Herbal Leys for Sheep

[Benr]

Thinking about putting in some GS4.
Looks a good option with the payment and cost of N. But where we would put it is only really suitable for sheep. How are you managing the 5 week period? Does it really need cutting after this as it will be way past its best for grazing? Also do we need to be careful with red clover content if tupping on it?

 

[Collie dog Sid]

I spoke to a sheep farmer who plans to mob graze with sheep after the 5 week period is over.

 

[Derrick Hughes]

Red clover content has to be 10 % or more , at that level I dont think it would have any effect on the sheep but you would need to judge it at mating
Biggest problems with herbal leys is weed control , need a clean field to start

 

[Tim W]

5 week rest is no problem here ---I've just grazed with a decent stocking rate
Red clover ----wouldn't worry about it if it's less than 20% cover & there are newer varieties i think that are less problematic

 

[Benr]

What would you recommend sowing for reasonably heavy ground which is productive but also deep rooting to help with drainage.
We have gone from PP, to spring barley to Italian Ryegrass so should be pretty clean by the time put in the herbal ley next year.

 

[Al R]

Just put another 16 acres of this undersown into oats, did it last year, will show pictures. I know it’s not GS4 standards but this is now going to be my standard reseed’s

 

[Al R]

This is the same mix as above but a few weeks ago, on 21 day grazing intervals.

 

[Frank-the-Wool]

We are going to try to make it into silage where it has got away during the 5 weeks.
It looks as if it will wilt down a lot so will not be as much bulk as it looks. Then we plan to wean lambs on to it.
Some that is less forward we may just top off high.

Weeds are not an issue if you let it get away in the first year as it smothers them. However feed quality is poor and is not much more than maintenance.
Once it is established in heavy land it seems to keep coming.

 

[Benr]

This is the same mix as above but a few weeks ago, on 21 day grazing intervals.

Have you put any fert on?

 

[Benr]

We are going to try to make it into silage where it has got away during the 5 weeks.
It looks as if it will wilt down a lot so will not be as much bulk as it looks. Then we plan to wean lambs on to it.
Some that is less forward we may just top off high.

Weeds are not an issue if you let it get away in the first year as it smothers them. However feed quality is poor and is not much more than maintenance.
Once it is established in heavy land it seems to keep coming.

After 5 weeks though would the feed quality be good still?

 

[Jerry]

Cutting next week plus a few days after 5 week break. Put in last autumn. Grazed post lambing.

Spot the deers ears for scale

 

[Frank-the-Wool]

After 5 weeks though would the feed quality be good still?

I think it will be as there is a high proportion of Clover.

 

[Derrick Hughes]

What would you recommend sowing for reasonably heavy ground which is productive but also deep rooting to help with drainage.
We have gone from PP, to spring barley to Italian Ryegrass so should be pretty clean by the time put in the herbal ley next year.

This is the mix Hurrells do fit for GS4
I don't claim on my own farm so slim it down





.28 Heavy Land Herbal Ley Grass Seed Mix (Acre Pack)

2.20 kg PARDUS Meadow Fescue

2.65 kg TODDINGTON Perennial Ryegrass Late Dip

1.85 kg COMER Timothy

1.00 kg LOFA Festulolium Hybrid

1.00 kg KORA Tall Fescue

0.20 kg Sweet Vernal Grass (ltd mix may change)

1.40 kg MERULA Red Clover

0.40 kg AURORA Alsike Clover

0.25 kg Yellow Blossom Clover

0.20 kg LEO Birdsfoot Trefoil

0.70 kg ALICE White Clover

0.40 kg MERLYN White Clover

1.00 kg CANDY Common Vetch

0.25 kg CHOICE Chicory

0.20 kg TONIC Plantain

0.10 kg Yarrow

0.10 kg Sheeps Parsley

0.10 kg Sheeps Burnet
14.00 kg per acre

 

[som farmer]

Just put another 16 acres of this undersown into oats, did it last year, will show pictures. I know it’s not GS4 standards but this is now going to be my standard reseed’sView attachment 1039291

to be honest, if anyone turned up to 'inspect' for sub purposes, they would have to be very experienced, to say it didn't meet the 'requirements', especially if you had a label from a 'proper' mix, to show !

