Improving grain cooling

Spud

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
YO62
Looking for ideas on how to cool grain - something we need to get better at.

We currently use pedesatals, but with a shed width of 33' per side, they're a bit wide for one but too narrow for two. Arguably more fans and auto controls would help improve things and is an option worth considering.
Part of the problem is the front half of the wheat shed can be emptied and refilled a few times over harvest, and its a pain scrambling up the heap to take the fans on and off the pedestals all the time - invariably sometimes they're too late been put back on.
They're ok but it strikes me that often we're just recirculating the same ever warmer air through the grain and not pulling enough cold air in from outside to cool effectively. On cold days we'll open the door to help but its not that effective really.

Its a bulk store with a good polished concrete floor 90' front to back. I don't really want to dig the floor up or overlay it with wood.

Anybody use twinwall pipe? We use them in 5' lengths in another shed for short term potatoes which work ok, but the fans on those are at the front of an open fronted shed - the forklift drives between them to outload in one shed. In the other they are fed from a central tunnel and are 90degrees to the direction of the forklift - definitely not an option in the grain shed that way.

I'm considering 9" twinwall lengthways up the shed - probably two of them about 15' apart, with a 90 at the back of the shed then an upright to a small platform on the wall top onto a fan drawing air in from outside? Better ideas welcome.
If we put two pipes each side we may need an exhaust louvre but that's doable.

I'm also considering upgrading the cropscan 16 controller in my potato store and using the cropscan to control the grain shed fans and make temp recording easier.

While we're on the 30yo Kentra dryer is at a crossroads. The control system is way out of date and some auto functions don't work well. The infrastructure around it is worn out and the steel pit liner leaks. Its a 10.5t continuous flow drying 2-3000t per season.
I've priced a 20t/hr of a different mfr that will fit in the same shed but needed a sit down when the quote arrived!

Options (and please suggest others)

1 Upgrade the electrics and replace the elevators and conveyors. Increase pit size from 3t to 15t. Keep 25t wet bin. Automate as far as possible.

2 Replace the entire system with one of similar capacity

3 Increase capacity as far as space allows with new

4 Replace the existing with a large static mobile dryer of some sort (outside mobile isn't practical)

5 Replace existing with a larger but s/h dryer with new or s/h infrastructure

100kva 3ph electric supply and kero pipe fed into the shed. (the front of the same shed as where the cooling needs improving above)

Thanks all
 

Al R

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
West Wales
Put pedestals 11’ from either side. Cool the back first and do the front once you’ve finished moving to much, you should have cool grain (15-20*C) coming off the drier.
I’d go for a 40t drier and possibly raise the roof or build its own shed alongside. Say a 20t drier is £80k a 40t drier isn’t going to be £160k.
 

Spud

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
YO62
Put pedestals 11’ from either side. Cool the back first and do the front once you’ve finished moving to much, you should have cool grain (15-20*C) coming off the drier.
I’d go for a 40t drier and possibly raise the roof or build its own shed alongside. Say a 20t drier is £80k a 40t drier isn’t going to be £160k.

It isn't going to be 15-20 off the dryer when the ambient is say 22degrees - more like 28-30

A 20t continouos flow would only take 150hrs to do 3000t which is nothing over a season really. We haven't the tonnage, space or budget for a 40t/hr monster.

You maybe referring to a 40t mobile? Which will be only be a touch more than the 10tph continuous one we have. Not a daft idea, but I really need to avoid putting a penthouse on the shed for cost and planning reasons. No space to build a shed alongside
 

neilo

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Montgomeryshire
If you have a length of 9” twinwall the length of the shed, the air won’t flow through the warm/moist bits, it will always find the easiest path.

More pedestals (& more fans if you don’t want to scrabble) will be cheaper and more flexible than most other options I’d have thought.
 

Al R

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
West Wales
It isn't going to be 15-20 off the dryer when the ambient is say 22degrees - more like 28-30

A 20t continouos flow would only take 150hrs to do 3000t which is nothing over a season really. We haven't the tonnage, space or budget for a 40t/hr monster.

You maybe referring to a 40t mobile? Which will be only be a touch more than the 10tph continuous one we have. Not a daft idea, but I really need to avoid putting a penthouse on the shed for cost and planning reasons. No space to build a shed alongside
Sorry the ambient down here would be closer to 15-20*C.
40t static I meant, it depends how much your drying, 3,000t taking 5-10% off would be more than 150 hours.
 

JD6920s

Member
Location
Shropshire
We use pedestals in a shed of similar size with two wide and works well on a controller.
Good idea with pipes going from floor up to back wall, saves cutting through grain wall, @quattro is the expert on twinwall.
Main thing is get a vent in the top of one gable and an extractor in the other, you need to remove the warm air and replace with cool.
Maybe for a good s/h c/f drier @grainboy could help.
 

Spud

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
YO62
If you have a length of 9” twinwall the length of the shed, the air won’t flow through the warm/moist bits, it will always find the easiest path.

More pedestals (& more fans if you don’t want to scrabble) will be cheaper and more flexible than most other options I’d have thought.
Will the same problem not occur with pedestals? If we get a problem its usually where its been a bit warm off the dryer after been a bit wet going in the dryer. Its not normally next to the pedestal but can be quite close. Generally the problems seem to come from warm grain not being cooled quick enough, which then warms up and sweats. Hence me thinking I need to make it easier to cool it sooner and quicker
 

Spud

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
YO62
Sorry the ambient down here would be closer to 15-20*C.
40t static I meant, it depends how much your drying, 3,000t taking 5-10% off would be more than 150 hours.
Most of the time we're taking 4-5% out, odd load over but barley & oats usually cut at 16-17% which helps the average

My gut feeling says stay continuous rather than batch
 

Spud

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
YO62
We use pedestals in a shed of similar size with two wide and works well on a controller.
Good idea with pipes going from floor up to back wall, saves cutting through grain wall, @quattro is the expert on twinwall.
Main thing is get a vent in the top of one gable and an extractor in the other, you need to remove the warm air and replace with cool.
Maybe for a good s/h c/f drier @grainboy could help.

