"Improving Our Lot" - Planned Holistic Grazing, for starters..

[hendrebc]

First try at it here last winter. I put a bale out every day and a strip of grass for 19 cows (was meant to be 20). Small paddocks and moving the water with them would be much better. Cows got fat could have done with another 10 there really will try again this winter with nearer 40.
Field has and is coming back well apart from one corner where it's a but damper and the tractor was driven through and one place where they were walking to water. Even the ring feeder scars are coming back as long as they were only used once. I'll try and get some pictures.

 

[som farmer]

as said before, little bales, spread in a line, are the best ! Breakdown of the 'residue' from a round bale, is a pain, and a problem. Having tried unrolling, it don't seem to work, just get a lot of of 'residue', making a carpet, that's a bit too thick, to break down. We out winter cattle on kale, and we have found the best way to supplement, with bales, is very frequent round feeder moves. Behind the kale, one of the few times we plough, but you can see where those round feeders were, and l don't see that 'residue' breaking down quickly, if the feeders stay in one place, it's a mess, for several years, alternatives that work ? The best is little bales, the next is probably housing, thereafter, feeding round bales, is a pain, that causes a mess. We have tried leaving bales in situ, to avoid tractor 'damage', you still end up with a mess, that is noticeable for 2/3 years. The cattle do very well on the system, and a cheap way of wintering, but there are the downsides, it's whether the pro's and cons balance. We cannot outwinter cattle, on grass, here, the grass simply doesn't come back in the spring, 50 yrs experience has told me that, took son 2 years, to realise l was right, and is probably why l am so keen on housing.
The residue left from pre-mowing, has 'smothered' new growth, in the places, where cows 'didn't like' before any mowing, and certainly didn't like post mowing, hopefully next grazing, cows will trample in. Over the years, l have tried, seaweed, proprietary mineral blends, salt, and lime, and cannot get cows to eat grass, in those bits, not sure what else l can try, but very open to ideas !
Otherwise, very happy the lying barstewards of weather forecasters, have removed mondays heavy rain, they sneaked in for 24 hrs, unless it's in the 'now' w/forcasts seem to get more and more, unreliable, absolutely sure they have no appreciation of the cost, they cause, by seemingly random changes, at the last minute.

 

[som farmer]

That's what living a life of luxury does:
View attachment 974450
Maybe if they aren't rationed then they become irrationed

for some, decadence becomes the normal, and then, what do they spend their money on ? Round here, they can go to the new holiday hotel, that seeps decadence, all over the parish.
Cream cakes on a wednesday, is not over indulging, it should be encouraged, cream price, is a major component of milk price, plus, cream cakes are scrumptious ! The advert, 'naughty but nice' was spot on.

 

[Poorbuthappy]

as said before, little bales, spread in a line, are the best ! Breakdown of the 'residue' from a round bale, is a pain, and a problem. Having tried unrolling, it don't seem to work, just get a lot of of 'residue', making a carpet, that's a bit too thick, to break down. We out winter cattle on kale, and we have found the best way to supplement, with bales, is very frequent round feeder moves. Behind the kale, one of the few times we plough, but you can see where those round feeders were, and l don't see that 'residue' breaking down quickly, if the feeders stay in one place, it's a mess, for several years, alternatives that work ? The best is little bales, the next is probably housing, thereafter, feeding round bales, is a pain, that causes a mess. We have tried leaving bales in situ, to avoid tractor 'damage', you still end up with a mess, that is noticeable for 2/3 years. The cattle do very well on the system, and a cheap way of wintering, but there are the downsides, it's whether the pro's and cons balance. We cannot outwinter cattle, on grass, here, the grass simply doesn't come back in the spring, 50 yrs experience has told me that, took son 2 years, to realise l was right, and is probably why l am so keen on housing.
The residue left from pre-mowing, has 'smothered' new growth, in the places, where cows 'didn't like' before any mowing, and certainly didn't like post mowing, hopefully next grazing, cows will trample in. Over the years, l have tried, seaweed, proprietary mineral blends, salt, and lime, and cannot get cows to eat grass, in those bits, not sure what else l can try, but very open to ideas !
Otherwise, very happy the lying barstewards of weather forecasters, have removed mondays heavy rain, they sneaked in for 24 hrs, unless it's in the 'now' w/forcasts seem to get more and more, unreliable, absolutely sure they have no appreciation of the cost, they cause, by seemingly random changes, at the last minute.

