Chezza
Member
- Location
- North Yorks
Does the 4.25 metre carrier suffer from "wing bounce"?. I'm wanting a stubble cultivater and this one is on the short list against a guttler supermaxx or Claydon Terrastar
Is a Vaderstaad Carrier or equivalent a useful implement to have ?
- Thread starter Pilatus
- Start date
Warp Land Farmer
Member
- Location
- Hazzard County
The one we have doesn’t, it travels fine.
benferg
Member
- Location
- North Canterbury, NZ
Im curious. Can you please quantify a fraction.
Proforge are here in nz and the purchase price isn’t that different from a carrier. 80 k vs 95.
A mate bought a proforge and I have a carrier. They are still trying to get his to work consistently.
- Location
- leics/warks border
How does the Simba Express compare to the carrier.
simon-0116
Member
- Location
- Sheffield
A lot heavier and different press.
X pres more like a set of disc and press.
Admiadly we use carrier only but 2 deep passes but no were as good as neighbours 1pass with express.
Carrier level Finnish
Express leaves ridges
A proforge falls to bits in 3 years compared to the carrier and depreciation will be shocking.
benferg
Member
- Location
- North Canterbury, NZ
I have to admit I was wrong on the price of a pro forge.
It was 35 k less than a XL carrier.
Sadly though it’s not holding together very well (admittedly in tough conditions).
Bednar is available over here, of the Eastern European gear it seems quite good. Is there much of It in the uk?
Any way, back to direct drilling....
It was 35 k less than a XL carrier.
Sadly though it’s not holding together very well (admittedly in tough conditions).
Bednar is available over here, of the Eastern European gear it seems quite good. Is there much of It in the uk?
Any way, back to direct drilling....
Last edited:
- Location
- south norfolk
Have you seen one fall to bits.id be interested to hear about it or see pictures.in my opinion the machine is very solidly built.ill admit depreciation may be worse than a carrier as the implement in question is substantially cheaper to start with so % wise there will not be much in it
Nick...
I might be wrong, but to me Proforge cultivation equipment looks exactly like polish company's Rolmako equivalents only painted red instead of blue.
I've been using Rolmako 4m mounted disc harrow U693, equivalent of Proforge Inverta, for 5 years and I can say about it:
- It's cheaper to buy then Proforge,
- For shallow mixing at higher speeds it does a good job. And as I have string tubular roller on it I can start working on a stubble field in the spring while it's still relatively wet. (then wait to dry and drill with Mzuri) I tried doing the same with packer type roller and it plugs up so much easier. In dry conditions in stubble after harvest you would want much heavier roller. That's where Vaddy Carrier excells IMO.
- I have the version with replaceable, greaseable bearing hubs, so after about 1500 ha last year I replace bearings in 5 hubs. (1 fell of the axis in the field the other 4 had too much sideways movement so I decided to replace them). There are 2 bearings and a seal in the hub (I payed less than 10€). It's quite easy to replace even with primitive tools.
on a bean stubble in the spring quite wet
I've been using Rolmako 4m mounted disc harrow U693, equivalent of Proforge Inverta, for 5 years and I can say about it:
- It's cheaper to buy then Proforge,
- For shallow mixing at higher speeds it does a good job. And as I have string tubular roller on it I can start working on a stubble field in the spring while it's still relatively wet. (then wait to dry and drill with Mzuri) I tried doing the same with packer type roller and it plugs up so much easier. In dry conditions in stubble after harvest you would want much heavier roller. That's where Vaddy Carrier excells IMO.
- I have the version with replaceable, greaseable bearing hubs, so after about 1500 ha last year I replace bearings in 5 hubs. (1 fell of the axis in the field the other 4 had too much sideways movement so I decided to replace them). There are 2 bearings and a seal in the hub (I payed less than 10€). It's quite easy to replace even with primitive tools.
on a bean stubble in the spring quite wetAttachments
benferg
Member
- Location
- North Canterbury, NZ
I will get some photos. I think the weakness is in the area of the rear roller. And support frame.
The guy said it’s where you set the pin height.
The carrier has the rubber ring around the roller bearing. I think in stony ground this takes a huge amount of shock out of the system. Maybe the proforge needs to look at something similar.
Loss of value on a trade is important, as is longevity.
A neighbouring farmer has a 6m one and is not overly impressed as it is starting to fall to bits after 2 years. They do farm 2500 acres though but that is still not good enough and not all those acres are cultivated with it.
- Location
- Bourne, Lincolnshire
As well as selling New Proforge, we see all brands and models of used short-discs through our yard, some of them traded in against New Proforge and some of them just bought in for resale. All of them have their strong points and bad points, and one man’s meat is another man’s poison!
