Kingspan tanks and their level monitoring.

Fraserb

Member
Location
Scottish Borders
That's the one. It has an antenna on the top but I can't see any use for it as mine is cable connected to a sort of limpet-mine looking thing on top of the tank which is, in turn connected to the sender by a short plastic tube.

The limpet mine is the bund alarm, its meant to sit in the bund and alert you if it detects diesel so you've got a leak, on ours there's the standard red bit screwed to the top for the tank monitoring and the limpet mine for the bund, the mine is wired into something but it's not the receiver on ours, I'm actually at the farm with that tank at the moment if I'm not late finished tonight I'll see where everything goes, if not it'll be tomorrow morning.
 

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
Do they not just both transmit to the mickey mouse plug in gauges? And one maybe sounding an alarm if the level drops?

We had similar on 10k and 38k Derv ranks.. absolute crap and wrong readings.

Ended up with both in a Triscan set up linked together.. That'd ping you if the level dropped too quick in either tank.
These are meant to do that. The calibration of the Sonic, before pairing it, is by referring to a chart for the depth of the tank and moving dip-switches on the remote receiver to suit. It then reads on ten percent bar scale. The sender presumably works without external power somehow and is ultrasonic or something. There is a mechanical gauge also fitted to this tank but not the other, possibly because the receiver may be remotely situated while the gauge gives the actual user a reading.

The big tank with the Watchman Uni, as seen in the above post, is bolted in the cabinet and, as far as I can see no use is made of its wireless capability and it does not give me the option to have a reading away from the tank like the other one. Although the sensor/senders on top of the tank are exactly the same, this big one is connected by tube to a gadget which is, in turn, connected by an electrical cable to the receiver as seen above
 

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
The limpet mine is the bund alarm, its meant to sit in the bund and alert you if it detects diesel so you've got a leak, on ours there's the standard red bit screwed to the top for the tank monitoring and the limpet mine for the bund, the mine is wired into something but it's not the receiver on ours, I'm actually at the farm with that tank at the moment if I'm not late finished tonight I'll see where everything goes, if not it'll be tomorrow morning.
No, there's another cylindrical float-like device hanging down to about a quarter height between the tanks to do that. This thing is connected by a short tube to the sender/sensor thing screwed into the to of the inner tank
 

JeepJeep

Member
Trade
If I'm reading it right the "Tubes" is full of A4's IRC and you can knock the cap off and replace them.

I've similar on the Oil tank at home... that's never worked properly after a few years either.

We just got pee'd off with they're inaccuracy and went proper setup on the Derv
 

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
The sonic sender has a coin cell battery inside it to provide power
No mention of that for the green ones in my literature. There is on the red ones. Not sure on that but there is no mention about a battery or access to one on the green units

Download Download - Kingspan | Grouphttps://www.kingspan.com › en-us › resources › k...

Sonic, as fitted to my smaller tank is on page 2

The Sonic Uni is further down.

The thing I called a limpet mine, which is connected by a tube to the green sender on the bigger tank is apparently a 4-20mA pressure sensor. So despite the senders being identical apart from one being unconnected and the other connected, that must work differently. I'm at a loss to work out how a pressure sensor works with an unpressurised tank or what the pressure has to do with the fluid level.

I've already learnt a lot today but there's much more that I can't work out yet.
 
Last edited:

Steevo

Member
Location
Gloucestershire
If I'm reading it right the "Tubes" is full of A4's IRC and you can knock the cap off and replace them.

I've similar on the Oil tank at home... that's never worked properly after a few years either.

We just got pee'd off with they're inaccuracy and went proper setup on the Derv

Exactly this - I never trust a "Watchman".

Have one of the standard £20 float gauges on my steel bunded tanks now and can't fault them for accuracy and easy to read at a glance.
 

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
What model it? CR batteries on some if not all is right
Here is a video of the small tank's unit. Note the nipple on the side of the green unit which is not connected to anything on this unit but when fitted to the bigger tank with the Uni system this has a stiff plastic tube, about six inches long, fitted and connected to the 4-20mA pressure sensor, which in turn is wired to the Sonic Uni unit.

 

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
Exactly this - I never trust a "Watchman".

Have one of the standard £20 float gauges on my steel bunded tanks now and can't fault them for accuracy and easy to read at a glance.
I reserve judgement on how well they work until they are connected to the electricity and there is diesel in the tanks. I'll order some red diesel first thing tomorrow. I've 500l of DERV in the IBC that I'll gravity feed into the smaller tank tomorrow morning.
 

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
Is it not a power tube fitted to the nipple?

I'll watch the vid later on the laptop.
Power tube? :scratchhead: No. I suspect, now that I've found out what I think the limpet mine is [a 4-20mA pressure sensor], that it is just a way of transferring the 'pressure' from the sender to it, from where it is converted into an electrical signal that travels through the cable to the WM Uni receiver unit.
I haven't a clue how the sender unit works, which is the number one thing I'd like to learn. The second is why the larger tank is connected to its sender in a different way that does not allow a remote reading away from the tank. The little one does.
 
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JeepJeep

Member
Trade
Power tube... Ours were/are metal with AAs in. It powers the sender unit to the mickey mouse plug thing. The Stiff plastic tube you mention sounds like it could be the same thing.
 

powerfarmer

Member
Location
Cork Ireland
Get one of these, you can read the level on the sensor, or in the house/office,and comes with a bund leakage sensor as well.
There are more basic ones without the bund sensor if you want those.
+1 on that, have one here 7 years, it's a good job
 

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
Get one of these, you can read the level on the sensor, or in the house/office,and comes with a bund leakage sensor as well.
There are more basic ones without the bund sensor if you want those.
Why? I haven't even got the purchased systems working yet. I just want to know how they work not change them for alternatives.

Besides which the receiver unit seems to be exactly the same device used by Kingspan as the Sonic.
 

JeepJeep

Member
Trade
Sounds like the sensor on the tank should be hardwired.... the nipple and power tubes is the wrong as I read it path

But the Display with aerial should be paired and located wherever in a socket
 

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
Sounds like the sensor on the tank should be hardwired.... the nipple and power tubes is the wrong as I read it path

But the Display with aerial should be paired and located wherever in a socket
I don't think either are the 'wrong' way. Both ways are clearly shown in the literature, including using the more sophisticated unit in the same way as the cheaper Sonic but instead of pairing by holding the receiver and sender together for 20 seconds, the sender has a magnet held against its dot, which seems to allow pairing from at least two meters apart. It's all very sophisticated and I wish I knew what principles are involved. I like to know how things work, in principle if not in every detail.
 

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