"Improving Our Lot" - Planned Holistic Grazing, for starters..

bendigeidfran

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Cei newydd
We have decided to split our fields in to lanes to make subdivision easier and stocking density up.
Been to see two farms with kiwitec electric fences and we like them.
First farm i went to see they grew enough grass for an extra 100 ewes, my first thought was why not keep same amount of sheep and cut the fertilizer out.
Wife has been pricing the job and i think the gate kit is expensive, any sugestions about a cheaper way?
Any do's and don'ts before i put it up.
 

Kiwi Pete

Member
Livestock Farmer
We have decided to split our fields in to lanes to make subdivision easier and stocking density up.
Been to see two farms with kiwitec electric fences and we like them.
First farm i went to see they grew enough grass for an extra 100 ewes, my first thought was why not keep same amount of sheep and cut the fertilizer out.
Wife has been pricing the job and i think the gate kit is expensive, any sugestions about a cheaper way?
Any do's and don'ts before i put it up.
One of the first dairy farms I worked on, fresh out of school, had "taragates" which were really just fibreglass rods with a milking-rubber handle and a wire hook to heat it up, and a few lengths of polytape for a gate.
Later I realised they were copies of a propietary "thing"

The post had a stapled-on piece of polypipe to hold the bottom of the rod in place and then an insulator like a normal dairy tape-gate, and the fibreglass just had a piece of #8 wire twisted around it (electrical connection for the tapes) then a few tighter winds and a bend to form a hook

20201030_195651.jpg

kinda like that
 

GC74

Member
that would be ideal, but would people pay for it ? I have concerns over imports, or more specific, where we import from. The hype over climate change, is huge, but how many people, as a % of population, really care ? As long as food is cheap, it's lip service no more than that. World population is growing, but, expectations, and knowledge is growing, as well, especially in the 3rd world countries, will their populations, be happy to live in poverty, while their ag, is exported ? What will happen, if climate change actually happens ? More desert in the 3rd world ? Will those populations, quietly starve, to supply us ? Agriculture, is such an important part of life, we really do not deserve to be treated, as we are. If the WHO, is right with it's population forecasts, and climate change happens, relying on cheap imports, will be 'unwise'.
However, for NZ, they do have other exports, especially in the 'home brewing' market, which makes me, and plenty of others, returning customers, although the remarks of GC74, that new regs, will seriously hurt farmers, but as the fronterra auctions, help to set our price, i don't know if i should sympathise, or not.
Sorry if I came across a bit doom and gloom that wasn't my intention. But there is no need for any sympathy at all........ I was lucky enough to watch one of our pre election debates. when our esteemed leader was asked about our greenhouse gas emissions. She said that there was "no need" to go after the low fruit such as transport or vehicles, we need to sort out agriculture first so we can show the world "how to farm with the environment first".

So Som Farmer there is no need to worry about us once we have worked out how to do this profitability, wether it's regen, organic or whatever you can follow our lead and nz agriculture will be able to be seen as the "holy grail" once again.

What home brewing were you referring too?
 

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
Sorry if I came across a bit doom and gloom that wasn't my intention. But there is no need for any sympathy at all........ I was lucky enough to watch one of our pre election debates. when our esteemed leader was asked about our greenhouse gas emissions. She said that there was "no need" to go after the low fruit such as transport or vehicles, we need to sort out agriculture first so we can show the world "how to farm with the environment first".

So Som Farmer there is no need to worry about us once we have worked out how to do this profitability, wether it's regen, organic or whatever you can follow our lead and nz agriculture will be able to be seen as the "holy grail" once again.

What home brewing were you referring too?
pleased to hear the doom and gloom, bit overegged. Environment, climate change, does not make good bedfellows, with increasing cheap food production.
your really good export, still spirits, as am not very fit/mobile, and having little other interests outside of farming, the world of 'moonshine', has/is a fascinating new hobby for me, it has given me hours of fun, just brewing up for xmas now.
 

Karliboy

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
West Yorkshire
Whitewash envy!
@Karliboy what lime did you use in that whitewash? Looked amazingly persal white. Been doing some here but looks more like old pants white!
View attachment 916990View attachment 916991


Sorry for the delay had a bad week here
I don’t know what the difference is between hydrated cubicle lime and general building lime.
Like I said it always gets 2 coats sometimes 3 and is done most years.
Any new walls always get 3 as they generally suck it in and go dul.
504E6667-F257-43D7-8A72-27443F1987EE.jpeg
 

Kiwi Pete

Member
Livestock Farmer
Sorry if I came across a bit doom and gloom that wasn't my intention. But there is no need for any sympathy at all........ I was lucky enough to watch one of our pre election debates. when our esteemed leader was asked about our greenhouse gas emissions. She said that there was "no need" to go after the low fruit such as transport or vehicles, we need to sort out agriculture first so we can show the world "how to farm with the environment first".

