JCB TM310s misfiring/injector issues

milkloss

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
East Sussex
Morning All, I have posted about this on the ‘fault code’ thread but the issue is still rumbling on, hoping someone has resolved similar and the thread catches a few more eyes.

We are getting sporadic E083 error codes which mean open circuit on injector number 1. This to be precise:

Injector Solenoid Valve Cylinder Number 1 Fault – Current below normal or open circuit.Injector Solenoid Valve Cylinder Number 1 Fault – Current below normal or open circuit.No information.

When it does it it will fire on three as I guess the ecu shuts that one down. A simple off and on cycle will resolve it mostly but sometimes it comes right back. The problem seems to occur quite sporadically but it has occurred to us this morning that it tends to do it when damp (heavy mist last night/this morning and it rained the other when it did it half a dozen times in 20minutes). We took the rubber cover off the engine to look at the plug and wiggle the loom whilst itwayrunning, all seemed clean, appeared to be a good connection and didn’t cause it to miss. It ran for two weeks no problems after this. It ran for 5weeks no problems after I checked the lower plug that goes into the box on the side of the engine, was very clean here too, I was expecting a td5 like oil migration issue but no.

So is this an injector problem or loom issue do you think. Going to cost some to replace both and I’m running tight at the minute (when aren’t I?!) but I would have thought a bad injector would throw the code more randomly and regularly.

I thought about doing a cut and shut on the loom with two new wires to that injector but something tells me that’s perhaps not going to be as easy and clean as it sounds.

Ideas appreciated.
 

Timbo

Member
Location
Gods County
If you have a good DVM - do some resistance checks on inj1 vs inj2/3/4 at the cylinder head with the engine cold and hot, or when its most likely to play up. Could be on the verge of tolerance the ECU wants to see, also check at the ECU plug- be very very careful not to damage the pins and do not attempt to shove a probe into the connector - get some of these:

https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/products/1247401/?grossPrice=Y&cm_mmc=UK-PLA-DS3A-_-google-_-PLA_UK_EN_Test_And_Measurement-_-Multimeters_And_Accessories|Multimeter_Test_Leads-_-PRODUCT_GROUP&matchtype=&pla-522517035505&s_kwcid=AL!7457!3!243856879574!!!g!522517035505!&gclid=CjwKCAiA8rnfBRB3EiwAhrhBGiK2UMI1VQqCl9E5BWOAt1cvbFpkXz5my3wOx9B6etSss094i-9sShoCEvoQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

I wouldn't start cutting n shutting the loom just yet...

I would want to check and load test the relevant ECU earths, as the injector drivers are always powered and earthed separately to the rest of the ECU.
 

milkloss

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
East Sussex
If you have a good DVM - do some resistance checks on inj1 vs inj2/3/4 at the cylinder head with the engine cold and hot, or when its most likely to play up. Could be on the verge of tolerance the ECU wants to see, also check at the ECU plug- be very very careful not to damage the pins and do not attempt to shove a probe into the connector - get some of these:

https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/products/1247401/?grossPrice=Y&cm_mmc=UK-PLA-DS3A-_-google-_-PLA_UK_EN_Test_And_Measurement-_-Multimeters_And_Accessories|Multimeter_Test_Leads-_-PRODUCT_GROUP&matchtype=&pla-522517035505&s_kwcid=AL!7457!3!243856879574!!!g!522517035505!&gclid=CjwKCAiA8rnfBRB3EiwAhrhBGiK2UMI1VQqCl9E5BWOAt1cvbFpkXz5my3wOx9B6etSss094i-9sShoCEvoQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

I wouldn't start cutting n shutting the loom just yet...

I would want to check and load test the relevant ECU earths, as the injector drivers are always powered and earthed separately to the rest of the ECU.

Thanks. Had a go today but as you suggest I need the probe kit really. Used some good quality copper stranded to slip into the large plug and got similar readings on both (pins 50 and 49 are injector one for anyone that needs to know). Didn’t think of testing another inj loom to compare....that’ll be a weekend job.

The biggest problem is that it’s intermittent. Jcb man is quite good and suggested we might have to leave it till it won’t run on four at all and then the issue can be diagnose with a degree of certainty. In another more profitable business the loom and injector would be changed regardless, not so with us unfortunately,

Are those RS probes universal? I have a nice fluke I use which could do with new leads anyhow so perhaps a fluke kit may be the answer.
 

milkloss

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
East Sussex
Check the big plugs on side of the engine water can get inside the plug we had the same and that was the cause

Looks absolutely spotless in there, like new in fact. Shone a good led light in there and no sign of mist or hazing from any moisture. Could be though, what would your solution be. A type of spray maybe?

