Is their a future in farming?

[toquark]

No, that's prostitution.

They gotta eat!

 

[flowerpot]

We're going to need some details. For the OP obviously...

Farm manager married the farmer's daughter, that's from a long time ago. Their son is now farming.
Farmer with 3 daughters and a big farm has his son-in-law(s) farming, that one is quite close.

OP - you are in the YFC?

 

[toquark]

Farm manager married the farmer's daughter, that's from a long time ago. Their son is now farming.
Farmer with 3 daughters and a big farm has his son-in-law(s) farming, that one is quite close.

OP - you are in the YFC?

Sorry I thought you meant you had a little list of single, brotherless farmer's daughters. Which in the wrong hands could be simultaneously dangerous, exploitative and *cough* very profitable.

 

[flowerpot]

Sorry I thought you meant you had a little list of single, brotherless farmer's daughters. Which in the wrong hands could be simultaneously dangerous, exploitative and *cough* very profitable.

Not at the moment! I did try to point my son towards one farmer's daughter with a sister but no brothers!
Didn't work, don't blame him really.

 

[The Grinch]

I’m afraid the answer in my opinion is no. 25 years ago milking 60 cows gave you a good living, same price for milk as you receive now, calf trade nearly as much and replacement heifers were half as much as today. Corn,fertiliser,medicines,vets,diesel etc have all nearly doubled in price and the experts tell you to go bigger, milk more cows, buy/rent more ground at a substantial outlay. The money invested in land, cows and machinery for the small man doesn’t stack up for the returns. I work off the farm and help when not at work, what is plainly evident is that an unskilled worker in other industries will earn a better wage (with overtime) than a fully skilled worker in the agricultural sector, (madness in my opinion). I can go to work on a Sunday for more money than I pay a man to spread muck with a tractor and spreader. It’s sad and sometimes when you look over the fence going to work and see someone farming you think to yourself if only it was me but the thought soon passes because unfortunately the sums don’t stack up. Also the general public don’t give a toss about food and where it comes from, they want it as cheap as possible so they can buy the next IPhone or packet of fags etc and the other issue is the impact that farming allegedly is having on the environment, all the ag bashers blaming us for every mortal thing. More rules, more regulations, more cost. I read on this forum of posters expanding and admire their braveness, dedication and business plan and look on in envy. In my opinion the decision for the op of whether to go into farming in the uk is whether it’s for money or an enjoyable lifestyle,

 

[Dian Landman]

I’m afraid the answer in my opinion is no. 25 years ago milking 60 cows gave you a good living, same price for milk as you receive now, calf trade nearly as much and replacement heifers were half as much as today. Corn,fertiliser,medicines,vets,diesel etc have all nearly doubled in price and the experts tell you to go bigger, milk more cows, buy/rent more ground at a substantial outlay. The money invested in land, cows and machinery for the small man doesn’t stack up for the returns. I work off the farm and help when not at work, what is plainly evident is that an unskilled worker in other industries will earn a better wage (with overtime) than a fully skilled worker in the agricultural sector, (madness in my opinion). I can go to work on a Sunday for more money than I pay a man to spread muck with a tractor and spreader. It’s sad and sometimes when you look over the fence going to work and see someone farming you think to yourself if only it was me but the thought soon passes because unfortunately the sums don’t stack up. Also the general public don’t give a toss about food and where it comes from, they want it as cheap as possible so they can buy the next IPhone or packet of fags etc and the other issue is the impact that farming allegedly is having on the environment, all the ag bashers blaming us for every mortal thing. More rules, more regulations, more cost. I read on this forum of posters expanding and admire their braveness, dedication and business plan and look on in envy. In my opinion the decision for the op of whether to go into farming in the uk is whether it’s for money or an enjoyable lifestyle,

Out of interest what gets seen as an economical dairy unit in the UK? In South Africa we cant really do anything smaller than 500 cows to make it worth while.