So Som Farmer there is no need to worry about us once we have worked out how to do this profitability, wether it's regen, organic or whatever you can follow our lead and nz agriculture will be able to be seen as the "holy grail" once again.

What home brewing were you referring too?
Ever noticed how Jac is always interviewed close to the camera, so the strings that make her move can't be seen?
 

Rob Garrett

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Derbyshire UK
Sorry for the delay had a bad week here
I don’t know what the difference is between hydrated cubicle lime and general building lime.
Like I said it always gets 2 coats sometimes 3 and is done most years.
Any new walls always get 3 as they generally suck it in and go dul.View attachment 917471
[emoji106] That's where I'm going wrong, need more coats & water from the tap not the trough! Have you been making some brood frames up in that pic?
 

crashbox

Member
Livestock Farmer
1st dry summer we said, good job we had forage reserves, won't see another one like this, for a few years.
the next summer, oh ##### we have to buy forage, chances of one next year, very remote
this spring, oh ##### ##### this is bad, 3rd in a row, do we chance on a good summer, or do we act, to mitigate the impossible happening ? So, we are being careful, edging away from normal, trying different things, to ensure we can survive another one, in that progress, we have discovered, new ways, new crops, different grazing practices, and can honestly say, we look to be in a better position, than before. My view, is to always be pro-active, then you dont get caught, with your trousers down, only halfway !
We are in a similar situation, consistently dry springs and summers, light land, seriously reliant on maize.

So frustrated with ryegrass that we have just put in some cocksfoot/festulolium/herbal leys. I hope they live up to expectation.

Any useful tips on better grazing practices?
 

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
We are in a similar situation, consistently dry springs and summers, light land, seriously reliant on maize.

So frustrated with ryegrass that we have just put in some cocksfoot/festulolium/herbal leys. I hope they live up to expectation.

Any useful tips on better grazing practices?
just quoted your post in drought resistant grass. Have picked up some realy good ideas from this thread. We are tackling in two ways, the crops we grow, double cropping hybrid rye, and maize, giving potential yields of 30+ton/silage acre, protien on the rye, bit low at 10%, but thinking next sample might be higher, 18.7 starch. The idea being, a big bulk heap of silage, from fewer acres, thereby increasing grazing area. We have started to grow, pure silage leys, r/clover r/g, aiming to cut, and bale, every 4/5 weeks, 19.5% prot so far, should help balance the bulk, we have sown vetch, with the rye, hoping to raise the pro in that. Like you, herbs etc, in the grazing leys.
The other half, is trying to improve soil structure, if good, retains more water, and increases fertility, and, of course, absorb more carbon. This we do, with no ploughing, just heavy duty tines, leaving more worms/bugs/fungi, alive. Does seem to make a difference, this year, (3rd year) we have seen mushrooms, where haven't seen for years, more molehills, and interestingly, when working the maize stubble, 10x the normal amount of seagulls, not proof, but encouraging. We use d/d for overseeding as well. One major +, we use paddock, strip graze and back fences, to make it a quick, on/off, max 36 hrs, per patch, as a trial, left one field, with 'longer' breaks, very definitely quick, on/off, difference very noticeable. This, with leaving longer residuals, has resulted in quicker regrowth, or quicker this year, but have had to buffer the dairy with hay, all summer !! Once we actually had rain, mid sept, grass went into overdrive, showing it's drought, not us. Also grow forage rape, for summer grazing, some of that took 8 weeks to emerge. Kale, for outwintering, caught a shower in june, thats gone ballistic as well. The best way forwards, we are not afraid to try new ideas, open mind. The first signs, of 'improved' soil, look really interesting, and done, with no extra cost, of course, might just be coincidence !
 

Fenwick

Member
Location
Bretagne France
We are in a similar situation, consistently dry springs and summers, light land, seriously reliant on maize.

So frustrated with ryegrass that we have just put in some cocksfoot/festulolium/herbal leys. I hope they live up to expectation.

Any useful tips on better grazing practices?

we made the transition away from RG a few years ago it has worked wonders for us.
 

