Is there a special maths school for machinery rep ?

[DRC]

Kubota's 5 year / 5000 hour warranty is tempting.

No, it just means after discount, price on new tractor is £40k.

Dealer net price is calculated from list price. Usually the maximum amount available on manufacturer subsidised finance schemes is based on 50% (or similar) of list price.

major brand 110 hp new tractor for £40k

 

[Matt L]

All depends on spec of the machine

 

[benny6910]

I’ve had a main dealer in to price to swap my forklift, he gave me a price for my trade in, I didn’t like the machine that he had to offer me so went to look at another but no joy. So back to main dealer for anothe quote on another forklift and I can now get £5k more for my trade in than I was quoted 4 weeks ago!?

 

[Mursal]

For instance a £100,000 tractor might be offered with a 30% discount to the customer, therefore £70,000 to pay. However if there was an expensive PX worth say £45000 to retail but only £35,000 to the trade, in order to pay ostensibly the same as he would retail it for, to the farmer he might offer £45,000 for the trade in but only 20% discount on the new one, leaving £80k less £45k = £35k to change.

It wouldn't really matter if he offered the new one at £70k less £35k = £35k. The same net amount is payable. Its up to the salesman and the customer which way they prefer. Some customers prefer a net price less a trade price, while others prefer a reasonable discount and a flattered part exchange price. The same amount is payable regardless.

Back in the real world ...............
Customer goes to dealer for a straight price, no trade in (after the 30% discount) = 70k
Customer goes to another local dealer with a trade in worth 45k, so 80k - 45k = 35k
So the customer now knows the local dealer is only giving 35k for a tractor worth 45k?
Or am I missing something?

 

[fudge]

Getting prices for a tractor change just now.
All the quotes are along the lines of
List price £70k
Trade in £20k
Price to change £20k

Just say no to all of the “quotes”. Then you might find out what the actual price is! Depending on your personal limits you may lose the will to live before the pricing procedure is complete!

 

[kiwi pom]

Yes I am. Been offered £24k trade in against a £69k tractor . Still a lot too find !

So 45k to find? Having seen your tractors on 'today at work' I'd say they were in great condition and I think fairly low hours? Probably easily capable of ten more years. Where will you be in ten years and how much will it cost to keep it going? No where near 45k surely?
Of course you might just want a change, if that's the case just go for it

 

[balerman]

Back in the real world ...............
Customer goes to dealer for a straight price, no trade in (after the 30% discount) = 70k
Customer goes to another local dealer with a trade in worth 45k, so 80k - 45k = 35k
So the customer now knows the local dealer is only giving 35k for a tractor worth 45k?
Or am I missing something?

The duck is correct,the dealer has to make decent margin on the trade in to cover servicing/presentation/repairs and who knows maybe make a profit(it is allowed),or he will pass it on at or near cost to an underwriter who will have similar costs.

 

[DRC]

So 45k to find? Having seen your tractors on 'today at work' I'd say they were in great condition and I think fairly low hours? Probably easily capable of ten more years. Where will you be in ten years and how much will it cost to keep it going? No where near 45k surely?
Of course you might just want a change, if that's the case just go for it

£45k, would buy a decent extra tractor maybe .

 

[Mursal]

The duck is correct,the dealer has to make decent margin on the trade in to cover servicing/presentation/repairs and who knows maybe make a profit(it is allowed),or he will pass it on at or near cost to an underwriter who will have similar costs.

And do you think the dealer taking the trade in, will get the deal?

 

[nick...]

Some need to get some manners and treat customers as they like to be treated and not give the impression they are doing you a favour,oh and return calls
Nick...

 

[balerman]

And do you think the dealer taking the trade in, will get the deal?

Depends if the farmer thinks he can get more for it elsewhere,or thinks its worth more to keep,or it has an undisclosed problem,not too many truly genuine older tractors get traded in

 

[fermerboy]

If people can't get their heads around that, which is relatively simple really, then believe me they ain't cut out for sales and thinking on their feet.


For machines in stock or on stock order, things are simpler, because they then have a gross and a net figure in the dealer's yard already worked out and much less maths to do on the hoof.

I don't know about your area but round here more or less no sales rep does any thinking on their feet. Assuming they actually turn up, (Anybody seen the lesser spotted ***** rep lately???)They all run back to the office and the manager/boss puts the quote together and they come back. They can't actually do a deal on the spot without having to run back to base.

There are a few exceptions but a few dealers could just employ a school leaver, and send them to take pics on their Iphone and come back with a quote, the end result would be the same!!

 

[TomD]

I don't know about your area but round here more or less no sales rep does any thinking on their feet. Assuming they actually turn up, (Anybody seen the lesser spotted ***** rep lately???)They all run back to the office and the manager/boss puts the quote together and they come back. They can't actually do a deal on the spot without having to run back to base.

