If anyone is in doubt about the NHS

[ollie989898]

This.

Stories in press about nurses using food banks, care home staff living in laundry rooms for months on site to care for residents.

wife’s best friend is a gp on £100k/yr for a 3 day week. Absolutely no weekends ever.

soon as travel restrictions eased she was off to Lanzarote.

Phoned our gp surgery when one of the children wasn’t right. “Take them to A and E, we’re not seeing patients”

Not really fair.

The government allowed GP's to negotiate their contracts and agreed to the present situation. As it stands there is no obligation for any GP to do any out of hours work, no obligation to visit care homes to do consults, no obligation to do anything except weekday work (the bulk of GPs will work maximum of 4 days a week in practice). GPs (and consultants) in the UK I understand now earn more than their peers in any European country.

Out of hours work now tends to be done by GP's who work on a locum basis or on contract, I believe most of them are driven around in a specific car by a driver, too. I know of one guy who did it for years, doesn't actually live in the UK- he flew over to the UK for a month at a time, worked and then went back to his house abroad for a while until he came back to work for another month. Being non-UK resident of course he pays no tax here.

Some GPs have complained their lives are dull and lonely, and that is understandable given that they are not under any commitment to ever leave their office. I would have thought the out of hours bit and visiting schools, care homes or doing bits for sporting teams or the MOD or HMP would have added some variety to their vocation.

 

[TechWise]

I think we need reform of the NHS, however, if the Conservatives even mention the NHS, the media/labour have a major attack of the vapours, so politically only Labour could reform them (at present), however Labour could not manage a session in a brewery, so I recon we are stuffed. I have nothing but admiration for the staff, it is not the staff, but the system that is at fault, I am not happy with us "poaching" trained staff from third world countries either, don't they need them themselves? We can train our own.

Very true. I find it deeply troubling that the NHS - a state funded and run institution - has evolved into something that the state dare not try and change, lest they be lynched by the mainstream media. No organisation should be above critisism, god knows the Police take plenty of flak and have had many a change forced on them. If a police officer failed to act on intelligence regarding a threat to someone's life, there'd be an investigation, a public apology and they'd be struck off. When's the last time you heard of a GP being disciplined for sending someone with cancer home with paracetamol?

 

[ollie989898]

I know - drive past any retail park and the Big M/KFC et al, are rammed at any time of the day

And Costa!

 

[ollie989898]

Please cut GP services some slack. Primary care is the Cinderella of the NHS and is trying hard to manage a shitstorm. Their rules will be changing daily and now they are being expected to deliver the biggest ever vaccination programme during high Flu season and a lockdown.

Parts of secondary care are almost idling at present due to resources being diverted to Covid, others are stretched to breaking point.

You bring up an important point. Why are GP services being asked to deliver a vaccination program? They have far more important things to do than merely jab thousands of people twice. The army could be doing this in a drive through tent out in the road.

 

[ollie989898]

My daughter works in a large hospital, she did a stint in ITU, several of the patients were in their 30's, the thing is you have no idea how the virus is going to affect someone, over the age of thirty even with no pre existing conditions.
She has now gone back to her day job in the hospital, she covers all hospital wards, her case load has increased four-fold, she is stressed because she has to make decisions quickly that will affect whole families. She is completely knackered, and rings me in tears at least once a week.
And me, well I have gone to work when I could have stayed at home, trying to do a bit.
No we are not hero's, and thoughtless, 'aren't you wonderful', is not constructive, and I find patronising. What is far more important is that you keep out crowded spaces, wash your hands, and wear a fugging mask.

It's annoying that GP's some surgeries do not seem to want to see patients, but often they are small teams, they are older staff, and if one was to be long term sick they can not be replaced easily. There is also the problem that a lot of surgeries are not built for infection control purposes for large amounts of people. GP's are independently owned businesses, paid by the NHS, so they have to decide if they have the budget for changes.
I think the NHS will become more centrally controlled, there is a Russian doll of CCG's, and Trusts, the 'market' just created more paperwork. The good thing to come out of this is that there is now a standard online training programme, up to 18months ago Trusts did their own in house training, if you moved to another Trust you started again. There are about ten hours of mandatory training. You still have to apply for jobs and fill out full applications forms for jobs within the same Trust, I think this is for equality monitoring purposes, to extend your role to cover a new job, and it all takes time.

There are (were) plans to reform the NHS again following the implementation of the health and social care act- widely condemned by all when it was announced. There is to be a long term (10 year) plan for the NHS and the whole CCG thing is being scrapped. Several people have told me privately that the whole idea of CCGs being led by doctors was a mistake because each new service (which had to be bid for in a competitive process) had to answer not just a clinical case but a business case and not all doctors have the skills (or time) needed to run a business.

There will always be multiple induction and training programs across trusts; part of it is a governance/CYA process and also the IT systems and many many policies and protocols in use across each trust differ wildly between each other.