exmoor dave

Member
Location
exmoor, uk
just quoted your post in drought resistant grass. Have picked up some realy good ideas from this thread. We are tackling in two ways, the crops we grow, double cropping hybrid rye, and maize, giving potential yields of 30+ton/silage acre, protien on the rye, bit low at 10%, but thinking next sample might be higher, 18.7 starch. The idea being, a big bulk heap of silage, from fewer acres, thereby increasing grazing area. We have started to grow, pure silage leys, r/clover r/g, aiming to cut, and bale, every 4/5 weeks, 19.5% prot so far, should help balance the bulk, we have sown vetch, with the rye, hoping to raise the pro in that. Like you, herbs etc, in the grazing leys.
The other half, is trying to improve soil structure, if good, retains more water, and increases fertility, and, of course, absorb more carbon. This we do, with no ploughing, just heavy duty tines, leaving more worms/bugs/fungi, alive. Does seem to make a difference, this year, (3rd year) we have seen mushrooms, where haven't seen for years, more molehills, and interestingly, when working the maize stubble, 10x the normal amount of seagulls, not proof, but encouraging. We use d/d for overseeding as well. One major +, we use paddock, strip graze and back fences, to make it a quick, on/off, max 36 hrs, per patch, as a trial, left one field, with 'longer' breaks, very definitely quick, on/off, difference very noticeable. This, with leaving longer residuals, has resulted in quicker regrowth, or quicker this year, but have had to buffer the dairy with hay, all summer !! Once we actually had rain, mid sept, grass went into overdrive, showing it's drought, not us. Also grow forage rape, for summer grazing, some of that took 8 weeks to emerge. Kale, for outwintering, caught a shower in june, thats gone ballistic as well. The best way forwards, we are not afraid to try new ideas, open mind. The first signs, of 'improved' soil, look really interesting, and done, with no extra cost, of course, might just be coincidence !


When do you aim to get your kale sown @som farmer ?
Hoping to get kale in next year and like you, summers are often dry here!
 

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
1 piece on our really dry ground, went in early may, very slow to get going, height now, varying from 12/15 ins to 5/6 feet, on the whole good bulk, but stems are very woody. The other piece, end june, d/d behind some rye, seed was dressed with 'fertilizer', caught a rain shower, never looked back, 4foot tall, lush and green, dairy grazing that, i/c hfrs the other.
Just had another analysis back for our h/rye, disappointed with the first one, this one,
DM 48.5%
CP 9.2
DV 66.2
ME 10.4
STARCH 27.6
at about 18 ton/ac pitted. much better
 

holwellcourtfarm

Member
Livestock Farmer
just quoted your post in drought resistant grass. Have picked up some realy good ideas from this thread. We are tackling in two ways, the crops we grow, double cropping hybrid rye, and maize, giving potential yields of 30+ton/silage acre, protien on the rye, bit low at 10%, but thinking next sample might be higher, 18.7 starch. The idea being, a big bulk heap of silage, from fewer acres, thereby increasing grazing area. We have started to grow, pure silage leys, r/clover r/g, aiming to cut, and bale, every 4/5 weeks, 19.5% prot so far, should help balance the bulk, we have sown vetch, with the rye, hoping to raise the pro in that. Like you, herbs etc, in the grazing leys.
The other half, is trying to improve soil structure, if good, retains more water, and increases fertility, and, of course, absorb more carbon. This we do, with no ploughing, just heavy duty tines, leaving more worms/bugs/fungi, alive. Does seem to make a difference, this year, (3rd year) we have seen mushrooms, where haven't seen for years, more molehills, and interestingly, when working the maize stubble, 10x the normal amount of seagulls, not proof, but encouraging. We use d/d for overseeding as well. One major +, we use paddock, strip graze and back fences, to make it a quick, on/off, max 36 hrs, per patch, as a trial, left one field, with 'longer' breaks, very definitely quick, on/off, difference very noticeable. This, with leaving longer residuals, has resulted in quicker regrowth, or quicker this year, but have had to buffer the dairy with hay, all summer !! Once we actually had rain, mid sept, grass went into overdrive, showing it's drought, not us. Also grow forage rape, for summer grazing, some of that took 8 weeks to emerge. Kale, for outwintering, caught a shower in june, thats gone ballistic as well. The best way forwards, we are not afraid to try new ideas, open mind. The first signs, of 'improved' soil, look really interesting, and done, with no extra cost, of course, might just be coincidence !
Have you tried Lucerne?

Can you direct drill a mix of maize and pulses (into established pasture) to give you a high protein silage?
 

Kiwi Pete

Member
Livestock Farmer
We are in a similar situation, consistently dry springs and summers, light land, seriously reliant on maize.

So frustrated with ryegrass that we have just put in some cocksfoot/festulolium/herbal leys. I hope they live up to expectation.

Any useful tips on better grazing practices?
Short duration, hard grazings with good recovery periods in between times (y) keep your 'leaves big and stalks small'
 
Last edited:

som farmer

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
somerset
Have you tried Lucerne?

Can you direct drill a mix of maize and pulses (into established pasture) to give you a high protein silage?
i'd worry about the maize being not aggressive enough, to compete with the rest.
lucerne in a mix, for either grazing, or cutting, so far, to many negative comments, we have 'done' enough new things, this last couple of years, to be in danger, of 'to many fingers, into to many crops'. But, have grown lucerne, and will try again, when we know more, about the things we have done.
 

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