"Improving Our Lot" - Planned Holistic Grazing, for starters..

Guleesh

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Isle of Skye
quite like the look of the small robots, toiling away 24/7, weeding etc, they look quite practical. But when you move on to the really big tackle, it's a job to imagine, a combine, or forager, working all day, without re-charging, or 'whatever'.
But this is the start of a new revolution, with electronics, we have no idea of what some nutty professor is going to discover, how can we, he hasn't discovered it yet ! The changes in my lifetime, that we have witnessed in farming, are really quite mind boggling, and yet, we quietly absorb them into our practices, with little fuss, but not little expense. Who knows, nuclear powered tractors, with free antiradiation overalls included. Nobody knows what will, or is being invented/tested, nor even those nutty professors, but above all, one thing is certain, just like death and taxes, everybody needs to eat, unless, someone is developing an alternative form of fuel, for the human body to live/work on, you never know .....

It's always interesting to muse as to what the future may hold... but, where does it all end? I'm really not a fan of all this further automation in farming, field robots etc. Call me a luddite, but it looks a bleak future to me, it'll end up with robots outside in the sun, wasting the earths resources, and at the same time bored, unfit people wasting the earths resources sitting inside, suffering from mental health disorders and vitamin D deficiency.

I realise my view on life, and the way I live my own makes me a bit of a dinosaur, but, I know I am a lot happier and healthier when outside in the weather working.
 

holwellcourtfarm

Member
NFFN Member
It's always interesting to muse as to what the future may hold... but, where does it all end? I'm really not a fan of all this further automation in farming, field robots etc. Call me a luddite, but it looks a bleak future to me, it'll end up with robots outside in the sun, wasting the earths resources, and at the same time bored, unfit people wasting the earths resources sitting inside, suffering from mental health disorders and vitamin D deficiency.

I realise my view on life, and the way I live my own makes me a bit of a dinosaur, but, I know I am a lot happier and healthier when outside in the weather working.
I share your worries (and I was playing with computers in 1976 when they were white hot technology and had my first smartphone in, IIRC, 2004).

IMG_1607.PNG
 

Kiwi Pete

Member
Livestock Farmer
Are plain wire fences still often installed down there? There's not many of them left round these parts, nearly all 8/80/15 netting now. I'm surprised that fence is still holding stock given the pressure it's obviously under and the slack line, lucky for you that it's not my sheep next door to you...
Netting is pretty much the standard boundary fence. Mind you, his ewes are going through the holes in the old netting to get here, too
 

Kiwi Pete

Member
Livestock Farmer
It's always interesting to muse as to what the future may hold... but, where does it all end? I'm really not a fan of all this further automation in farming, field robots etc. Call me a luddite, but it looks a bleak future to me, it'll end up with robots outside in the sun, wasting the earths resources, and at the same time bored, unfit people wasting the earths resources sitting inside, suffering from mental health disorders and vitamin D deficiency.

I realise my view on life, and the way I live my own makes me a bit of a dinosaur, but, I know I am a lot happier and healthier when outside in the weather working.
Yeah, it comes back to "don't know what we don't know" to an extent.
With existing tools, we do know, and we can use them - or not use them - because we know how the consequences sit with us

that's intelligence

why would we want more artificial intelligence when we can develop our own, not to say lets go back to hitting posts in with a maul, rather ask why we need a post in the ground?
 

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
I share your worries (and I was playing with computers in 1976 when they were white hot technology and had my first smartphone in, IIRC, 2004).

View attachment 992049
I am perfectly happy with my laptop, while it does what l expect it to do, then it's panic mode, then the younger members tell me it's something l have done, l think it's very unfair to blame me, every time ! Unfortunately they are probably correct.
I am getting used to my 'new' phone, even learnt to take pictures, and post them on here.
As to the future, and new inventions, l really think it's better not to know, we only end up not knowing how it works, until it's in use, and very often doesn't live up to it's claims.
As to our future, things are changing in the background, and it's the 'when' which is stifling us now, but l am quite convinced farming is changing. The science that is available to us, as dairy farmers, is quite staggering, from robots to rumen monitoring, even telling you when to serve them, but they all cost.
That will be fine (ish) for the big outfits, or intensive farming, through all types of ag. There are more middling type of farms, who cannot afford to invest in all that technology, or don't want to, that is where the 'problems' will occur, very difficult decisions will have to be made.
Here, we are going backwards, aiming to be more self sufficient, if nothing else, there will be a big reduction in money going out ! And l hope it will make for a more enjoyable type of farming, probably more like the publics 'image' of what they think they want
 