 

[Al R]

Have you put any fert on?

No, that’s organic.

to be honest, if anyone turned up to 'inspect' for sub purposes, they would have to be very experienced, to say it didn't meet the 'requirements', especially if you had a label from a 'proper' mix, to show !

true! Mine arn’t put in for any benefit except for that is my new reseeding mix as opposed to a straight ryegrass/WC mix, hoping the chicory and plantain will bring more cobalt and other minerals up for sheep, add protein and also decrease the drought problems we have on such shallow soils. So far working well.
I know off topic but this is the same mix ley which has been set stocked at 7 twin ewes/acre since mid feb until now with a 4 day break every month to give it a few days break.

 

[som farmer]

No, that’s organic.



true! Mine arn’t put in for any benefit except for that is my new reseeding mix as opposed to a straight ryegrass/WC mix, hoping the chicory and plantain will bring more cobalt and other minerals up for sheep, add protein and also decrease the drought problems we have on such shallow soils. So far working well.
I know off topic but this is the same mix ley which has been set stocked at 7 twin ewes/acre since mid feb until now with a 4 day break every month to give it a few days break. View attachment 1039317

apparently, set stocking is not the best way to utilise these mixes, mob grazing is the answer, we rotationally graze ours, and not in a scheme, we use a simple mix.
But not sure anyone really knows, its all a bit new, or renewed. But anything that improves soil, reaches deeper minerals etc, has got to be good. We know our cows like them, and on a dry farm, those deeper rooted plants, have been a blessing here.

 

[Al R]

apparently, set stocking is not the best way to utilise these mixes, mob grazing is the answer, we rotationally graze ours, and not in a scheme, we use a simple mix.
But not sure anyone really knows, its all a bit new, or renewed. But anything that improves soil, reaches deeper minerals etc, has got to be good. We know our cows like them, and on a dry farm, those deeper rooted plants, have been a blessing here.

The threat is picking them out all together but I didn’t have any choice as it was graze it set stocked or sell them, since the rain in mid April they can’t keep up with it. The ley which has been set stocked looks a lot denser than the ley which is being grazed 3 days in 21 out.

 

[Agrivator]

Thinking about putting in some GS4.
Looks a good option with the payment and cost of N. But where we would put it is only really suitable for sheep. How are you managing the 5 week period? Does it really need cutting after this as it will be way past its best for grazing? Also do we need to be careful with red clover content if tupping on it?

The scare about red clover and its effect on fertility in sheep came from observations in NZ with older or unimproved varieties of Subterranean Clover.

I don't think there is any work from the UK which shows that red clover has a high enough oestrogen content to affect fertility.

For many years it was believed that barley and nitrogen were poisonous for sheep.

https://www.nrcs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_PLANTMATERIALS/publications/orpmcpg13327.pdf

 

[neilo]

Just put another 16 acres of this undersown into oats, did it last year, will show pictures. I know it’s not GS4 standards but this is now going to be my standard reseed’sView attachment 1039291

FYI, apparently there’s a new Welsh scheme due to be launched in June, paying us to plant such diverse mixes.
Whether it will pay as well as the English scheme (paying £370/ha?) for GS4 I don’t know, but there will be a huge uptake if it does I imagine.

 

[Estate fencing.]

I spoke to a sheep farmer who plans to mob graze with sheep after the 5 week period is over.

That's what I'm going to do with weaned ewes. I have 8 acres that has ewes and lambs on until this morning, I scalped it with the topper yesterday (the rye grass was all heading and swamping everything else) and let the ewes eat the toppings for a day, in 5 weeks I'm going to put 500 weaned ewes and mob graze across it for a couple of weeks.