There are a few exceptions but a few dealers could just employ a school leaver, and send them to take pics on their Iphone and come back with a quote, the end result would be the same!!

So your expecting a rep to know every price of what they have for sale and know a price for your trade in whilst on farm?

 

[Cowabunga]

Back in the real world ...............
Customer goes to dealer for a straight price, no trade in (after the 30% discount) = 70k
Customer goes to another local dealer with a trade in worth 45k, so 80k - 45k = 35k
So the customer now knows the local dealer is only giving 35k for a tractor worth 45k?
Or am I missing something?

Yes. The trade in is only worth £35k to the dealer because he has to cover costs, such as sales commission and advertising, repairs, both mechanical and cosmetic, haulage, overheads and the warranty gamble, plus of course the limitation of capital tied up in the yard. Or it could be traded at nearer cost [35k] to another dealer who underwrites it, because he specialises in that particular brand.

The valuation of used equipment is a black art really, consisting of a guessing game as to how much the item can be retailed for and how soon. The easiest thing in the world for a crap salesperson or dealer to do is to pay over the odds for trade ins that become difficult or impossible to sell without making a net loss. Filling the yard up with Uber-expensive albeit high quality scrap.

 

[Cowabunga]

I don't know about your area but round here more or less no sales rep does any thinking on their feet. Assuming they actually turn up, (Anybody seen the lesser spotted ***** rep lately???)They all run back to the office and the manager/boss puts the quote together and they come back. They can't actually do a deal on the spot without having to run back to base.

There are a few exceptions but a few dealers could just employ a school leaver, and send them to take pics on their Iphone and come back with a quote, the end result would be the same!!

A good rep would quickly work out the price of a straight deal. As I said, valuing a trade in is more of a black art. Some can do it, some can’t and some need permission or even to ring around and get the machine underwritten because no way would the dealership want to own the damned thing. You often can’t upset the customer by telling him that you don’t want his heap of shite of course, not unless it is genuinely worth next to nothing.

Some salespeople just can’t be trusted to value things, so they are made to refer to management for deal approval. That is not an efficient way of running sales in my opinion and unless we are talking £40k or more [variable figure depending on what people are comfortable with] at stake, a salesman should be able to be trusted to do deals 90% plus of the time in my opinion. Like the salesman/customer relationship, the sales and management relationship also boils down to being a ‘people’ thing. Does management trust staff to play with their money? Big money?

 

[Jim B]

major brand 110 hp new tractor for £40k

Yes.

 

[TomD]

I think a lot of farmers live in a little bubble with a chip on there shoulder thinking anyone who even attempts to make a profit at their expense are on par with murderers and rapists!
if you don't think it's a good deal for yourself move on else where and find a deal that's you feel is good for you ,why blame someone saying they are overcharging you do you know their costs?
If the answer is no how can you say they are ripping you off?

Profit shouldn't be seen as a dirty word!! It makes business go around

 

[Cowabunga]

So your expecting a rep to know every price of what they have for sale and know a price for your trade in whilst on farm?

Research is often needed. Is it better to value a trade in on a best price first basis, where research is often needed before offering a price on something the rep can’t be sure of? Or is it better to offer a fairly safe price first, then do the research and go back with a better price later if possible?

I reckon a bit of both, depending on circumstances. What is particularly awkward and should be avoided, is to give a price only to find that it is too much, necessitating an embarrassing call to say that "sorry, can’t do it at the price you were offered, I need x thousands/hundreds more to do the deal". Ouch! You might as well give the customer a map to rival dealers.

 

[fermerboy]

So your expecting a rep to know every price of what they have for sale and know a price for your trade in whilst on farm?

No I'm not expecting that, but when the rep is left with no negotiating room at all without running back to the manager its a farce.
I totally understand that trade ins have to be underwritten etc, but when a rep isn't in a position to offer any movement without say so in the end to clinch a deal, I'd be as well just go to the organ grinder myself and cut out the monkey altogether. Its my time as well as his thats being wasted.

 

[Matt L]

No I'm not expecting that, but when the rep is left with no negotiating room at all without running back to the manager its a farce.
I totally understand that trade ins have to be underwritten etc, but when a rep isn't in a position to offer any movement without say so in the end to clinch a deal, I'd be as well just go to the organ grinder myself and cut out the monkey altogether. Its my time as well as his thats being wasted.

The rep may have come to you with a deal at the sharper end of what he can do, has then been asked for more which is then outside what he is allowed to do without agreement from the boss.
Therefore in a way he was being helpful by coming to you with his best price straight away only to then be screwed down some more or risk losing out on a deal.