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holwellcourtfarm

Member
NFFN Member
son in law works in design/safety on helicopters, he says they are absolutely totally inefficient emission wise, in fact, the worst there is, after space rockets.
I found this last night. They've achieved more than most thought possible but are WAY short of being competitive with current rotary offerings for commercial use.


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In fact, he said, the R44 is a surprisingly good fit for the project. It has a relatively efficient rotor system and a lightweight airframe that is normally paired with a very heavy Lycoming engine (an IO-540 with a wet installed weight of around 500 pounds/225 kilograms). In Tier 1’s first prototype, this is replaced with custom Yasa twin electric motors and a Rinehart motor control system that weigh just 100 lb. (45 kg), helping to offset the 1,100-lb. (500-kg) weight of the Brammo lithium polymer batteries that are attached under the belly.

On Dec. 7, with test pilot Ric Webb of OC Helicopters at the controls, the aircraft set a Guinness World Record for the farthest distance traveled by an electric helicopter, flying 30 nautical miles around Los Alamitos Army Airfield in California

With a new and improved electric helicopter on the near horizon, this month’s record-setting flight was essentially housekeeping; a way to officialize the achievements of the first prototype before the second one proceeds to surpass them. Dromgoole said that with its second version, Tier 1 is aiming for at least an hour of flight time with 600 lb. (270 kg) of useful payload, and “we feel it’s very achievable.”
 
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som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
the science in batteries is quite amazing in it's own right. As a treat to myself, l bought a cordless chainsaw, only a small one, but astonished, is the way to describe it, that's with 1 battery.
And guess which country has one of the largest deposits of lithuim in the world, or put it another way, l shan't be supporting cornwall in a bid for independence.
In the present fuel crisis, where gas is being used as a diplomatic weapon, the UK is sat on top of huge reserves of oil, gas, phosphates, tin and rare earth minerals, and the same people that moan about energy prices, would moan louder, if they tried to actually use them.
Perhaps that is one of the reasons the EU is pissy about us leaving, europe does not have those reserves, and especially those rare earth minerals, so vital to much of the developing high tech developments.
 

holwellcourtfarm

Member
NFFN Member

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
Overstated but essentially about right.

Anyone still wonder why we plan to move somewhere remote and drive for resilience?
making us read that, and it's only tuesday.
scary stuff, but many do realise that we cannot, as a world, carry on as we are. The unfortunate bit is that this truth has been hijacked by zealots, that create, and shout to much, and are therefore ignored.
'The west' has been in decline for some time, and has sort to control that decline, in several ways, the EU has/is attempting to turn it's self into an isolationist state, to control what comes in, and goes out, keeping a lid on prices, to maintain an 'orderly' society, that is a very short fix, destined to fail, it's citizens don't want it, and l am afraid to say, the UK has hastened the break-up by leaving.
For the UK, we are 'leaving' the 'west' and looking towards the 'east', for future trade, which is a smart move, and will slow down our 'demise'.
The biggest problem is energy, oil and it's products, are destroying the planet, but the only reliable other source of energy is nuclear. Sun, wind, water and digestors, all have their place, but on sheer quantity, and reliability, they are way of a nuclear plant, which, in it's self, is somewhat unpopular and 'dangerous'.
Self sufficiency, is a dream, we rely on trading partners, to keep the 'peace', which the EU is ignoring, isolationist policies have never worked, and usually ended up in a war, the original EU was set up to keepthe peace.
So we move into a very uncertain future, probably no one knows quite what will happen, pretty certain there will not be WW3, l don't think that is financially possible, border scraps yes. Climate change, that has to be a global effort, or will fail, new technology is probably the best hope for energy, whether by better use of fuel, or something completely new.
In fact, the only constant l can see, is food, everybody needs that, but the range of global product, on the shelves in shops, will no longer be there, pretty well basic food, at a price, that will make the deli counter disappear !
Will that make us farmers into global heroes ? From what l can see, we will be blamed for the lot, rather unfairly, as we can achieve quite obvious help, in both food, and carbon sequestration. To be honest, l don't really worry about that, because, at the end of it all, without us, they cannot survive. However, l very much doubt if we will get rich of it, there are simply to many people living off our backs, and basic food, will have to be at a level, people can afford, so regardless of end price, we are at the bottom of the chain, instead of the top. You never know, we may even see food subsidies creep back in !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Fenwick