When unrolling bales I do it "backwards" so they don't leave it in a thick mat, and they cover a larger area.

 

[holwellcourtfarm]

When unrolling bales I do it "backwards" so they don't leave it in a thick mat, and they cover a larger area.

Belt baler bales unroll more evenly as well. Claas roller bales tend to just slump once you get past the firm outer part.

I'd imagine chopper bales would be even worse.

 

[Poorbuthappy]

Belt baler bales until more evenly as well. Claas roller bales tend to just slump once you get past the firm outer part.

I'd imagine chopper bales would be even worse.

Yep belt baler used here

 

[som farmer]

Belt baler bales unroll more evenly as well. Claas roller bales tend to just slump once you get past the firm outer part.

I'd imagine chopper bales would be even worse.

we use full chop, for silage bales, hay normal, square or round.
might try chopping some straw bales, might be better for cubicles, through the straw chopper, that eats blades, jury still out on that one, l can visualise a big heap of straw, in the yard, if something goes wrong !!

 

[Crofter64]

as said before, little bales, spread in a line, are the best ! Breakdown of the 'residue' from a round bale, is a pain, and a problem. Having tried unrolling, it don't seem to work, just get a lot of of 'residue', making a carpet, that's a bit too thick, to break down. We out winter cattle on kale, and we have found the best way to supplement, with bales, is very frequent round feeder moves. Behind the kale, one of the few times we plough, but you can see where those round feeders were, and l don't see that 'residue' breaking down quickly, if the feeders stay in one place, it's a mess, for several years, alternatives that work ? The best is little bales, the next is probably housing, thereafter, feeding round bales, is a pain, that causes a mess. We have tried leaving bales in situ, to avoid tractor 'damage', you still end up with a mess, that is noticeable for 2/3 years. The cattle do very well on the system, and a cheap way of wintering, but there are the downsides, it's whether the pro's and cons balance. We cannot outwinter cattle, on grass, here, the grass simply doesn't come back in the spring, 50 yrs experience has told me that, took son 2 years, to realise l was right, and is probably why l am so keen on housing.
The residue left from pre-mowing, has 'smothered' new growth, in the places, where cows 'didn't like' before any mowing, and certainly didn't like post mowing, hopefully next grazing, cows will trample in. Over the years, l have tried, seaweed, proprietary mineral blends, salt, and lime, and cannot get cows to eat grass, in those bits, not sure what else l can try, but very open to ideas !
Otherwise, very happy the lying barstewards of weather forecasters, have removed mondays heavy rain, they sneaked in for 24 hrs, unless it's in the 'now' w/forcasts seem to get more and more, unreliable, absolutely sure they have no appreciation of the cost, they cause, by seemingly random changes, at the last minute.

Have you tried spraying those areas with molasses in a hand sprayer . Might only have to do it once?

 

[som farmer]

Have you tried spraying those areas with molasses in a hand sprayer . Might only have to do it once?

no
but not a bad idea, there's about 2 acres, buggers don't like, never have done, few other areas about, managed to get them on the 'yummy' list.
It's good fertile soil, and by the stream, so really annoying, grass seems to smother the clover out, or not a lot of clover there, because clover doesn't like it either ! Another route could be to use completely different grass +herbs, and forget prg. Trying to remember, bit difficult, l seem to recollect, there was an old river course there, oxbow ? left from where the river altered it's course, and dad filled it in, with what, to far back, and to young, to remember. Perhaps that is the problem, hadn't thought of that, for at least half a century !!

 

[Fenwick]

When unrolling bales I do it "backwards" so they don't leave it in a thick mat, and they cover a larger area.

+1 for that

 

[farmgineer]

we use full chop, for silage bales, hay normal, square or round.
might try chopping some straw bales, might be better for cubicles, through the straw chopper, that eats blades, jury still out on that one, l can visualise a big heap of straw, in the yard, if something goes wrong !!

Accidentally did that year before last, round bales... Baler man lent on the lever... Don't recommend it.
They go really soft and can't handle them with a spike, only soft bale squeeze, dropped a few. You also struggle to get the wrap/net stuff off as it just falls to bits when you cut it and take the only thing holding it together away.

