Is my vet taking the pee!

[Lowland1]

Your wife’s (hope she is recovering) treatment sounds cheap but then it depends what she is receiving. One of the big issues in the uk is that no one has an appreciation how much medical care actually costs due to the NHS.

All German inputs but it’s very true if you had to pay for Granddads treatments people might baulk a bit. We have BUPA but as soon as hospitals and doctors here know what insurance you have prices skyrocket which is probably the same with Veterinary Treatment.

 

[Farmer Fin]

All German inputs but it’s very true if you had to pay for Granddads treatments people might baulk a bit. We have BUPA but as soon as hospitals and doctors here know what insurance you have prices skyrocket which is probably the same with Veterinary Treatment.

You’re not allowed to charge differently between insurance and self pay clients. Your are right though that insurance allows people to spend up to a limit though. The issue that they are seeing now is the limits haven’t moved in 10 years but the cost of treatment and advanced options has.

 

[Cowgirl]

The problem is that you can’t compare costs between practices. Referral practices that employ vets with strings of specialist qualifications after their names and years of training and experience, plus the very best nurses, facilities and equipment (x ray, ultrasound, CT, MRI, Swiss metal implants) have to charge fees to pay for all that. Cruciate rupture is a common condition (in farm dogs often accidental from catching a leg on a gate or quad and hanging / twisting the leg) and they are not likely to do it again with the other leg, but the repair has to be very good indeed to ensure that dog is fully fit afterwards and back to work with no long term effects. Any delay in surgical treatment will inevitably lead to arthritic changes in the joint due to instability, and any thing less than perfect may lead to that dog being useless for work. Some get better with cage rest but some don’t, especially bigger dogs. Many practitioners can do an operation, and may be quite good at it, but if it was my dog I would know who I would want to operate on it, and it wouldn’t be a general practitioner. The problem with orthopedics is that anything that goes wrong rapidly leads to disaster and there are no second chances for a working dog - it may lose the leg, especially if it gets infected. If it is a pet, there is more leeway but the dog may still end up permanently lame. This is why, despite being a vet, all my animals are insured with a lifetime policy with the maximum payout - orthopedics is the most expensive specialty and you get what you pay for! It is true that the NHS means we have no idea what operations cost. My son needed a shoulder operation after a rugby injury 13 years ago. The NHS only offered him physio but he was losing function in his right arm and had exams coming up. We had to go privately- it cost £5000 and I sold my car to pay for it. Five years ago I thought I might have to have an operation and was quoted £15000. God knows how much it would cost now.

 

[MRT]

despite being a vet,... My son needed a shoulder operation..We had to go privately-... sold my car to pay for it.

And people will insist on saying vets are overpaid

 

[thorpe]

And people will insist on saying vets are overpaid

yes but they may have had to sell thier house if the vet had done the op not just the car!

 

[Cowgirl]

yes but they may have had to sell thier house if the vet had done the op not just the car!

I loved that Land Rover 110...

 

[Lowland1]

If my tractor breaks down and the cost of repair is more than either its value or the cost of a new one then it's unlikely to be repaired. Maybe people need to be a bit more hard nosed when it comes to animals. Often surgery and the inactivity that comes after surgery is worse that the actual injury with a person they can accept the reasoning and the consequences animals cannot.

 

[Farmer Fin]

If my tractor breaks down and the cost of repair is more than either its value or the cost of a new one then it's unlikely to be repaired. Maybe people need to be a bit more hard nosed when it comes to animals. Often surgery and the inactivity that comes after surgery is worse that the actual injury with a person they can accept the reasoning and the consequences animals cannot.

You are right that just because you can doesn’t mean you should. I do think some of the stuff that goes on in small and equine practice has questionable ethics.
As for talking comparing it to tractors; the way I look at it is about emotional enjoyment. How many people buy over specked tractors with all the bells and whistles - a waste of money. Were you not trying to convince your good lady to let you buy GPS for a tractor and she told you it was a waste of money? I know I keep looking at it myself and always come back to it being a nice toy to have but it won’t make me more profitable.

 

[Lowland1]

You are right that just because you can doesn’t mean you should. I do think some of the stuff that goes on in small and equine practice has questionable ethics.
As for talking comparing it to tractors; the way I look at it is about emotional enjoyment. How many people buy over specked tractors with all the bells and whistles - a waste of money. Were you not trying to convince your good lady to let you buy GPS for a tractor and she told you it was a waste of money? I know I keep looking at it myself and always come back to it being a nice toy to have but it won’t make me more profitable.

