"Improving Our Lot" - Planned Holistic Grazing, for starters..

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
we are trying 'herbs' this autumn, both in new leys, and overseeding. Plantain, is the biggest success, it's gone balistic. Vetches, we have overseeded, come on alright, but to low a seed rate. Chicory, is disappointing, but may yet come on. We grow h/rye, for bulk silage, and have sown it, with vetches, in the hope of raising protien.
The first part of the title, of this thread, is, improving our lot, which can include many other parts of farming. We know, we have to change our practices, if we continue, with drier summers, and wetter winters, we will not survive, farming, as have done.
To start with, a root and nail approach to our costs, it is very easy, to justify this, or that, to your self, because you either like it, or know different way. Many jobs, become way cheaper, if you either, hire, or use a contractor, rather than having machines, to do it your self. The biggest change, aut to spr calving- not a good move, dry summers = less grass growth, = more conc etc, and due to external interference, we have now got a block of 60, calving now.
The next big expense, is machinery, and we are in the process, of a huge change, moving backwards, sideways, up and down, the result, will mean, other than the main tractor, pretty much everything else, will either be paid for, or nearly paid for, insurance, maintenance, repairs, are as they are, cant change much there.
The next change, includes the other 1/2 of the title, grazing. Even though we intend to out winter as much stock, as we can, we still have to conserve some, our acreage, is simply not big enough, to support extensive grazing, so we are growing, a double crop of h/rye, vetch, and maize, giving us 30 t/acre. Ploughing pretty well finished, tines instead, and focusing, on improving soil structure, hoping it will hold moisture better, and increase fertility. The next stage is wait and see, but at least we our doing somethong.
 

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
Don't completely sell yourself on the dry summer thing, as I said in another thread 2012/13 wasn't long ago
1st dry summer we said, good job we had forage reserves, won't see another one like this, for a few years.
the next summer, oh ##### we have to buy forage, chances of one next year, very remote
this spring, oh ##### ##### this is bad, 3rd in a row, do we chance on a good summer, or do we act, to mitigate the impossible happening ? So, we are being careful, edging away from normal, trying different things, to ensure we can survive another one, in that progress, we have discovered, new ways, new crops, different grazing practices, and can honestly say, we look to be in a better position, than before. My view, is to always be pro-active, then you dont get caught, with your trousers down, only halfway !
 

Treg

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Cornwall
we are trying 'herbs' this autumn, both in new leys, and overseeding. Plantain, is the biggest success, it's gone balistic. Vetches, we have overseeded, come on alright, but to low a seed rate. Chicory, is disappointing, but may yet come on. We grow h/rye, for bulk silage, and have sown it, with vetches, in the hope of raising protien.
The first part of the title, of this thread, is, improving our lot, which can include many other parts of farming. We know, we have to change our practices, if we continue, with drier summers, and wetter winters, we will not survive, farming, as have done.
To start with, a root and nail approach to our costs, it is very easy, to justify this, or that, to your self, because you either like it, or know different way. Many jobs, become way cheaper, if you either, hire, or use a contractor, rather than having machines, to do it your self. The biggest change, aut to spr calving- not a good move, dry summers = less grass growth, = more conc etc, and due to external interference, we have now got a block of 60, calving now.
The next big expense, is machinery, and we are in the process, of a huge change, moving backwards, sideways, up and down, the result, will mean, other than the main tractor, pretty much everything else, will either be paid for, or nearly paid for, insurance, maintenance, repairs, are as they are, cant change much there.
The next change, includes the other 1/2 of the title, grazing. Even though we intend to out winter as much stock, as we can, we still have to conserve some, our acreage, is simply not big enough, to support extensive grazing, so we are growing, a double crop of h/rye, vetch, and maize, giving us 30 t/acre. Ploughing pretty well finished, tines instead, and focusing, on improving soil structure, hoping it will hold moisture better, and increase fertility. The next stage is wait and see, but at least we our doing somethong.
Chicory definitely a spring/ summer plant , don't get much growth here after mid August.
 
Last edited:

jack6480

Member
Location
Staffs
08D9091E-2811-4089-AA2F-0ACD7C60C89E.jpeg

Some herbs and clovers I planted under some spring barley, strangely enough the grasses haven’t done very well.
 

holwellcourtfarm

Member
Livestock Farmer
1st dry summer we said, good job we had forage reserves, won't see another one like this, for a few years.
the next summer, oh ##### we have to buy forage, chances of one next year, very remote
this spring, oh ##### ##### this is bad, 3rd in a row, do we chance on a good summer, or do we act, to mitigate the impossible happening ? So, we are being careful, edging away from normal, trying different things, to ensure we can survive another one, in that progress, we have discovered, new ways, new crops, different grazing practices, and can honestly say, we look to be in a better position, than before. My view, is to always be pro-active, then you dont get caught, with your trousers down, only halfway !
Diversity brings resilience in all things natural. That's a key theme of Holistic Management.
 

bendigeidfran

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Cei newydd
Went for a walk last eavening across the small valley and looked back at our place and saw that a slope was looking very dark green compared to rest of the field.
20201025_075350.jpg

Flat bit was reseded 5yrs ago after sweeds and a cut of silage last year.
Slope had a good rest while silage was growing, i turned the ewes on it after weanig and they flatend a fair bit of it and had 5 heffers on in begining of november and ewes during last febuary storms.
20200308_150805.jpg

This was after grazing last febuary, fair bit of dead grass there.
Going to give flat bit some compost next spring.
Hope with the right grazing i can get rest of the place looking similar to the slope.
 

