How much to pay an arable farmer!

[michael N123]

Does he not want shite brought back and spread on his land if 3 crops of grass are going off it ?

 

[ollie989898]

Does he not want shite brought back and spread on his land if 3 crops of grass are going off it ?

He should although may have other plans, digestate etc.

 

[7610 super q]

Would have thought it needs to be down to grass for 5 years to do much good anyway. Longer time frame too, so nobody feels like they've been shafted.

 

[ollie989898]

Would have thought it needs to be down to grass for 5 years to do much good anyway. Longer time frame too, so nobody feels like they've been shafted.

To do that it sounds like both holdings would need to adopt an integrated 'whole farm' approach, which could work but would need a lot of trust and forethought. A lot of the livestock farms in my area could definitely do with having a portion of their farmed areas put into an arable crop and reseeded once every 5-7 years- it would drastically improve their grass output.

Just thinking of grass as a crop itself is beneficial.

 

[DRC]

No no, if the livestock farmer buys the seed he is tied in, and so is the arable man. Been down this lane before...

He said in the op that he was buying the seed , with the arable farmer doing the drilling . Which made it seem expensive to me for a year.

 

[Boysground]

Exactly what I'm thinking. First year is a means to get my foot in the door. Hopefully will lead to more.

I already get 5 multi cuts of silage on my brash - i don't tend to big myself up much but I can grow good grass, even on brash. I am looking at this arrangement to provide all my grass silage - i can then extend my grazing on the home farm and look to grow more high protein crops to supplement where needed.

That’s the best attitude. I have a couple of arable farmers growing maize for me. We don’t take any notice of all the “talk”of the value of the crop. The price is set for a long term arrangement not the highs or lows that seem to regularly occur. One chap has been growing for me for about 20 years so I think he’s happy. I am he consistently grows a cracking crop.

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[betweenthelines]

Zero tilled after a run of arable crops? How level will it be when you come to cut it?

Could be like driving over a hundred acre cattle grid!

Why doesn't he sow clover as a break crop? Then you could have some top quality forage while he gets a N boost for the next crop

 

[DRC]

Good many dairy farmers would pay £200/acre for ground that would produce three quality cuts ?‍

You’d think so, but not around here. Only seem interested in maize.
I’d happily do a 3 yr grass break for £200/acre

 

[Derrick Hughes]

He said in the op that he was buying the seed , with the arable farmer doing the drilling . Which made it seem expensive to me for a year.

Not sure on the price of Westerwolds ,around £30 acre I expect and if farmer drills himself it's nothing much really
I would think if the arable farmer can clear £70 acre over his costs he will be more than happy .his costs will me minimum

 

[dinderleat]

Well I have the spring barley straw, so if I clear it quickly he could get it established by say 3rd week August at latest. Id say by end of October there would be a decent bite there, and we are on dry brash so not going to sink out of sight.

Did it in 2018 after wheat, it’s certainly doable if the weather plays ball

 

[HarryB97]

Exactly what I'm thinking. First year is a means to get my foot in the door. Hopefully will lead to more.

I already get 5 multi cuts of silage on my brash - i don't tend to big myself up much but I can grow good grass, even on brash. I am looking at this arrangement to provide all my grass silage - i can then extend my grazing on the home farm and look to grow more high protein crops to supplement where needed.

Sounds like the ideal potential partnership then. That's very impressive grass yields I'll pm you for some grass growing advice!

 

[som farmer]

we have done 1 yr grass break crops, arable farmer, buys seed, fertilise for two cuts, anymore we can put on. Taking shite back in part exchange, fine in a good year, x3 cuts, but expensive, sowing fert side, done very properly. The grass break, was not giving him the result he expected, so the arrangement ended, he needed a 2 year break, but was not prepared to do that. To be honest, it was expensive, and we haven't really missed it, just cut cow numbers back, to compensate, that 30/40 acres. At the same time, we lost 50 acres, as that estate was sold, so a big rejig was on the cards anyway, the really interesting part, profit hasn't dropped much, at all, telling us, the extra work and hassle wasn't really worth it ! We have been offered land at £200 acre, and politely declined, simply isn't worth the extra work, money and hassle.

 

[neilo]

Zero tilled after a run of arable crops? How level will it be when you come to cut it?

Could be like driving over a hundred acre cattle grid!

Why doesn't he sow clover as a break crop? Then you could have some top quality forage while he gets a N boost for the next crop

Maybe the arable farmer doesn’t drag a plough through it every year, which is where the ‘cattle grid’ effect usually comes from ime?

 

[Derrick Hughes]

Westerwolds would cost in the region of £35/acre 15 kg acre

 

[yorkshire8]

If your paying for seed/feet and spray . I wouldn’t pay him anything. Rent on top you would be better off buying forage in when you need it . Plus he will benefit from it been in grass!

 

[Rob Holmes]

Maybe suggest the farmer put it into a mid tier GS4 Grass, legume and herbage mix for 2 years, RPA will pay him £309/ha/yr to grow it, benefits his soil much better than straight ryegrass and you get a better quality forage

 

[The sheep dipper man]

Neighbouring arable farmer has approached me about renting some land from him to grow Italian ryegrass instead of him growing OSR as a break. Would be about 100ac which will help me enormously as I am always tight for grass.

He would zero till the grass in behind spring barley at his cost. I would provide and pay for the seed and from there on in provide and apply all the fert and inputs required at my cost. All fine.

The grass will only be in for 1 year before being pulled out for wheat. So, in theory id vacate the land by September. Would like to think I'd get an autumn cut after establishing (if its a kind autumn), then 3 cuts the following year.

Whats this worth? I really want 2 years but he's keen on one to keep his rotation. I'd have to lean towards a westerwolds mix for the rapid and short term growth.

Anyone have a similar agreement and care to share experiences?!

What is his rotation?, we rotate our arable with grass lays and work on 2 years

 

[The sheep dipper man]

If your paying for seed/feet and spray . I wouldn’t pay him anything. Rent on top you would be better off buying forage in when you need it . Plus he will benefit from it been in grass!

I agree there!, sounds like he will gain all the benifits and you are taking a rist if it dosent establish well. Depending what lay you use you will be paying for and fixing N in the ground for him to use.

If there is one thing i have learnt that is a good grass lay is not cheap to establish!

 

[DRC]

Maybe suggest the farmer put it into a mid tier GS4 Grass, legume and herbage mix for 2 years, RPA will pay him £309/ha/yr to grow it, benefits his soil much better than straight ryegrass and you get a better quality forage

Will you get the yield with that, especially after a few years ( I think it’s a 5 yr option), with no fertiliser allowed ?

 

[Rob Holmes]

The GS4 offer is a 2 year option, P&K plus manure is allowed