Liquid fertiliser recipes

[Clive]

Following on from discussions in another thread. Is there a book that lists the proportions of various N sources and water etc required to make various solutions ?

Where do you get the information to work out the saturation of solutions if your chemistry A level was a long time ago !

Info on products that don't mix or don't store well etc

If no book exists maybe it would be helpful to each other to post our own successful mixes here in a thread ?

 

[Fish]

Good idea, I've never understood the whole bloody secrecy bit regarding home brew liquid fert.

 

[Daniel]

How is this done, I mean I've seen the pictures on here, big is it just a case of tipping bags of prilled nitrogen in a tank and pumping water through it?

If so what is the benefit as opposed to just spreading the fert with a spinner rather than making it into liquid?

 

[fudge]

Lots of advantages to liquid. Unfortunately the suppliers, Omex et al, charge a high premium for convenient products. Pulan factory in Poland
make AN granular urea and UAN. On their web site they state that UAN is typically the cheapest form of N. There could be scope for direct importation followed by home brew tweaking of various nutrients. Our own scale 400acs precludes home mixing therefore we are using solids this year.

 

[Andrew K]

Lots of advantages to liquid. Unfortunately the suppliers, Omex et al, charge a high premium for convenient products. Pulan factory in Poland
make AN granular urea and UAN. On their web site they state that UAN is typically the cheapest form of N. There could be scope for direct importation followed by home brew tweaking of various nutrients. Our own scale 400acs precludes home mixing therefore we are using solids this year.

There is a second hand Agroco tank in farmers Guide this month, probably get it sub £1000, Electric 3PH Mixer pump new would be circa £500 from me. A "proper "Filter around £350
Clive may know of someone with a used mixer tank as well? You should be into home mixing for 2 to 3K max if you already have a storage tank.

 

[Colin]

Right! All this info comes from the days of agroco.
I don't know how to make a table in here so the following figures may be a bit hard too understand but if you have questions just ask. Amount are in tonnes for the fertiliser and water, total are the finished volume in cubic meters. Just adjust the ratios for mixing tank size, agrocos where made out of whole sheets of 8'x4' steel hence the volumes they used. S is elemental sulphur, multiply by 2.5 for SO3.
23n8.6s: urea 4.75 as 4.9 water 7.5 total 13.54m3
9.8n11s: as 6.56 water 10.66 total 14m3
36n2.5s: urea 6.5 as 1.5 an 5 water 9.85 total 14m3
20n: urea 6.22 water 9.85 total 14m3
33n: urea 4.58 an 5.58 water 6.23 total 13 m3
As for the technical side of the chemistry, don't ask me! I always weigh the first tank fill of raw materials in just in case there is a difference in specific weight from previous years. You can check the final strength by specific gravity but that is dependent on temperature and the type of mix and I don't have that info anywhere. Basically I throw in the tonnes of fertiliser, fill up the tank with water to where the finished volume should be and mark everything off so once the first mix is done by weight the remainder just gets done volumetrically, as you have the tank calibrated.
AS by itself mixes almost instantly, straight urea takes longer, as and urea about the same, urea and an half as long again and as an and urea mix about twice as long. I mix about 19m3 of the urea as mix in 24 hours including filling and emptying. I don't let the tank settle before we transfer as we have hopper bottomed fert tanks so any dust etc settles there instead.
MAP/ DAP does mix but it more of suspension and I haven't tried anything else.
I use home mixing as it gives you the accuracy of liquid on a 36m boom but using materials that are a lot cheaper.

 

[fudge]

There is a second hand Agroco tank in farmers Guide this month, probably get it sub £1000, Electric 3PH Mixer pump new would be circa £500 from me. A "proper "Filter around £350
Clive may know of someone with a used mixer tank as well? You should be into home mixing for 2 to 3K max if you already have a storage tank.

We have an omex tank. I think home mixing is too much hassle for the potential savings. The best reason for doing it is if you need to be wider than 24m

 

[Andrew K]

Clive,
I have the "recipe" for N33 if you need it, Have also got a Urea/ANS recipe somewhere if i can find it!
Most useful thing is a weighbridge[if using bulk] and a Specific Gravity meter to check mixed solution strength with.

We have an omex tank. I think home mixing is too much hassle for the potential savings. The best reason for doing it is if you need to be wider than 24m

Fair enough, but it stacks up very well against bought in liquids for those that want the accuracy.

 

[Clive]

Some UAS recipes I have been given

N20 / 4S

9100 L water
5 t Urea
2.33 t AS
Sg = 1174

finished solution is 20kg N and 4kgs S per 100 L - plan to apply at 900L/ha is 3 x 300L splits each split giving 60kgs N and 12kgs S (30 kg So3) - ie 180kg/ha N total and 90kg So3 total.