 

[som farmer]

Accidentally did that year before last, round bales... Baler man lent on the lever... Don't recommend it.
They go really soft and can't handle them with a spike, only soft bale squeeze, dropped a few. You also struggle to get the wrap/net stuff off as it just falls to bits when you cut it and take the only thing holding it together away.

just confirms my thoughts, thankyou.
Someone said about chopping hay, all l could see, was disaster !

 

[Kiwi Pete]

 

[Kiwi Pete]

On the chopping subject, we used to chop hay with the early McHale Fusion balers, then hit the "stones" button to drop the knives toward the end of the bale so the outer was unchopped.
Generally about the time the turbocharger began to lean into it, it gave about 15cm of hay around the outside to maintain a bit of integrity but meant the core wasn't a bit stubborn lump, and upped the bale weight considerably

 

[som farmer]

On the chopping subject, we used to chop hay with the early McHale Fusion balers, then hit the "stones" button to drop the knives toward the end of the bale so the outer was unchopped.
Generally about the time the turbocharger began to lean into it, it gave about 15cm of hay around the outside to maintain a bit of integrity but meant the core wasn't a bit stubborn lump, and upped the bale weight considerably

on a newer mchale fusion baler, l know it takes 3+hours, to remove a full chop silage bale, that decided not to tie, and jammed itself between bale chamber, and wrapper.
Very much like the idea of leaving the outside, un chopped for hay, that would simply mixing in the TMR, which we had decided not to use either last winter, or this, all great ideas don't necessarily come to fruition !
Watched a dairy sale on marteye today, astounding, is probably the best description, cow after cow went over 2,000 guineas, holstiens, young pedigree herd, opposite to normal thinking, l check how many cows 4th lac and over, not many = high replacement rate = cows don't last = me not keen. And yet, the 'young herd' bit, is advertised as a major plus, when you see 60+ 1st lac 45 second, 25 third, with 20 older cows, (not todays sale), you know they don't last ! Why bid £2000, for 2nd or 3rd lac, when the odds are 1 more lac, beats me, but then, l am a tight fisted old git !

 

[Kiwi Pete]

Jeez, we used to get them kicked out in about 15 minutes when they wouldn't net. There is a definite knack to it, you have to get two half-bales out through that orbital wrapper.

Pull as much as you can out, drive forward a little, give the PTO a quick stab to get ¼ out, drive forward again and repeat.

Don't ask me how many bales I've done

 

[holwellcourtfarm]

Don't ask me how many bales I've done

Just the sort of thing designers don't think about (until they are made to).

 

[som farmer]

Jeez, we used to get them kicked out in about 15 minutes when they wouldn't net. There is a definite knack to it, you have to get two half-bales out through that orbital wrapper.

Pull as much as you can out, drive forward a little, give the PTO a quick stab to get ¼ out, drive forward again and repeat.

Don't ask me how many bales I've done

handfull by handfull, with the safety bits, that wouldn't allow him to jerk it out, all l could do, was moral support, and ring son to help. Now know what went wrong, steep hill, when bale went to wrap, to steep to roll into wrapper, and rolled back to in-between. It's amazing how much is in a bale, they were av over 1 ton each.
A new 'event', watching the weather forecast, we are in a 'amber' area for extreme heat, wow.

 

[Henarar]

handfull by handfull, with the safety bits, that wouldn't allow him to jerk it out, all l could do, was moral support, and ring son to help. Now know what went wrong, steep hill, when bale went to wrap, to steep to roll into wrapper, and rolled back to in-between. It's amazing how much is in a bale, they were av over 1 ton each.
A new 'event', watching the weather forecast, we are in a 'amber' area for extreme heat, wow.

It will roll up to thunder soon enough

 

[som farmer]

It will roll up to thunder soon enough

our hay should be baled today, 4 acres thursday, then a thunderstorm or three, will be great, as long as it rains as well. Grass is actually behaving, not shooting up seed heads, shouldn't have said that........... But rain would be welcome. At least this year, there is plenty of fodder, already gathered ! Rain would guarantee another cut.
As grass growth slows a bit, clover increases, as does the chicory, but plantain seems to have slowed down, the chicory is just going mental, whereas it was the plantains more obvious, in the spring. The important bit, they have grown, and the cows love them.