 

[ollie989898]

I’m afraid the answer in my opinion is no. 25 years ago milking 60 cows gave you a good living, same price for milk as you receive now, calf trade nearly as much and replacement heifers were half as much as today. Corn,fertiliser,medicines,vets,diesel etc have all nearly doubled in price and the experts tell you to go bigger, milk more cows, buy/rent more ground at a substantial outlay. The money invested in land, cows and machinery for the small man doesn’t stack up for the returns. I work off the farm and help when not at work, what is plainly evident is that an unskilled worker in other industries will earn a better wage (with overtime) than a fully skilled worker in the agricultural sector, (madness in my opinion). I can go to work on a Sunday for more money than I pay a man to spread muck with a tractor and spreader. It’s sad and sometimes when you look over the fence going to work and see someone farming you think to yourself if only it was me but the thought soon passes because unfortunately the sums don’t stack up. Also the general public don’t give a toss about food and where it comes from, they want it as cheap as possible so they can buy the next IPhone or packet of fags etc and the other issue is the impact that farming allegedly is having on the environment, all the ag bashers blaming us for every mortal thing. More rules, more regulations, more cost. I read on this forum of posters expanding and admire their braveness, dedication and business plan and look on in envy. In my opinion the decision for the op of whether to go into farming in the uk is whether it’s for money or an enjoyable lifestyle,

The fact remains that all the primary industries have stiff barriers to entry and there are very few small time players globally in many of these industries because it's all about cost per unit produced.

If seriously wanted to get into farming it would be at a managerial level where I was managing people rather than much else which would probably slew me towards a big arable or veg outfit or probably abroad.

In the UK at least, big money can be made but not without serious contacts and capital to begin with. Even the likes and Dyson and co are only doing it to dodge tax really. One wonders if they will ever see a worthwhile return on the money they are sinking into the industry.

 

[J 1177]

No, that's prostitution.

Either way you get fecked

 

[toquark]

The fact remains that all the primary industries have stiff barriers to entry and there are very few small time players globally in many of these industries because it's all about cost per unit produced.

If seriously wanted to get into farming it would be at a managerial level where I was managing people rather than much else which would probably slew me towards a big arable or veg outfit or probably abroad.

In the UK at least, big money can be made but not without serious contacts and capital to begin with. Even the likes and Dyson and co are only doing it to dodge tax really. One wonders if they will ever see a worthwhile return on the money they are sinking into the industry.

All true, however as well as a business, farming can be a lifestyle and a very tax efficient one at that. Take home money isn't always the main indicator of a successful farm (I don't think it ever was really).

I've said on here before that the industry will split between the large industrialists and the small scale specialists and part timers. The folk milking 150 cows, calving 60 cows or growing 150ac cereals have choices to make. Personally in that position, I'd rationalise the place, and change the system to fit into a 9-5 job. That, or sell up. That is the future in my opinion, you'll just drive yourself into an early grave trying to keep up with the big boys on a family farm.

 

[toquark]

Either way you get fecked

Prostitution's probably less risky!

 

[Netherfield]

Prostitution's probably less risky!

As long as you get a regular checkup from the vet.

 

[snarling bee]

I would have always said yes there is a massive future

But recently I’m not so sure, the like of RT and the NFU seem hell bent determined to destroy Uk Ag

II think if I was younger and keen to work in Ag I would move to South America or Eastern Europe now.......... or be “nice” and get a job in the NFU or Defra etc and make a living out of telling farmers what they should do !

You are a cynical B@gger, and to be honest getting like a scratched record and bloody boring.
Obviously those 2 organisations are the only ones to blame for UK Agriculture's demise, if as you claim, it is going downhill. HM govt, Brexit, the EU, green movements, the Daily Mail, the BBC, international trade, the supermarkets etc etc etc have nothing to do with it then?
I thought the whole point of you banging on endlessly about regenerative agriculture is that you believe that's where the future is.