 

[Johnnyboxer]

And Costa!

Not from me

I take a flask everywhere

Boil kettle and job’s a good ‘un, takes about 3 mins to make a flask

Quicker than the fecking Costa queue and a darn sight cheaper

£3 for a poxy coffee there

 

[2wheels]

Farmers are in the wrong no job then, aren’t they ?

Take a single 2p spud wholesale ex farm

Turn it into jacket potato with a filling at £3.99, in a cafe

Who’s the mug?

Now I know the the £3.99 jacket spud with a filling, isn’t all profit

But in the difference that the punter pays @£3.99 and the 2p the farmer gets ex farm

The £3.97 difference, there’s a helluva lot of money between the 2 and a chance for the farmer to get some more of it perhaps

£3.99 for a jacket spud? more like £6.50-£7.50.you do get a bit of salad with it for that.

 

[Ffermer Bach]

Agreed and that's what I suggested higher in the thread. If someone is in hospital long term the last thing a family needs when visiting is worrying about parking

my aunt had a stroke, and was in Herford County Hospital, I took my mum to visit, I had to pay parking, and mum could not walk to the ward and back before it went to the next payment of £5.00 (it would take her half an hour to walk to the ward).

 

[Steevo]

£3.99 for a jacket spud? more like £6.50-£7.50.you do get a bit of salad with it for that.

Makes for a substantial meal at least!!

Speaking of which - 17p for an egg, wrap a bit of sausagemeat and a few breadcrumbs......

 

[puppet]

The government allowed GP's to negotiate their contracts and agreed to the present situation. As it stands there is no obligation for any GP to do any out of hours work, no obligation to visit care homes to do consults, no obligation to do anything except weekday work (the bulk of GPs will work maximum of 4 days a week in practice). GPs (and consultants) in the UK I understand now earn more than their peers in any European country.

Out of hours work now tends to be done by GP's who work on a locum basis or on contract, I believe most of them are driven around in a specific car by a driver, too. I know of one guy who did it for years, doesn't actually live in the UK- he flew over to the UK for a month at a time, worked and then went back to his house abroad for a while until he came back to work for another month. Being non-UK resident of course he pays no tax here.

Some GPs have complained their lives are dull and lonely, and that is understandable given that they are not under any commitment to ever leave their office. I would have thought the out of hours bit and visiting schools, care homes or doing bits for sporting teams or the MOD or HMP would have added some variety to their vocation.

A lot of GPs will still provide external work but I guess some of it has stopped. In rural areas they still cover care homes. The out-of-hours work was optional after 2004. Before that lots were doing over 70 hours a week and the younger docs just didn't want that.

You bring up an important point. Why are GP services being asked to deliver a vaccination program? They have far more important things to do than merely jab thousands of people twice. The army could be doing this in a drive through tent out in the road.

Ouf local practice used to do 800 flu jabs on a Saturday morning like a factory line

 

[honeyend]

I came here to post something very similar but I think you've put it quite well. The words in the OP could equally have applied to:

• Police - working as normal, wrestling with the same criminals up close and personal and getting their masks ripped off them.
• Prison Service - as above.
• Fire Service - working as normal, doing a dangerous job and going towards the danger while everyone else is sensibly running away.
• Social Work - ordered to continue home visits and check ups throughout the entirety of this pandemic. Only relatively recently issued with PPE.
• Armed Forces - seems the public at large has forgotten that our men and women are still out there in Afghanistan, Iraq and Syria but no one bats an eye because "it's what they signed up for"

Credit where credit's due but I think all this NHS-specific hero worship is a bit much. There's lots of people enduring great hardship right now and lots of people exposed to a great deal of risk. Let's try and remember them all.

Can I also add the check out staff, who have often had to cope with abuse, and then go home and do a shift of home responsibilities.
My poor lodger has lived like a monk all the way through, all I can say is thank god for internet games. His life is, eat, sleep repeat, his main contact is work, where he is in a bubble supervising tests for drugs.

 

[honeyend]

There are (were) plans to reform the NHS again following the implementation of the health and social care act- widely condemned by all when it was announced. There is to be a long term (10 year) plan for the NHS and the whole CCG thing is being scrapped. Several people have told me privately that the whole idea of CCGs being led by doctors was a mistake because each new service (which had to be bid for in a competitive process) had to answer not just a clinical case but a business case and not all doctors have the skills (or time) needed to run a business.

There will always be multiple induction and training programs across trusts; part of it is a governance/CYA process and also the IT systems and many many policies and protocols in use across each trust differ wildly between each other.

The basic mandatory should be the same, if it's provided through the NHS electronic staffing system, you would think governance would not be an issue. If you work in the NHS through an agency there is a basic mandatary training certificate, which most NHS hospitals accept.