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Fenwick

Member
Location
Bretagne France
Changing nitrate levels in groundwater is a VERY long term project. Our high groundwater nitrate levels in England all began with the ploughing out of grassland in WW2 under the "dig for victory" campaign to feed the population. It's well established that ploughing out permanent pasture releases huge quantities of N for decades afterwards as the soil biology collapses. Capturing it again effectively takes just as long.

we have zones here called "natura 2000". which are important sites along thé watershed uséd for collecting water for nearby households.

when a new directive came in, tuning cultivated land into pasture, and banning both fert, and grazing. n leaching levels dropped 10 fold within 2 years.
 

Kiwi Pete

Member
Livestock Farmer
we have zones here called "natura 2000". which are important sites along thé watershed uséd for collecting water for nearby households.

when a new directive came in, tuning cultivated land into pasture, and banning both fert, and grazing. n leaching levels dropped 10 fold within 2 years.
Wow! That's a huge improvement.

One of the big issues here is that many of our plains (northern Southland, and the Canterbury plains) are just a couple of inches of topsoil and then alluvial shingle below.
As such they dry out wickedly during even a short dry spell, and thus irrigation via pivots is the norm... turning what would be too arid for intensive farming into a landscape full of dairy, arable, seed and veg cropping.
Thus any soluble N unused by the plants before the next irrigation pass/rain event, is not leached into the waterway so much as directly into the groundwater... riparian margins won't protect these aquifers.
Christchurch city and most of the Cant.y towns, farms and villages get their water from the aquifer, and most dairies in Southland are also using bores for water.... it's rapidly become quite an issue as N fertiliser usage has increased over 600% in 30 years.
As the dairy folk know, it isn't just their problem. I worked on a bulb farm that applied 2 tonnes of AN per hectare which is the highest nitrate hotspot in Southland's groundwater - and also exempt from the N cap - and it isn't even for food production but so the dutch consortium that own it have a non-stop supply of nice bulbs to sell.
 
we have zones here called "natura 2000". which are important sites along thé watershed uséd for collecting water for nearby households.

when a new directive came in, tuning cultivated land into pasture, and banning both fert, and grazing. n leaching levels dropped 10 fold within 2 years.

I have an off topic question regarding Natura 2000, what are the landowners allowed to do in those areas now? How were they received, and how are they thought of now?

We have Natura 2000 sites, which, being honest are an unmitigated disaster. This year, the government agency in charge of them the NPWS admitted 92% of the habitats in these areas have failed to improve or gone backwards. That's since they were introduced in the mid 1990's. This is a result of the designations being seen as dictations, with our previous history of landlords to say this is unpopular with landowners would be an understatement.

In the EU's Biodiversity 2030 strategy document they want to increase coverage to 30% of the EU's land area. Currently Ireland has around 13% of it's land area designated since the 90's. Over 20% of our land area is carbon rich soils, peat. So as the focus is on old forest and carbon rich forest it would appear reasonable to project Ireland will have an above average % of these designations. There's also a new designation coming into being, "strictly protected". Areas where humans may be allowed to visit but no other activity will be allowed. Even national infrastructure projects wouldn't have an opportunity to apply for planning.

My own opinion is in another 25 years in Ireland we'll see figures how pretty much all of the designated land has failed to improve. It's a failure of inspiring people. The powers that be are still stuck in the motivation model. That is, these protections are backed by the courts, so a landowner could be fined or imprisoned. It's also about the EU being seen to be doing something, a quick positive headline regarding the environment. The NPWS 92% failure admission has never been aired.
 

Kiwi Pete

Member
Livestock Farmer
seems nz N usage has risen fast, was it from a very low start
I wouldn't know for sure but would have thought N use had fallen over here on that time scale
Very little for a long time.

Mainly due to most farms being pretty extensive pastoral systems, and as such, didn't have a use for it.
The big kicker was the removal of gov't support and loss of markets in the 80's, which meant a dramatic shift in land use, and the value rose sharply. Possibly the big contrast was the response to WWII by your gov't as @holwellcourtfarm touched on, there was no encouragement here to grow cereals or more grass for that matter.

"sweat the assets" and there are few better ways to liquidate your fertility than grow hungrier plants and feed from the bag!
 

GC74

Member
seems nz N usage has risen fast, was it from a very low start
I wouldn't know for sure but would have thought N use had fallen over here on that time scale
Going by Govt reports NZ N use has gone from 50,000 tons in 1990 to 350 to 370,000 (reports vary abit) in 2017 apparently 73% of this is used by the dairy boys.
They have compared DIN in waterways in native bush to rural waterways and urban waterways. Interesting rural were 13 times higher and urban was 18 times higher, love to know where all the fert and cultivation is been done in our towns
 

Henarar

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Somerset
Going by Govt reports NZ N use has gone from 50,000 tons in 1990 to 350 to 370,000 (reports vary abit) in 2017 apparently 73% of this is used by the dairy boys.
They have compared DIN in waterways in native bush to rural waterways and urban waterways. Interesting rural were 13 times higher and urban was 18 times higher, love to know where all the fert and cultivation is been done in our towns
very heavily fertilised veg gardens ?
 

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