Member
Location
Bretagne France
Perhaps that is one of the reasons the EU is pissy about us leaving, europe does not have those reserves, and especially those rare earth minerals, so vital to much of the developing high tech developments.

I try and keep away from the brexit discussion as much as I can, as it is so unproductive.
But as the E.U. occurs so frequently in your posts just for the record.


No one is taking any interest in the U.K. over here. Neither the politicians nor the general public is interested.

The departure of the U.K. is not having an effect on anything or anyone over here

General consensus is that the U.K. looks a bit silly and most people are not anti britannique and hope that the British sort themselves out.


.
 

Henarar

Member
Livestock Farmer
I try and keep away from the brexit discussion as much as I can, as it is so unproductive.
But as the E.U. occurs so frequently in your posts just for the record.


No one is taking any interest in the U.K. over here. Neither the politicians nor the general public is interested.

The departure of the U.K. is not having an effect on anything or anyone over here

General consensus is that the U.K. looks a bit silly and most people are not anti britannique and hope that the British sort themselves out.


.
We have, thanks
 

Guleesh

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Isle of Skye
Anyway... never mind about brexit. Since we're heading a bit off topic, look at our little Kune Kune X s that mostly graze and don't really dig.....:oops:
DSC_0679.JPG

They were very well trained to the electric fence, and wouldn't leave their enclosure when it came time to move them, so we enlisted the retired collie, but he just stood staring at them so we had to just drag them out squealing.
DSC_0997.JPG

A quick level with a rake then we laid some precious wool for mulch, this will hopefully protect the soil and give time for the grass roots to rot before planting this bit with potatoes in spring.
DSC_1019.jpg

It turns out these pigs dig as much as any other, maybe too much X and not enough kune kune? so for now we've given them another little area to destroy, but I'm seriously considering just putting them in a shed until early spring. The thought of all the ground they'll dig up and all that soil sitting bare through winter is just too much, and we haven't got enough mulch to cover it all, I'll be happy to let them out in the spring and let them do their thing, as we can keep moving them and sow something directly behind them, having minimum bare soil time.
 

Fenwick

Member
Location
Bretagne France
Anyway... never mind about brexit. Since we're heading a bit off topic, look at our little Kune Kune X s that mostly graze and don't really dig.....:oops:View attachment 992252
They were very well trained to the electric fence, and wouldn't leave their enclosure when it came time to move them, so we enlisted the retired collie, but he just stood staring at them so we had to just drag them out squealing.View attachment 992253
A quick level with a rake then we laid some precious wool for mulch, this will hopefully protect the soil and give time for the grass roots to rot before planting this bit with potatoes in spring.View attachment 992255
It turns out these pigs dig as much as any other, maybe too much X and not enough kune kune? so for now we've given them another little area to destroy, but I'm seriously considering just putting them in a shed until early spring. The thought of all the ground they'll dig up and all that soil sitting bare through winter is just too much, and we haven't got enough mulch to cover it all, I'll be happy to let them out in the spring and let them do their thing, as we can keep moving them and sow something directly behind them, having minimum bare soil time.

Bloody cute though!
 

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
I try and keep away from the brexit discussion as much as I can, as it is so unproductive.
But as the E.U. occurs so frequently in your posts just for the record.


No one is taking any interest in the U.K. over here. Neither the politicians nor the general public is interested.

The departure of the U.K. is not having an effect on anything or anyone over here

General consensus is that the U.K. looks a bit silly and most people are not anti britannique and hope that the British sort themselves out.