Looked so clean I didn’t really want to do much to it. I’ve got some contact clean aerosol?
 

sym

Member
Location
Midlands
swop number 1 injector with number 2 and see if the fault code changes, the injectors are coded so swop them back if it doesn't change the fault ,
you can get the injectors from a Delphi specialist a lot cheaper than jcb prices;), it will require coding to the ECU if you fit a new one
 

milkloss

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
East Sussex
swop number 1 injector with number 2 and see if the fault code changes, the injectors are coded so swop them back if it doesn't change the fault ,
you can get the injectors from a Delphi specialist a lot cheaper than jcb prices;), it will require coding to the ECU if you fit a new one

Not a job I’ve done before to be honest, I can call on others more experienced than me though. Is it a decent job?
 

njneer

Member
Sounds to me like you have a loom rubbed through onto the engine or chassis somewhere , only contacting now and again but made worse on wet days where moisture is assisting to conduct the voltage to the injectors to the chassis ground.
I have had it on tractors in the past .
Start the machine and leave it running and manually manipulate the engine loom between the cylinder head and the ecu and you may be able to replicate the fault and track down the pinch point , it sounds like it may be a single wire touching the metal on the machine somewhere.
 

Timbo

Member
Location
Gods County
Sounds to me like you have a loom rubbed through onto the engine or chassis somewhere , only contacting now and again but made worse on wet days where moisture is assisting to conduct the voltage to the injectors to the chassis ground.
I have had it on tractors in the past .
Start the machine and leave it running and manually manipulate the engine loom between the cylinder head and the ecu and you may be able to replicate the fault and track down the pinch point , it sounds like it may be a single wire touching the metal on the machine somewhere.


Very doubtful - the fault code ( assuming it's right) is 'low current / open circuit ' - I.e opposite to a short.
 

njneer

Member
Very doubtful - the fault code ( assuming it's right) is 'low current / open circuit ' - I.e opposite to a short.
Yes possibly , some manufacturers have the same code for open and / or short to ground depends just a thought especially when it seems worse when wet or damp.
 

milkloss

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
East Sussex
Sounds to me like you have a loom rubbed through onto the engine or chassis somewhere , only contacting now and again but made worse on wet days where moisture is assisting to conduct the voltage to the injectors to the chassis ground.
I have had it on tractors in the past .
Start the machine and leave it running and manually manipulate the engine loom between the cylinder head and the ecu and you may be able to replicate the fault and track down the pinch point , it sounds like it may be a single wire touching the metal on the machine somewhere.

Have done this several times and can not replicate the problem. We can get good visual on the conduit the loom runs In and there appears to be no damage. Any damage must in within the conduit but is unlikely I would think.

Running well today so far and haven’t looked at th back of the plug yet.
 

milkloss

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
East Sussex
Did the back of the plug out and it was dry, maybe a little dusty but that’s it. Sprayed it with contact clean but I think it’ll only collect sh1t now because of the oily sheen left behind.

Started to fire in three all the time today so new injector secure for £450 and the engineer to install and programme on top.

How long a job do you think it should be and are there any tricks?

Appreciated
 

agcon1

Member
Location
derbyshire
had this several times, pull off the plug that goes to injector no1, inside the injector side you will see 4 tiny little pins, 2 each side that go either side of the single pin on the plug when you push it in....using some thing very small, I used a safety pin, gently prize them closer together, its a common fault on jcb's, my local service manager knew exactly what it was before id finished telling him the symptoms
 

milkloss

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
East Sussex
had this several times, pull off the plug that goes to injector no1, inside the injector side you will see 4 tiny little pins, 2 each side that go either side of the single pin on the plug when you push it in....using some thing very small, I used a safety pin, gently prize them closer together, its a common fault on jcb's, my local service manager knew exactly what it was before id finished telling him the symptoms

Thanks, tried this twice. Our service chaps are pretty good suggesting how to get round the machine.

Bit lost to be fair and not really sure what else to try. Tweaked the pins, cleaned the plug both front and back, tested the wires as best I can, wiggled the loom and checked for faults. Got to be injector coil breaking down after all that surely?
 
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