Helios Powerball

[steveR]

I was sent the link for this Company by a mate and I have to say, I am intrigued by the simplicity of the concept. Very neat and the ability to upsize the units or to use a bank of them to produce a meaningful output looks neat.

http://www.heliosaltas.com/index.php

From my looking, they should be able to be installed with minimum disruption to a small stream or river. I like the idea of having the unit in effect "floating" in a race or a water course and be able to cope with varying water levels easily.

 

[wasted years]

Looks simple, all comes down to cost versus output.

 

[steveR]

Oh I agree, and as it's American, the import cost will not be modest, but the simplicity is what appealed to me. Technology that can be installed and largely maintained by a farmer with basic skills. Heck even the leccy side if it is simply being used to charge batteries or feed an inverter!

 

[f0ster]

http://www.hydro-electric-barrel.com/

 

[Exfarmer]

This is only an undershot wheel and power outputs are very poor

 

[steveR]

This is only an undershot wheel and power outputs are very poor

But a very low cost and reliable system, needing low head and flow to produce. I agree power outputs are hardly exciting, but this is usually the case with with micro power systems. A couple of PV panels would be better for many purposes, but the hydro should keep going... It's all a case of having a mix IMO.

 

[steveR]

http://www.hydro-electric-barrel.com/

Thanks, neat! I wonder how far from the market it is though? I could see these working well in Wales or other areas with narrow streams. An interesting read, but the idea does not seem to have been taken on by a manufacturer...

Mmmm, I wonder what the blessed EA would make of these concepts??

 

[steveR]

http://www.hydro-electric-barrel.com/

I look again at the HEB,and I think that the easiest and cheapest way to make the "drum" would be to utilise blown plastic moulds as seen in 205l barrels! Then I wondered why not simply produce plastic vanes alone,and plastic weld them to an existing poly barrel? Cheap and cheerful... Stainless steel shaft through the middle, and fix a gennie off the one end and then put the whole lot in a simple frame that allows the barrel to "float" on the surface.. For rivers, it should be possible to suspend the unit from a bank, and even better two banks, with 2 or 3 units across a water course?

Too simple?

 

[Exfarmer]

To be any use you will need a very fast flowing stream, which indicates a good fall. A far better way would be to have small overshot wheel which gives far greater power. This can be done with little ingenuity.
For larger scale a screw turbine is very much more efficient.
This concept is just a marketing toy where the customer knows little of the physics

 

[Exfarmer]

I look again at the HEB,and I think that the easiest and cheapest way to make the "drum" would be to utilise blown plastic moulds as seen in 205l barrels! Then I wondered why not simply produce plastic vanes alone,and plastic weld them to an existing poly barrel? Cheap and cheerful... Stainless steel shaft through the middle, and fix a gennie off the one end and then put the whole lot in a simple frame that allows the barrel to "float" on the surface.. For rivers, it should be possible to suspend the unit from a bank, and even better two banks, with 2 or 3 units across a water course?

Too simple?

There are very few rivers where the flow is high enough to generate the power required to even turn these. If you note the minimum water speed required by this device is 4 mph , which is very fast flowing.many people look at the old fashioned water mills and ask why cant we replicate these. The biggest undershot wheel in Norfolk used to be on the Wensum near Norwich, it was estimated to generate 10 hp. Or 7.5 kw. This took the whole flow but I believe only had a fall of about 2 feet.
It was a major structure. You cannot defeat the laws of physics.
These devices will certainly charge phones and even run a TV but they will struggle to run a fridge.

 

[renewablejohn]

For a similar amount of water usage you could get a meaningful 10kw output rather than the 500w of this toy.

http://www.zotloeterer.com/welcome/gravitation-water-vortex-power-plants/

Nearly any farm with a stream could install one as its similar to a round water trough needing a fall of only 1.5 mtrs.

 

[steveR]

For a similar amount of water usage you could get a meaningful 10kw output rather than the 500w of this toy.

http://www.zotloeterer.com/welcome/gravitation-water-vortex-power-plants/

Nearly any farm with a stream could install one as its similar to a round water trough needing a fall of only 1.5 mtrs.

Good luck with the EA!!!

 

[renewablejohn]

Good luck with the EA!!!

That is the major stumbling block which is a shame as most farmers can muster a height difference of 1.5 mtrs on there streams and dykes.

 

[steveR]

That is the major stumbling block which is a shame as most farmers can muster a height difference of 1.5 mtrs on there streams and dykes.

I am sure there were moves being made to shake the EA up about these sort of stupid and overly complex buracratic blocks to small scale hydroplants...

 

[steveR]

To be any use you will need a very fast flowing stream, which indicates a good fall. A far better way would be to have small overshot wheel which gives far greater power. This can be done with little ingenuity.
For larger scale a screw turbine is very much more efficient.
This concept is just a marketing toy where the customer knows little of the physics

I don't disagree with what you say, I would argue that the minimal cost and infrastructure required for such a device has potential. Look at how the wind-up Radio transformed communities in 3rd world areas. Solar has come down enough to also be of use, but I recall listening to a program on R4 last year on the use of mobile phones, TV's and other low power devices in India and parts of Africa, where the biggest issue was charging batteries for the equipment. Our perspective is somewhat different to other parts of the world.

 

[renewablejohn]

I am sure there were moves being made to shake the EA up about these sort of stupid and overly complex buracratic blocks to small scale hydroplants...

As far as I am aware its all talk and no action. I have a couple of schemes here ready for the green light but the red tape has been holding me back.

 

[steveR]

As far as I am aware its all talk and no action. I have a couple of schemes here ready for the green light but the red tape has been holding me back.

Why is No One here surprised. There are one or two good Officers at the EA, but they are few and far between.... :-(

 

[f0ster]

even if were only producing a few hundred watts as long as it is 24/7 it mounts up,

 

[steveR]

even if were only producing a few hundred watts as long as it is 24/7 it mounts up,

Yep. Might be all someone needs...

 

[berisford]

I have got one,cant get video to upload,