That makes good sense and will probably make a lot of difference, cheers
 

neilo

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Montgomeryshire
Will the same problem not occur with pedestals? If we get a problem its usually where its been a bit warm off the dryer after been a bit wet going in the dryer. Its not normally next to the pedestal but can be quite close. Generally the problems seem to come from warm grain not being cooled quick enough, which then warms up and sweats. Hence me thinking I need to make it easier to cool it sooner and quicker

Potentially, but with a far smaller area potentially not vented.
If you have a 90’ pipe you might only suck air through 40’ of it?
 

Al R

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
West Wales
Most of the time we're taking 4-5% out, odd load over but barley & oats usually cut at 16-17% which helps the average

My gut feeling says stay continuous rather than batch
I’d stay CF too! You could always dig down in the shed although from previous experience make sure you don’t go through a spring and have it very well lined and don’t have the elevators below your lower floor. Spent hundreds of hours with small hoovers unblocking elevators underground in wet conditions 🤦🏻‍♂️
 

Spud

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
YO62
Potentially, but with a far smaller area potentially not vented.
If you have a 90’ pipe you might only suck air through 40’ of it?
I was thinking I'd blow rather than suck (based on potato experience and heat rises) but it'd be handy if someone cleverer than I can work out the figures. Realistically because of the dryer at the front of the shed, it'd be unusual to have grain that needed cooling in the front 20' of the shed, but still a fair way from the back wall
 

Al R

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
West Wales
How often are your automatic fans going on? I’ve never been able to use them as humidity is to high here so it would be December before humidities dropped enough for the Lishman automatic controller to kick in, used to run it on manual and have it continuously going from as soon as 4 pedestals were full and then rotate every Monday to the next 4.
 

JD6920s

Member
Location
Shropshire
How often are your automatic fans going on? I’ve never been able to use them as humidity is to high here so it would be December before humidities dropped enough for the Lishman automatic controller to kick in, used to run it on manual and have it continuously going from as soon as 4 pedestals were full and then rotate every Monday to the next 4.
Our controllers doesn’t run on humidity, only on temperature differential, there is a crop sensor pushed in the pile between pedestals and an air temperature sensor placed just at the inlet vent in the one gable, when the ambient temp is 5 deg or lower than the crop temperature the fans start in turn followed by the extractor fan in the other gable, so in harvest it runs most nights or cool days, Lishman’s assured me that humidity wouldn’t be an issue when cooling/conditioning grain.
We have used the system in one shed since 2011 and now have a second system in another since 2020 and pleased with how it works.
The grain is pushed up but we tidy up the top with a shovel and run a grain butler through to take out the compaction and assist air flow.
 

alomy75

Member
We have a store with horizontal twin wall 300mm pipe; one every 3m fed from a grain tunnel down one side. It’s a faff but never ever had a problem with grain. Another store with in line much bigger twin wall (like you do your tates). They’re longer lengths so need teleporter to drag them out but I can put a fan in the doorway to blow fresh air through. Worst thing is guessing when you’re filling when to go from perforated to solid 😂 all filled with an elevator obviously
 

Spud

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
YO62
We have a store with horizontal twin wall 300mm pipe; one every 3m fed from a grain tunnel down one side. It’s a faff but never ever had a problem with grain. Another store with in line much bigger twin wall (like you do your tates). They’re longer lengths so need teleporter to drag them out but I can put a fan in the doorway to blow fresh air through. Worst thing is guessing when you’re filling when to go from perforated to solid 😂 all filled with an elevator obviously
Just to add to the fun, all ours are telehandler filled :facepalm:
 

quattro

Member
Location
scotland
I use 2x400mm twin wall pipes in 50and60/ft wide stores going through rear wall where the fan sits
can store grain / osr 25ft deep and cool it down as quick as possible
it’s worked for last 25 years
 

Spud

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
YO62
I use 2x400mm twin wall pipes in 50and60/ft wide stores going through rear wall where the fan sits
can store grain / osr 25ft deep and cool it down as quick as possible
it’s worked for last 25 years
Are you sucking heat out or blowing cold air in? Any issues with air flow as the pipe uncovers as the store empties? Thanks
 

Spud

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
YO62
Because literally everything goes through the drier? I assume you have a wet store and load it with handler too if it’s a 3t intake? Poor telescopic must never stop!
Yes telehandler fed and dry grain shifted. No distribution elevators, nor is it particularly easy or cost effective to fit them tbh.
A bigger pit would allow some trailers to tip in the pit which would help at times, but wet shed still needed.
 

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Man fined £300 for bonfire-related waste offences

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Written by William Kellett from Agriland

court-640x360.jpg
A man has pleaded guilty at Newtownards Magistrates’ Court to waste offences relating to a bonfire next to the electrical sub-station on the Circular Road in Newtownards, Co. Down.

Gareth Gill (51) of Abbot’s Walk, Newtownards pleaded guilty to two charges under the Waste and Contaminated Land (Northern Ireland) Order 1997, for which he was fined £150 each and ordered to pay a £15 offender’s levy

On June 25, 2018, PSNI officers went to Gill’s yard, where they found a large amount of waste consisting of scrap wood, pallets, carpet and underlay.

Discussion with Northern Ireland Environment Agency (NIEA) officers confirmed the site...
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