CSTF Mandatory + Statutory Training for Healthcare Professionals

CSTF aligned Mandatory Training for Healthcare Professionals. CPD accredited nationwide training.

www.healthandsafetygroup.com

Having worked in few Trusts, some that cover the same area, the basics are the same. The equipment you use may be different, and depending on whether its paper or computor based, it may be recorded in different format, but if you are working to NICE guidelines, the skills are the same.
There is always empire building going on, the bigger the team you run of course the more you can lobby for resources.
There are a lot of beds being paid for in nursing homes, there are beds being paid for in privately run hospitals, to create capacity, so I think eventually it will become some sort of hybrid.

 

[Johnnyboxer]

£3.99 for a jacket spud? more like £6.50-£7.50.you do get a bit of salad with it for that.

I said cafe

£7?

More profit for the rest in the chain - the merchant & packer, the hauliers, the wholesaler and the eating establishments

 

[Sid]

When's the last time you heard of a GP being disciplined for sending

My Mums cousin had exactly that haopen to her twice! By the time she had been diagnosed with cancer it was too late.

As the builder said to the Doctor " its alright for you mate, everyone sees my mistakes, you bury yours!"

Not from me

I take a flask everywhere

Boil kettle and job’s a good ‘un, takes about 3 mins to make a flask

Quicker than the fecking Costa queue and a darn sight cheaper

£3 for a poxy coffee there

Was a meeting , coffee van pulls up ,puts his chimes going and people poured out of eveey office building in near vicinity for their Mocca, hazelnut, skinny,latte thingamy jiggy!

 

[Steevo]

As the builder said to the Doctor " its alright for you mate, everyone sees my mistakes, you bury yours!"

I've seen plenty of builders and other tradesmen bury their mistakes too! If you can't see it, it never happened.

 

[ollie989898]

I think we need reform of the NHS, however, if the Conservatives even mention the NHS, the media/labour have a major attack of the vapours, so politically only Labour could reform them (at present), however Labour could not manage a session in a brewery, so I recon we are stuffed. I have nothing but admiration for the staff, it is not the staff, but the system that is at fault, I am not happy with us "poaching" trained staff from third world countries either, don't they need them themselves? We can train our own.

I tend to agree about the NHS poaching staff from abroad, this is currently happening all over Europe, there was talk that the EU would stop the movement of healthcare professionals because a lot of German doctors were leaving Germany to practice in the UK and Scandinavia.

That said, I work under a number of African/Caribbean nurses and they are absolutely beyond excellent and have taught and supported me a great deal. It is hard to fathom but I would guess that they differ from British people in that it is very much part of their respective cultures to care for others and are very bright and supportive people by nature. If the NHS was prevented from recruiting from these areas, I think it would be doing itself a disservice in all honesty.

 

[Ffermer Bach]

I tend to agree about the NHS poaching staff from abroad, this is currently happening all over Europe, there was talk that the EU would stop the movement of healthcare professionals because a lot of German doctors were leaving Germany to practice in the UK and Scandinavia.

That said, I work under a number of African/Caribbean nurses and they are absolutely beyond excellent and have taught and supported me a great deal. It is hard to fathom but I would guess that they differ from British people in that it is very much part of their respective cultures to care for others and are very bright and supportive people by nature. If the NHS was prevented from recruiting from these areas, I think it would be doing itself a disservice in all honesty.

I agree, however, we are a very wealthy country (who happens to give a lot of aid to third world countries) and yet poaches their skilled staff, to me that is unconscionable that we impoverish poor countries because we can't be bothered to train our own staff, for the individual staff member it is great to get a higher paying job in the UK, but for the country that did the training it is a disaster.

 

[defender]

Doctors and drainers bury their mistakes

 

[honeyend]

Lets just hope they got a good deal, but when your stuffed...

'The directions were extended a week after HSJ revealed large private hospital providers were in advanced talks with NHS England over a new three-month outsourcing contract, which aims to provide a “smooth transition” to longer-term contracting arrangements.

Spire Healthcare Group, one of the large providers involved in the discussions, issued a statement yesterday confirming a new three deal had been struck.

The statement said: “Spire Healthcare, along with other independent providers, has now signed a contract with NHS England to provide a volume-based commitment aimed at reducing NHS waiting lists when the existing contract with NHS England (as varied on 13 August 2020) ends on 31 December 2020.

“This new contract aims to provide a smooth transition for NHS services in England from the current cost-based contract to the new NHS framework for purchasing additional activity from the independent sector. It also allows for the continuation of certain vital services not covered by the NHS framework until the end of January 2021 and ensures the safe repatriation of patients and services back to their NHS Trusts. The new contract has a definitive end date of 31 March 2021 and can be terminated before'

 

[britt]

Even before C-19 I had the greatest respect for the NHS, but just how do we show our appreciation? The occasional box of chocolates or cake seem totally inadequate.

Like a pension that those of us who are self employed would give our right arm for ?
My wife is a nurse, so I do know what it's like. But every job has its difficult times.