grazing compromised lamb growth rates too much. When I hear the conversations about these grazing systems it is always about the amount of grass they can grow very rarely about the stock. I’ve rotationaly grazed for the last 40 years but it was always to maximise stock performance.

 

[Estate fencing.]

For 14 weeks in the middle of winter I had 450 ewes on 8 acres at 1100 feet, look how good I am at farming. I won’t mention i was grazing beet though.

 

[Aspiring Peasants]

Quality or profitability ? That’s the interesting question.

The point I'm trying to make is that a lot of upland farms to have any chance of being profitable have to buy more inputs than more fertile lowland ground. If you have those higher costs then going for higher output is the only strategy that has a chance of working. These sorts of farms don't have the options there are in other areas so they are much more difficult to farm. This is why a lot of quality stock come out of the hills and the people who produce them work very hard at it. I think that after a period of pain things will come good again, producing store and breeding stock from upland farms and producing finished stock in the lowlands, is the most efficient overall way of producing food in this country and with a growing population, extreme weather and short sighted ignorant government policies it is going to be needed.

I'm old enough to have been working in the 1970's, (although still at school for part of the time ) when oil shot up, feed shot up and calves were virtually unsaleable. In fact the price collapse that happened then hasn't happened this time and I don't think it will. At that time the progressive way to survive was similar to now, low inputs, out winter, catch crops etc. It didn't last because for most parts of this country the weather and land type just isn't suitable so another way has to be found.