We have some customers loving the Vaderstad Carrier because of its ability to work so shallow, and the next one slating the fact that you cant pressure down the wings, thereby getting bounce in dry conditions. We have some customers saying the Simba Great Plains X-Press is the best because you can adjust the angle of the discs and the next one trading it in for a simpler fixed-angle disc machine because every adjustable pivot is another wear point that gets sloppy in time, or alternatively, seizes solid through never being adjusted. The next man wants a Heva Disc-Rolla because it folds hydraulically and has hyd depth adjustment on the discs, but then we’ve just traded one in against a new Proforge because he was tired of recurring packer and disc bearing failure.
Often it comes down to price/affordability. We acknowledge that some customers will pay more for a 2 year old Horsch Joker or Vaderstad Carrier than you can buy a new Proforge Inverta/InvertaMax for. This is because they are sticking with a brand they know and maybe want a second machine to match with what they already have/know and we respect that. We currently have a 2014 Great Plains X-Press 5.5 metre we have re-disced that is up for the same price as we sell a new 5 metre Inverta, mainly based on its cost price when it was new.
We have already had customers trade-in their Inverta’s with us and gone for the same again, only wider, or opted for trailed instead of mounted, so we know customers are happy with the machines and their capabilities. From the trade-backs we have done we reckon on them depreciating at around 20% the first year and 10% per year thereafter, which is comparable with all the other main brands. However 20% depreciation is obviously a lot greater cash loss on a premium brand (£40,000) than it is on a Proforge at £25,000, so cost of ownership is as much a consideration as the initial outlay.
We have only sold a couple of replacement SKF sealed bearing unit for the discs and have over 230 machines out there now, so we know that we have no problems there. We also have piles of replacement discs on the shelf here; we have not sold many yet as they are wearing far better than we expected, with some machines known to have done over 6000 acres since they were first sold in 2015.
The only ones that we are aware of in the UK “falling to bits” is one that took down a tree at the edge of a field and another one that a towing pin came out and it ended up in a ditch…neither hardly the fault of the machine, and both repaired under insurance claims. The only other current outstanding case we are aware of is a customer waiting for some replacement mudguard brackets, because the originals cracked through – subsequent models have an improved bracket design.
It is possible that there is another one out there that has caused issues that we don’t know about, and we would like to know, but it could be that it doesn’t qualify for warranty repair due to mis-use or accidental damage, such as the examples above.
For the benefit of the NZ contributor
New Zealand pre-dominantly have the InvertaMax model, which is the much heavier model, and yes, there were some problems in the rear packer arm areas, because they were not proportionately stronger to cope with the 50% extra weight of that model. Many of these have now been modified and all March 2018 onward models have significantly thicker arms and additional structural bracing in that area.
As with any machine manufacturer on the market, we welcome feedback and are continuously improving.
We could show you the weak spots and some weld repairs on the used machines we have in the yard currently (Vaderstad, Amazone, Rabe, Heva, Simba Great Plains etc) so no manufacturer has managed to get it perfect yet!
As mentioned in another thread, we work with Rolmako as a factory for some of our machines, however, they aren’t simply painted red. https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index...price-to-good-to-be-true.269672/#post-5926594
There are many testimonials from users who would recommend Proforge…mostly they sell themselves, often by neighbour recommendation, or on-farm demonstration, and often pitched against much higher priced competition. Please shout if you would like to see one working or want to make contact with someone near you that has one.
''My father has farmed here since 1964. We've tried a number of brands over the years and these are the best set of discs we have ever had!... Does everything it says on the tin. We've been running at 15 kph and we're on heavy land. Worked in wet and dry weather. Can't praise it enough.''
Peter Burt - W Burt & Son, South Wootton, Kings Lynn.
'We bought our InvertaMax last summer (2017) after seeing the Agri-Linc Stand at Cereals the year before. We decided it would be a good machine for our farm. Since purchasing it, it has worked around 600ha of land with very little wear to the discs despite our sandy soils. We purchased it to reduce the amount of ploughing we did on the farm and it forms a good seedbed for drilling. Overall it has reduced our land work costs dramatically.
We chose the InvertaMax over the Inverta as we chop our Rye straw, therefore we needed the weight of the larger machine to fully incorporate the amount of straw. The only cost to the machine is the scrapers on the rear roller wear quickly however they are easy to replace. The sales and service team are very helpful and the service from the initial interest in the machine through to the delivery was excellent. We wouldn't hesitate to recommend Agri-Linc and their products to anyone.'