This is I think what my OSR and WW will be getting this year with late N20 (urea) top ups for milling wheat


N21 /6S

7800 water
4.9 t urea
3.5 t AS
sg = 1170

finished solution is 21kgs N and 6 Kgs S per 100 L (x S by 2.5 to get So3)


N16 / 6 S

9250 water
3.29 urea
3.685 AS
sg = 1180

finished solution is 16kgs N and 6kgs S per 100 L (x S by 2.5 to get So3)

 

[Clive]

We have an omex tank. I think home mixing is too much hassle for the potential savings. The best reason for doing it is if you need to be wider than 24m

this depends on what products you can buy at what prices - its hassle but the savings are big if you buy right and can get distressed product - I have urea here that was £215/t for example when good stuff was £285), you would never get it through a spreader

 

[fudge]

this depends on what products you can buy at what prices - its hassle but the savings are big if you buy right

OK how do I buy right? If it is right for me won't it be right for everyone? Surely that will mean increasing competition for cheap materials?

 

[Clive]

OK how do I buy right? If it is right for me won't it be right for everyone? Surely that will mean increasing competition for cheap materials?

you make friends with fertiliser managers etc who will know to call you when they are clearing out the bottom of a boat or a store etc - there is limited supply but if you are able to take it when they want to move it bargains can be found

AS is a cheap product - 21 N and 24S for £150 this year - plenty of that about, I believe its a waste product in pharmaceutical production ??

 

[Clive]

here is the recipe I was told yesterday wouldn't work / mix - its from a printed book of unknown origin - what do you reckon ??

N20 /S 8

8250 water
4.65 t AS
3.95 t urea
Sg = 1220

finished solution is 20kgs N and 8kgs S per 100 L (x S by 2.5 to get So3)

 

[Clive]

Clive,
I have the "recipe" for N33 if you need it, Have also got a Urea/ANS recipe somewhere if i can find it!
.

be good if you could add them to this thread Andrew ?

 

[Clive]

Right! All this info comes from the days of agroco.
I don't know how to make a table in here so the following figures may be a bit hard too understand but if you have questions just ask. Amount are in tonnes for the fertiliser and water, total are the finished volume in cubic meters. Just adjust the ratios for mixing tank size, agrocos where made out of whole sheets of 8'x4' steel hence the volumes they used. S is elemental sulphur, multiply by 2.5 for SO3.
23n8.6s: urea 4.75 as 4.9 water 7.5 total 13.54m3
9.8n11s: as 6.56 water 10.66 total 14m3
36n2.5s: urea 6.5 as 1.5 an 5 water 9.85 total 14m3
20n: urea 6.22 water 9.85 total 14m3
33n: urea 4.58 an 5.58 water 6.23 total 13 m3
As for the technical side of the chemistry, don't ask me! I always weigh the first tank fill of raw materials in just in case there is a difference in specific weight from previous years. You can check the final strength by specific gravity but that is dependent on temperature and the type of mix and I don't have that info anywhere. Basically I throw in the tonnes of fertiliser, fill up the tank with water to where the finished volume should be and mark everything off so once the first mix is done by weight the remainder just gets done volumetrically, as you have the tank calibrated.
AS by itself mixes almost instantly, straight urea takes longer, as and urea about the same, urea and an half as long again and as an and urea mix about twice as long. I mix about 19m3 of the urea as mix in 24 hours including filling and emptying. I don't let the tank settle before we transfer as we have hopper bottomed fert tanks so any dust etc settles there instead.
MAP/ DAP does mix but it more of suspension and I haven't tried anything else.
I use home mixing as it gives you the accuracy of liquid on a 36m boom but using materials that are a lot cheaper.

Thanks Colin - have you tried and tested all of those ? which do you use and in what qty / splits ?

 

[fudge]

OK how do I buy right? If it is right for me won't it be right for everyone? Surely that will mean increasing competition for cheap materials?

Me make friends? Are you serious?

 

[Clive]

Me make friends? Are you serious?

yes, you need friends in any business

 

[Clive]

The simplest mix of all

N20 straight Urea - good for late N on milling wheat

1550 water
1 t urea
sg = 1.12

finished solution is 20kgs N per 100 L - apply at 200L/ha to get a 40kgs / ha late protein boost on milling wheat

 

[fudge]

yes, you need friends in any business

The simplest mix of all

N20 straight Urea - good for late N on milling wheat

1550 water
1 t urea
sg = 1.12

finished solution is 20kgs N per 100 L - apply at 200L/ha to get a 40kgs / ha late protein boost on milling wheat

Your right I could do that for my entire top dressing needs. I could easily carry the water about and save myself £3000.

 

[Daniel]

But there are only a limited number of farmers who are going to be able to get hold of distressed product. I'd keep quiet about it if you've got a good cheap supply?