I think that is the point i have been trying to get across but floundering a bit in putting it down inoffensively. We have nine dogs and a cat plus some semi wild farm cats and we try to look after them but we have to be practical having a wife as a Vet helps a lot but once you get beyond stitching and plastercasts then you might be going a bit far. That however is a personal opinion but i do believe a lot of vet work is treating the owner as well as the animal. My father in law was a surgeon and wasnted my wife to be a doctor however she felt she couldn’t deal with people so did Veterinary instead however she says dealing with the owners was far worse than she ever imagined the animals were grateful the owners not so.

 

[Dry Rot]

I think that is the point i have been trying to get across but floundering a bit in putting it down inoffensively. We have nine dogs and a cat plus some semi wild farm cats and we try to look after them but we have to be practical having a wife as a Vet helps a lot but once you get beyond stitching and plastercasts then you might be going a bit far. That however is a personal opinion but i do believe a lot of vet work is treating the owner as well as the animal. My father in law was a surgeon and wasnted my wife to be a doctor however she felt she couldn’t deal with people so did Veterinary instead however she says dealing with the owners was far worse than she ever imagined the animals were grateful the owners not so.

^^^^ One of the reasons I am grateful I didn't become a vet. I think a lot of problems are due to poor management. They certainly are with little girls and their ponies, not to mention obese dogs. Before vet college, I used to attend the local vet surgery to watch operations. I was not impressed when during an operation the vet turned to his nurse and said, about an old lady's peke, "I hope we can keep this one going, it's a nice little earner".

One of my vets (I use several because I shop around!) complained that I never call him out. I replied, "That's because my animals aren't ill". It seems you are a neglectful owner these days if the vet isn't called out regularly. Why? I was at vet college long enough to become a fair judge and I'm sorry to say that to many veterinary surgery is no longer a profession, it has become a trade. Probably why practices are being taken over by big business. I recently had a small local practice castrate a colt. The cost was almost half that of the big practice that had been taken over and did one the year before.

 

[andyt87]

I was not impressed when during an operation the vet turned to his nurse and said, about an old lady's peke, "I hope we can keep this one going, it's a nice little earner".

I was at vet college long enough to become a fair judge and I'm sorry to say that to many veterinary surgery is no longer a profession, it has become a trade. Probably why practices are being taken over by big business.

Hope you don't mind me only quoting part of your post, but I'm not sure if you saw the Ben Fogle programme with the ex vets in Pembrokeshire?

Bloke had been ostracised by the profession for basically saying the same as you, but to the press. Here's a link to his article.

Why I'm ashamed to be a vet: a shocking exposé of the profession that puts pets through 'painful and unnecessary treatments to fleece their trusting owners'

For eight years Matthew Watkinson worked as a vet. But are vets really the saints they are made out to be? Here, Matthew, 32, now an author, exposes the uncuddly truth about vets that every animal lover should read. . .

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Lowland1]

^^^^ One of the reasons I am grateful I didn't become a vet. I think a lot of problems are due to poor management. They certainly are with little girls and their ponies, not to mention obese dogs. Before vet college, I used to attend the local vet surgery to watch operations. I was not impressed when during an operation the vet turned to his nurse and said, about an old lady's peke, "I hope we can keep this one going, it's a nice little earner".

One of my vets (I use several because I shop around!) complained that I never call him out. I replied, "That's because my animals aren't ill". It seems you are a neglectful owner these days if the vet isn't called out regularly. Why? I was at vet college long enough to become a fair judge and I'm sorry to say that to many veterinary surgery is no longer a profession, it has become a trade. Probably why practices are being taken over by big business. I recently had a small local practice castrate a colt. The cost was almost half that of the big practice that had been taken over and did one the year before.

Hope you don't mind me only quoting part of your post, but I'm not sure if you saw the Ben Fogle programme with the ex vets in Pembrokeshire?

Bloke had been ostracised by the profession for basically saying the same as you, but to the press. Here's a link to his article.

Why I'm ashamed to be a vet: a shocking exposé of the profession that puts pets through 'painful and unnecessary treatments to fleece their trusting owners'

For eight years Matthew Watkinson worked as a vet. But are vets really the saints they are made out to be? Here, Matthew, 32, now an author, exposes the uncuddly truth about vets that every animal lover should read. . .

www.dailymail.co.uk

When money is concerned things change as i’ve said my wifes family are all in medicine and they say it’s changed from a vocation to as you say a trade it is not about the patient (animal or human) other than what can be extracted from them.

 

[Dry Rot]

When money is concerned things change as i’ve said my wifes family are all in medicine and they say it’s changed from a vocation to as you say a trade it is not about the patient (animal or human) other than what can be extracted from them.