Testimonial from TAG Farming
We have some customers loving the Vaderstad Carrier because of its ability to work so shallow, and the next one slating the fact that you cant pressure down the wings, thereby getting bounce in dry conditions. We have some customers saying the Simba Great Plains X-Press is the best because you can adjust the angle of the discs and the next one trading it in for a simpler fixed-angle disc machine because every adjustable pivot is another wear point that gets sloppy in time, or alternatively, seizes solid through never being adjusted. The next man wants a Heva Disc-Rolla because it folds hydraulically and has hyd depth adjustment on the discs, but then we’ve just traded one in against a new Proforge because he was tired of recurring packer and disc bearing failure.
Often it comes down to price/affordability. We acknowledge that some customers will pay more for a 2 year old Horsch Joker or Vaderstad Carrier than you can buy a new Proforge Inverta/InvertaMax for. This is because they are sticking with a brand they know and maybe want a second machine to match with what they already have/know and we respect that. We currently have a 2014 Great Plains X-Press 5.5 metre we have re-disced that is up for the same price as we sell a new 5 metre Inverta, mainly based on its cost price when it was new.
We have already had customers trade-in their Inverta’s with us and gone for the same again, only wider, or opted for trailed instead of mounted, so we know customers are happy with the machines and their capabilities. From the trade-backs we have done we reckon on them depreciating at around 20% the first year and 10% per year thereafter, which is comparable with all the other main brands. However 20% depreciation is obviously a lot greater cash loss on a premium brand (£40,000) than it is on a Proforge at £25,000, so cost of ownership is as much a consideration as the initial outlay.
We have only sold a couple of replacement SKF sealed bearing unit for the discs and have over 230 machines out there now, so we know that we have no problems there. We also have piles of replacement discs on the shelf here; we have not sold many yet as they are wearing far better than we expected, with some machines known to have done over 6000 acres since they were first sold in 2015.
The only ones that we are aware of in the UK “falling to bits” is one that took down a tree at the edge of a field and another one that a towing pin came out and it ended up in a ditch…neither hardly the fault of the machine, and both repaired under insurance claims. The only other current outstanding case we are aware of is a customer waiting for some replacement mudguard brackets, because the originals cracked through – subsequent models have an improved bracket design.
It is possible that there is another one out there that has caused issues that we don’t know about, and we would like to know, but it could be that it doesn’t qualify for warranty repair due to mis-use or accidental damage, such as the examples above.
For the benefit of the NZ contributor
New Zealand pre-dominantly have the InvertaMax model, which is the much heavier model, and yes, there were some problems in the rear packer arm areas, because they were not proportionately stronger to cope with the 50% extra weight of that model. Many of these have now been modified and all March 2018 onward models have significantly thicker arms and additional structural bracing in that area.
As with any machine manufacturer on the market, we welcome feedback and are continuously improving.
We could show you the weak spots and some weld repairs on the used machines we have in the yard currently (Vaderstad, Amazone, Rabe, Heva, Simba Great Plains etc) so no manufacturer has managed to get it perfect yet!
As mentioned in another thread, we work with Rolmako as a factory for some of our machines, however, they aren’t simply painted red. https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index...price-to-good-to-be-true.269672/#post-5926594
There are many testimonials from users who would recommend Proforge…mostly they sell themselves, often by neighbour recommendation, or on-farm demonstration, and often pitched against much higher priced competition. Please shout if you would like to see one working or want to make contact with someone near you that has one.
''My father has farmed here since 1964. We've tried a number of brands over the years and these are the best set of discs we have ever had!... Does everything it says on the tin. We've been running at 15 kph and we're on heavy land. Worked in wet and dry weather. Can't praise it enough.''
Peter Burt - W Burt & Son, South Wootton, Kings Lynn.
'We bought our InvertaMax last summer (2017) after seeing the Agri-Linc Stand at Cereals the year before. We decided it would be a good machine for our farm. Since purchasing it, it has worked around 600ha of land with very little wear to the discs despite our sandy soils. We purchased it to reduce the amount of ploughing we did on the farm and it forms a good seedbed for drilling. Overall it has reduced our land work costs dramatically.
We chose the InvertaMax over the Inverta as we chop our Rye straw, therefore we needed the weight of the larger machine to fully incorporate the amount of straw. The only cost to the machine is the scrapers on the rear roller wear quickly however they are easy to replace. The sales and service team are very helpful and the service from the initial interest in the machine through to the delivery was excellent. We wouldn't hesitate to recommend Agri-Linc and their products to anyone.'
Testimonial from TAG Farming
- Location
- E Yorks
A lesson to all manufacturers and importers here of how to put your case in a clear and polite way without offending anybody, rather than let an unfair sh!t storm develop or get drawn into a full on slagging match both of which we have seen recently on here. Well done and keep up the good work and your support of this forum.
- Location
- E Yorks
Just seen this thread on the iPhone App following my last post and hilariously following my last comment about a 'sh!t Storm' that's what the avatar Video is for the thread!! Well done who ever wrote the algorithm for the App Hilarious!!