 

[Clive]

You are a cynical B@gger, and to be honest getting like a scratched record and bloody boring.
Obviously those 2 organisations are the only ones to blame for UK Agriculture's demise, if as you claim, it is going downhill. HM govt, Brexit, the EU, green movements, the Daily Mail, the BBC, international trade, the supermarkets etc etc etc have nothing to do with it then?
I thought the whole point of you banging on endlessly about regenerative agriculture is that you believe that's where the future is.

I'm only boring to those that don't like what I have to say I'm sure, although I dare say I liven up their day even sometimes ! But frankly, I have no one to please or answer to other than myself, I'm not after that NFU president job thanks. I don't blame them for UK ag demise, but I do blame them for doing nothing useful about it and wasting a LOT of UK farmers money, I'm not alone in that thought I'm sure

There is potential for a great future in regen ag, we hold the key to one of humanities biggest problems right now, sadly there are a lot of self-serving idiots that seem to want to get in the way of this, however .................... please do excuse my frustration about that

 

[Mixedupfarmer]

I moved to France last year having spent my first 20 years working my arse of for no return, the opportunities do seem very limited in the U.K. at the moment and in my case historically. Here we walked into a farm tenancy with on 340 acres with a nice house fantastic cattle set up and all of the wonderful benefits of French life and E.U. life. When i started out I never dreamt of farming anywhere else than my home county of Kent. I found that unless you have pots of money behind you and knew the right people opportunity just floated past. When i did get a foot in the door it was solely for the benefit of the Landlord. I would strongly recommend you get a good hands on education in practical farming and look at your options abroad. For my family it has been the best thing we have ever done and we are already showing a financial return for our labours, here I can keep our family from what we earn on the farm with no need for wife to work off farm or call on working tax credits. Have a long hard think about what is out there beyond the U.K.

Sounds fantastic, where do I sign up! Well done, and good luck for the future.

 

[Matthew Britton]

Sounds fantastic, where do I sign up! Well done, and good luck for the future.

Just ask, there are a few of us on here (probably too often) who would be only too pleased to help. If you love France it really is an amazing life. If you don’t know France and it’s foibles it is 50/50 but still a great life if you can work around paperwork

 

[Hilly]

Farming has a future definitely but farming changes and it’s weather or not you want to be part of that future ? The future in farming will hold less of us some will leave because they don’t like it and some will be forced out and less will continue to produce more for less .

 

[Derrick Hughes]

One bit of advice for what its worth
If you have a wife and young family its not just about what you want ,
You have to take your family along with you so discus it with them and respect what they have to say , especially if your planing to emigrate
Building up a farming business can be a lifetimes work

 

[Matthew Britton]

One bit of advice for what its worth
If you have a wife and young family its not just about what you want ,
You have to take your family along with you so discus it with them and respect what they have to say , especially if your planing to emigrate
Building up a farming business can be a lifetimes work

Very well said Derrick, I should have added something similar in my post. I would hate to be here with an unhappy family, they have to be as much of the decision as you are for it to work properly and very one to be as happy as possible. Our 16 and 13 year olds came with us, the 16 now not far off 18 year old hates it but is biding his time until he can move back but has taken it ok, the 13 year old has enjoyed it but only because she already had friends here. If you emigrate then the younger the kids are the better.

 

[toquark]

One bit of advice for what its worth
If you have a wife and young family its not just about what you want ,
You have to take your family along with you so discus it with them and respect what they have to say , especially if your planing to emigrate
Building up a farming business can be a lifetimes work

Excellent post. A family, if they share your vision can be a massive asset. Likewise balancing family time and a farming business can be difficult, especially in the early stages.

 

[Humble Village Farmer]

how-a-sussex-arable-farmer-is-preparing-for-the-elm-scheme
It is pretty obvious that these schemes will hugely benefit the large arable estates which have caused the problem at the expense of traditional family farms who will likely go to the wall, as always money talks especially in the case of the NFU!

These elm schemes may well create opportunities for graziers, poultry keepers, bee keepers etc. There's always an opportunity for the opportunist.