I can't open the link for some reason but can anticipate what it says. I have known good vets and bad vets. I used to export my gundogs years ago (to over 30 countries world-wide) and always needed a vet certificate for air travel so I would ways shop around for the cheapest certificate as I knew the dogs would be 100% fit. (High rate rate is something that was regularly spotted -- due to the stress of travelling and not indicative of a heart problem! as I regularly had to point out!). One year I got a very low quote, so obviously took my dog to that vet. It turned out to be an assistant with a grudge who was working out her notice prior to emigrating to Australia. She did not hold back and I got a catalogue of dirty tricks she'd come across from spreading rumours about local non-existent epidemics of some highly contagious disease requiring vaccinations to incorrect diagnosis to bump up fees. I have enough knowledge to have spotted a few of the latter over the years and I am now a dyed in the wool cynic.

 

[Longlowdog]

I have absolute faith in my local independent vet practise. They do large and small animal and have refused offers to sell out to Global-hyper-mega-vet-corp with their urban, insurance raping pricing policies. Whether horses, sheep or dogs and cats they will provide gold, silver and bronze standard responses to problems and they do not pass judgement if we tell them our pockets only extend to bronze standard treatment this month. They were open to my suggestions regarding braces for A.C.L . I can understand why some folk have cause to slate their vets and their bills but I would hate to see all the good guys tarred with the same brush.
When I can get a Cesar' done at 4am on Easter Sunday morning for £130, (performed by a pleasant, smiling vet) on one of my pedigree ewes then I think them worthy of defending.

 

[Adeptandy]

You are right that just because you can doesn’t mean you should. I do think some of the stuff that goes on in small and equine practice has questionable ethics.
As for talking comparing it to tractors; the way I look at it is about emotional enjoyment. How many people buy over specked tractors with all the bells and whistles - a waste of money. Were you not trying to convince your good lady to let you buy GPS for a tractor and she told you it was a waste of money? I know I keep looking at it myself and always come back to it being a nice toy to have but it won’t make me more profitable.

On my patch I cant justify the expense, but when I add what it gains me being to run a separate business while drilling from the tractor it starts to pay for itself easily.

 

[Longlowdog]

Paying my vet to ensure that my livestock and my pets (who may also work according to their breed) are looked after to the best of our combined abilities allows me to sleep at night and that is priceless. No sheep either pedigree or little 'runt' is ever just a sheep, no dog is just a dog, a tool to be used and cast aside. I sleep like a log and will continue to do so with the help of my vet.

 

[Christina1]

@Sprayer 1, Is the Burton on Trent specialists the same as Derby? Just found out my dog has a cruciate ligament tear in her back leg and we were advised option 1: in-house operation aound 1800-2kbut results might not be great. Option 2 is specilists near Derby (I'm assuming might be these guys?) but the vet was suggesting this might be 3.5-4k. Just seems incredibally steep for a cruciate ligament tear. TIA

 

[The Seeker]

My dog did that it was either a 2k operation with possible success or 6 weeks Kennel rest , I did kennel rest , dog was fine, this is my experience I’m not saying you should follow what we did but that’s what happened with us

 

[Hampton]

@Sprayer 1, Is the Burton on Trent specialists the same as Derby? Just found out my dog has a cruciate ligament tear in her back leg and we were advised option 1: in-house operation aound 1800-2kbut results might not be great. Option 2 is specilists near Derby (I'm assuming might be these guys?) but the vet was suggesting this might be 3.5-4k. Just seems incredibally steep for a cruciate ligament tear. TIA

I’m assume he’s referring to west mid referrals at Alrewas.
If so, I can’t praise them highly enough.
I ran my Labrador over 3 years ago and made a total mess of his front leg.
It was Saturday at 5pm.
Took him to local vets.
They sedated him, kept him in, sedated him again, overdosed him, atropined him as they thought they had killed him, sedated him again then monitored him.
They kept him in until 4pm on the Sunday.
Cost £1900.
On Monday they rang to refer him and recommended west mid refs.
I took him there for 10am. They operated (smashed ankle and dislocation, frame on leg etc.)
Took him home.
Gave me loads of dressing but leg smelled bad so they asked me to take him back in. Course of antibiotics and redress.
long story short, the 6 months of aftercare and the operation cost me £2000.
Or
£100 more than the local vets
Dog now walks with slight limp but is a happy active dog.

 

[maikleoliver]

I would ask your vet to give you different options for either referral or fixation techniques and remind them of the insurance limit.