so while we have jobless areas crying out for well paid jobs such as mining, steel making etc, the govt is happy to pay or allow foreign derived wood chip to come into the country, losing out on paying our own people in deprived parts of the uk a decent wage ? yet the massive ironey that i see the pollution still comes from the burning whever it be coal or wood chips, nor alone the montrous subsity? totally out of order in my view in all counts ?
IS GREEN RENEWABLE ENERGY A CON?
- Thread starter bluebell
- Start date
- Location
- Lincolnshire
Wasnt coal and oil wood at one point?... its renewable but takes a little longer than 150 years.
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76masseyman
Member
- Location
- Lincolncestershire
12 to 14 hour road trip then !
Tarw Coch
Member
- Location
- Bottom of Wats Dyke
Sounds fair enough to me, so the crops I feed my cows come from a renewable source and I can feed as much South American Soya and maize as I like because according to that logic any emissions growing those crops will be counted against the country of origin. Chuck in a bit of carbon sequestration on my grass land and bobs your uncle I’m carbon neutral
tullah
Member
- Location
- Linconshire
It goes back to the preaching Harry and Meghan again.
Export of recycle stuff has been banned now at least in the EU
- Location
- Lincolnshire
Question then is; is it a good idea to cut down a 150 year old tree to supply electricity for a car for 4 days?
New Puritan
Member
- Location
- East Sussex
I find this thread slightly depressing. 5 pages in and nobody's mentioned all the opportunities that renewable energy might offer to farmers:
Wind turbines
Solar panels - not just on fields but on shed roofs etc.
Growing OSR for biodiesel
Growing wheat or sugarbeet for bioethanol
AD plants for muck / slurry / maize to make biomethane
Straw for electricity
And probably lots of other things not in my mind at the moment. Sure not all farmers can do all of them but that's the case with most types of farming.
Wind turbines
Solar panels - not just on fields but on shed roofs etc.
Growing OSR for biodiesel
Growing wheat or sugarbeet for bioethanol
AD plants for muck / slurry / maize to make biomethane
Straw for electricity
And probably lots of other things not in my mind at the moment. Sure not all farmers can do all of them but that's the case with most types of farming.
Exactly
Donkey Oaty
Member
- Location
- Aberdeenshire
There are lots of farmers who are investing in such, and good luck to them.
But the OP's question is are these schemes a con?
Are these alternative means of generation a step forward in terms of energy efficiency, cost and emission control? Or, are they box ticking schemes to meet a government target?
Is it Green, to transport woodchip from USA to Drax?
Is it Green to transport straw from Aberdeenshire to Lincolnshire to burn it?
Is it Green to have biomass boilers heating sheds which are only drying potatoes or bulbs part of the year?
Is it Green to take grass to an AD plant from miles around to ferment it to produce gas?
I think not, in many cases, and the public are being conned in the part of their bills they pay for renewable electricity.
New Puritan
Member
- Location
- East Sussex
I don't think they're a "con" as such. I do not know the specifics of some of the things in your list, but by and large people producing renewables need to be able to demonstrate that there are carbon savings from doing what they are doing. Certainly this is the case with AD plants and bioethanol/biodiesel.
Shipping bulk goods long distances by boat doesn't require as much energy as people assume.
- Location
- Cumbria
Well, I think we can establish those who have missed the renewables Klondike then.
Lots of untruth's in some of the posts and a massive lack of research.
There are several basic elements we need to sustain our way of life.
Food, Water and Fuel, the only natural one we know, is water, it falls out of the sky. We then play a hand in storing it, and distributing it around.
We produce food and fuel, which do we need the most ? Without food we die, without fuel we have no way of manufacturing and distributing food, so the same end result.
Food and Fuel and both subsidised, some twice or even multiple times depending what initiatives are about at the time.
Fossil fuels are dirty, and have huge CO2 emissions as well as several other toxics, renewables offer an alternative alongside, however it all looks rather pointless if the renewables supply chain in loaded with CO2 and exceeds that of fossil fuels.
That is why we have such things as the sustainability criteria.
Lots of untruth's in some of the posts and a massive lack of research.
There are several basic elements we need to sustain our way of life.
Food, Water and Fuel, the only natural one we know, is water, it falls out of the sky. We then play a hand in storing it, and distributing it around.
We produce food and fuel, which do we need the most ? Without food we die, without fuel we have no way of manufacturing and distributing food, so the same end result.
Food and Fuel and both subsidised, some twice or even multiple times depending what initiatives are about at the time.
Fossil fuels are dirty, and have huge CO2 emissions as well as several other toxics, renewables offer an alternative alongside, however it all looks rather pointless if the renewables supply chain in loaded with CO2 and exceeds that of fossil fuels.
That is why we have such things as the sustainability criteria.
- Location
- Lincolnshire
Worth remembering Drax is where it is to reduce "coal miles"
- Location
- Glen Clova, Angus, DD8 4RD
Steel is still recycled abroad.
I was referring to plastics sorry.
We got a lot of British Start ups and new tech that can recycle it here in the UK and revitilise communities with it.
- Location
- Glen Clova, Angus, DD8 4RD
Wind turbines Agreed. Excellent technology.
Solar panels - not just on fields but on shed roofs etc. Agreed. Excellent technology.
Growing OSR for biodiesel If the OSR is grown using fossil inputs and fossil fuels are used in transporting and processing it then is it really doing any good?
Growing wheat or sugarbeet for bioethanol As above.
AD plants for muck / slurry / maize to make biomethane Using waste on farm or brought in it's a great idea. Growing feedstock crops specifically, especially using fossil derived inputs, is questionable.
Straw for electricity Shouldn't the straw be retained as a soil cover and improver really?
I'm not knocking any farm that does these things, it's simply a commercial decision, but the rules encouraging some of them are actually not compatible with the supposed outcomes being sought.
- Location
- Cumbria
- Location
- Glen Clova, Angus, DD8 4RD
IS the maize grown without using any diesel, fertiliser or sprays?
An AD plant using food waste or farm waste is making good use of a product that would need dealing with anyway.