If you tell lies you'll get caught out eventually

Henarar

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Somerset
We aren’t registering any bull calves any more, that will be thick end of £1200 from us, we plan to still register females albeit more selectively.

I think there will be a lot in the same boat - makes you wonder where the job will be for pedigree beef, let’s face it, it’s difficult to see who will want the bulls in five years time the way the suckler job is.
Dairy farmers
 

Johngee

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Llandysul
We normally register around 20 limousin heifer calves from our commercial pedigree herd every year.

The decision has been taken to cease registering females.

The society will be losing £5-600 from us this year.

Sad but we’re not faffing with hair samples etc.,there’s enough work with everything else and it will be a cost saving.

But you only need to DNA test the heifers when they calve down, so fewer to do every year.
 
Do the same with replacement tags can they not ?

Replacement cattle eartags have to be the same number as the original now, don’t they? And DNA tissue tags are taken at birth, when the first tag goes in. Replacements wouldn’t alter the content of that first vial.
A DNA test would sort out any errors in parentage at that stage. And for us, has done. We registered one animal and the result came back as a non match. The cow had had AI but had taken the bull on the day the bull was sold!
And a Bazadaise also had a DNA check using the AI bull’s stored profile. And again it was a natural service bull that matched the calf’s ear tag sample.
 

neilo

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Montgomeryshire
As Bill says the cost has got too much.

We run commercial so probably should have binned registering years ago and saved a fortune.

This change has been the catalyst to take the decision not to register.

I would think there are plenty more that have been doing just the same, many of which will make the same decision now.
It’s all very well piling costs on with lofty aims, but those costs have to be recovered from the marketplace somehow.
 

juke

Member
Location
DURHAM
Replacement cattle eartags have to be the same number as the original now, don’t they? And DNA tissue tags are taken at birth, when the first tag goes in. Replacements wouldn’t alter the content of that first vial.
A DNA test would sort out any errors in parentage at that stage. And for us, has done. We registered one animal and the result came back as a non match. The cow had had AI but had taken the bull on the day the bull was sold!
And a Bazadaise also had a DNA check using the AI bull’s stored profile. And again it was a natural service bull that matched the calf’s ear tag sample.

They do have to be the same number yes ,
Still wouldn't stop a determined cheat there will be a way same as hair sampling .
We to have had a similar situation with an ai bull going over term and thinking it was the stock bulls calf .
Obviously there are lots of honest mistakes and they get rectified before sale , hopefully the case that started this thread is a one off job.
 
They do have to be the same number yes ,
Still wouldn't stop a determined cheat there will be a way same as hair sampling .
We to have had a similar situation with an ai bull going over term and thinking it was the stock bulls calf .
Obviously there are lots of honest mistakes and they get rectified before sale , hopefully the case that started this thread is a one off job.

In almost 50 years working with pedigree breeds, I am equally certain that this is not a one off job. I've seen too many such 'mistakes' in both dairy and beef parentage.
Tissue samples at birth, linked to an eartag and blood testing make it less easy to deceive. But as you say, not impossible.

But genuine mistakes, usually, would not involve BCMS / CTS and birth dates or dam identity.

The letter from the Gunnerfleet herd, and its subsequent dispersal is a heart wrencher. They appear to have been on the receiving end of a really bum deal with this bull and the breed society.
 

Johngee

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Llandysul
The cost of calf registration alone is getting to be too big an overhead, particularly if you have lost faith with the governance it’s supposed to pay for.

When you could de register the poorer ones and get £20 back it wasn’t too bad, but they’ve reduced that now as well. We’ll have to be more selective what we register this year, there was only one bull calf registered last year, there’ll be less heifers this year too. But there’s some bloodlines I’d want to keep registering, they’ve been here for almost 40 years, so want to keep a few going.
 

muleman

Member
It's a tragedy that 'occasional' folk are less than honest . Had two heifers calve one night , one red Angus calf , one black ... By morning they'd happily swapped . That genuine scenario can't be overcome , if in a calving yard and could have been a genuine error ...... Bizarre thing was
In almost 50 years working with pedigree breeds, I am equally certain that this is not a one off job. I've seen too many such 'mistakes' in both dairy and beef parentage.
Tissue samples at birth, linked to an eartag and blood testing make it less easy to deceive. But as you say, not impossible.

But genuine mistakes, usually, would not involve BCMS / CTS and birth dates or dam identity.

The letter from the Gunnerfleet herd, and its subsequent dispersal is a heart wrencher. They appear to have been on the receiving end of a really bum deal with this bull and the breed society.
Not good for them at all but Why would they feel the need to sell up, i thought the jaegerbomb progeny had been sold off, they could carry using other bulls.Seems a shame.
 
Location
Cumbria
Only they will be able to tell you why but I would think if you get kicked so many times you lose the will to carry on. Also unless they have some financial help taking such a case through the court will cost them a ridiculous amount.
 

JP1

Member
Livestock Farmer
85C2ED06-7F74-4E00-9C56-0292E32136CE.jpeg
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

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Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

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As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
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