How best to establish cover crops ?

[Clive]

Time vs quality I guess ?

At a time if year when harvest must take priority how can you practically get cover crops established in good time ?

Broadcast into standing crops pre harvest ?

Autocast at harvest ?

Drill direct ?

Seed of the back if a cultivator ?

What's your plan or what has worked well for you in the past ?

 

[dontknowanything]

It would be great to be able to put into the standing crop, but does it really work?

I direct drill, good thing about cover crops is that the low seed rates means no/little filling up.

If you get an early start (say 7am) you could probably get in 20ha before combing starts - assuming you don't have to do combine maintenance, drying etc.

Frederic Thomas did say though that it was best with a tine drill.

 

[Feldspar]

What is the thinking about applying nitrogen to cover crops? Any positive experiences? I remember Kentish Andy's cover crops recieved 30 kg/ha N and they looked very well.

An interesting thought would also whether it is more efficient to get N into a cash crop by fertilising the preceding cover crop or whether it would be better to fertilise the cash crop directly rather than the cover crop. One factor might be that N applied to a cover crop is more likely to be completely utilised becasue the cover crop will be growing quickly during the summer and hence will have higher N/day requirements. Less rainfall might reduce leaching but perhaps increased temperatures might also increase volatilisation? Not really sure.

 

[BSH]

I put some N on my experiment this autumn but it turned out t be a waste. I was persuaded that given the foul season we were having that it would elp the crop get going despite a lae sowing date. I retrospect it was a waste and I think that going forward my CC will have to go without N.

 

[Feldspar]

I put some N on my experiment this autumn but it turned out t be a waste. I was persuaded that given the foul season we were having that it would elp the crop get going despite a lae sowing date. I retrospect it was a waste and I think that going forward my CC will have to go without N.

A few questions:

What date did you plant the cover crop?
Did you broadcasat the fertiliser?
What type of N fertiliser did you use?
How long after planting did you apply the N?

TIA

 

[martian]

In 2011 we put a cwt of urea on a couple of fields as there was so much straw there and i thought it would help the soil to eat it (it did) and it helped the cover get off to a flying start (it was liquid iirr, post drilling). But the legumes in the mix will get lazy and not fix N if there's too much about. Last year we didn't apply any and from what BSH says, probably just as well...

 

[BSH]

Feldspar, I sent you a pm.

 

[155tm]

I did empty the fert spreader out on a small field of cover crop this autumn. Not very scientifically though! Put it on the worst side of the field. The cover has come more evenly across that field than other fields would suggest it would have done if the poorer area hadn't had any ammonium nitrate.

 

[Feldspar]

Feldspar, I sent you a pm.

Thanks for that.

 

[Andy Howard]

What is the thinking about applying nitrogen to cover crops? Any positive experiences? I remember Kentish Andy's cover crops recieved 30 kg/ha N and they looked very well.

An interesting thought would also whether it is more efficient to get N into a cash crop by fertilising the preceding cover crop or whether it would be better to fertilise the cash crop directly rather than the cover crop. One factor might be that N applied to a cover crop is more likely to be completely utilised becasue the cover crop will be growing quickly during the summer and hence will have higher N/day requirements. Less rainfall might reduce leaching but perhaps increased temperatures might also increase volatilisation? Not really sure.

Last year we put on 30kgs of N on covers. Comparing to other people who did not apply N it made a huge difference. I would say doubled the biomass at a guess. This year we did the same but probably did not get much of a response. We also did not get much response of autumn N on OSR. This year we had little rain until the 23rd of sept and then it did not stop and soils turned cold very quickly. Not a good response year. I still believe it is worth it. Next year I will be applying a starter with all covers. I think especially important with high amounts of straw. Next year could be different again. You only have to look at Frederic's presentations to see the difference a little N at planting makes in no-till.

 

[Feldspar]

Good advice, thanks.

 

[dontknowanything]

Last year we put on 30kgs of N on covers. Comparing to other people who did not apply N it made a huge difference. I would say doubled the biomass at a guess. This year we did the same but probably did not get much of a response. We also did not get much response of autumn N on OSR. This year we had little rain until the 23rd of sept and then it did not stop and soils turned cold very quickly. Not a good response year. I still believe it is worth it. Next year I will be applying a starter with all covers. I think especially important with high amounts of straw. Next year could be different again. You only have to look at Frederic's presentations to see the difference a little N at planting makes in no-till.

do you have many legumes in your covers?

 

[Andy Howard]

Last year we put on 30kgs of N on covers. Comparing to other people who did not apply N it made a huge difference. I would say doubled the biomass at a guess. This year we did the same but probably did not get much of a response. We also did not get much response of autumn N on OSR. This year we had little rain until the 23rd of sept and then it did not stop and soils turned cold very quickly. Not a good response year. I still believe it is worth it. Next year I will be applying a starter with all covers. I think especially important with high amounts of straw. Next year could be different again. You only have to look at Frederic's presentations to see the difference a little N at planting makes in no-till.

do you have many legumes in your covers?

Yes, vetches and peas. Soil tests last year showed 90kg of N left after cover so do not think the N hurt the legumes. They also nodulated well. Once using starter fert we will only be using 9kg of N. I think for now it is the right thing for us to do. Hopefully if our soil's nutrient cycling improves maybe we can do without it but all that straw makes it difficult.

 

[dontknowanything]

Hmmm, interesting. So the 30kg was broadcast, but you will do 9 through the drill?

 

[Andy Howard]

Hmmm, interesting. So the 30kg was broadcast, but you will do 9 through the drill?

That is thé plan

 

[martian]

The Americans are obsessive about their multi-species covers and hearing about how they have transformed their crops and soil, I'm not surprised. I reckon the only way we can guarantee a good cover crop in the UK is establishing them in the preceding crop (which is what a lot of them do). This can only mean broadcasting into winter wheat for instance, with a high lifted fertiliser spreader for instance. That way you could plant worthwhile covers in front of winter crops too...

 

[155tm]

You need to build one of these Martian.

http://agriculture-de-conservation.com/ ... -d-un.html

 

[Hartwig]

Nice setup, but useless as slugs will eat up everything in this part of the world. You need far more seed to outbalance the lower establishment rate than drilled in the ground. But if we could add some weeks growing season by pre-harvest seeding, it would be worth it ! Sadly I have never managed to get it growing here, even mixed with slug pellets, never found any growing plants there.

 

[shakerator]

Nice setup, but useless as slugs will eat up everything in this part of the world. You need far more seed to outbalance the lower establishment rate than drilled in the ground. But if we could add some weeks growing season by pre-harvest seeding, it would be worth it ! Sadly I have never managed to get it growing here, even mixed with slug pellets, never found any growing plants there.

have you tried broadcasting the seed in july?

i would have thought mustard would avoid the slugs at that stage?

 

[Jim Bullock]

We have tried broadcasting all sorts of cover-crop seeds into standing crops during July...I have to say with limited success...if there is sufficient moisture for germination ...then there are loads of slugs around just waiting for some new green growth to devour..do not forget you cannot apply slug pellets until after harvest... We are going to try a form of "Auto-casting" using one of our Delimbe seeders on the combine header (Only £2K ) which will enable us to put down seed and slug pellets at the same time...we plan to follow up with a rake pass + roll pass within two to three days.