.
brexit happened, and it does have an effect, whether good bad or indifferent, it has changed things, doubly so with the covid effect, that, followed by the energy crisis, is causing problems all over the globe. And there are many answers/solutions that are being tried. But as @holwellcourtfarm quote, re the beginning of shortages, or the end of easy life, which ever way you look at it, big changes are afoot, probably massive changes in the way we live our lives, brexit to the UK is just one, on a personal view, the politicians on all sides, should have worked together, to avoid that referendum, they didn't, and we are where we are, and live has to go on. Whatever you say, the EU defends it's market place, with an isolationist point of view, which is fine, for those in it, at the present time. Perhaps the biggest shock about brexit, is all the doom talked about, the opposite has happened, with prices rising steeply, quite why, no idea, but one theory, is we are dealing at true world prices, the effect of not being in the EU, l just don't know. What nobody can argue about, there seems to be a shortage of almost everything, and we are used to having everything available. Deep down, l suspect many people, including Politian's realise that, but just hoping it wouldn't happen. Covid has caused global chaos in the supply routes, simply by things not in the right place, at the right time- containers for example, the slow down of manufacturing, or changing what they produce, so components are not all available, at the same time.
The world would easily have coped with brexit, it's not that important on the global stage, the UK could, and has found other mkt's, the difficulty for us, is in the change over. The real problems, are covid, and climate change, which need to be dealt with, on a global scale, which simply isn't occurring, it's almost like someone has pressed a re-set button, and we are all caught up in the change, and we don't understand it.
It will take time for us, on a global scale, to adjust, but the outcome will be very different to what we have now, probably the reversal of the western, and the eastern economies, in wealth and production.
As to europe, and the UK, we have been scrapping with each other for over 1,000 years, the precursor of the EU, has managed to stop that, for nearly 70 yrs, all we can hope, is nothing boils over now, for the whole of Europe, energy, covid and brexit, together, nearly a perfect storm. Certainly with your Mr Macron threatening to cut energy supplies, to the UK, things are heating up, probably more to do with an election around the corner, but it is a very dangerous path to follow.
 

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
Anyway... never mind about brexit. Since we're heading a bit off topic, look at our little Kune Kune X s that mostly graze and don't really dig.....:oops:View attachment 992252
They were very well trained to the electric fence, and wouldn't leave their enclosure when it came time to move them, so we enlisted the retired collie, but he just stood staring at them so we had to just drag them out squealing.View attachment 992253
A quick level with a rake then we laid some precious wool for mulch, this will hopefully protect the soil and give time for the grass roots to rot before planting this bit with potatoes in spring.View attachment 992255
It turns out these pigs dig as much as any other, maybe too much X and not enough kune kune? so for now we've given them another little area to destroy, but I'm seriously considering just putting them in a shed until early spring. The thought of all the ground they'll dig up and all that soil sitting bare through winter is just too much, and we haven't got enough mulch to cover it all, I'll be happy to let them out in the spring and let them do their thing, as we can keep moving them and sow something directly behind them, having minimum bare soil time.
make very tasty sausages, as well.
 

StormInATeaCup

Member
Mixed Farmer
Evening all, does anyone know examples of farms with large organic beef herds (400+ cows) in England / Wales who do planned holistic / mob grazing?

Particularly interested if they finish, are pasture for life certified and outwintered. James Evans is the only example I can find so far.

I thought it might be worth asking Precision Grazing.
 

Top cereal and oilseed growers honoured at the Yield Enhancement Network Awards 2021

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Despite an average growing year for most crops, many growers managed to go above and beyond their predicted max yields, with Lincolnshire grower Tim Lamyman taking the top spots for his wheat yields and his world record breaking winter barley yield.

The highest cereal and oilseed yields achieved at harvest 2021 were announced at this year’s Yield Enhancement Network (YEN) Awards on Wednesday 24th November at the Croptec Show. With award presentations by Tom Bradshaw, Vice President of NFU, 24 farms took home the evening’s top awards for highest yield and highest potential yield achieved for wheat, winter and spring barley, oats, and oilseed. The 2021 winners came from all corners of the UK, as well as from as far afield as Finland and New Zealand.

Familiar names from 2020 made the...
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