Liquid N advice please

JMTHORNLEY

Member
Location
Glossop
Good morning all,

I have only ever used prilled N so liquid is a new one for me...

Been offered some Quantum N + C300 18.4%w/w (20%w/v) Nitrogen I've no idea what it is other than 18% N what's the C300 is it a root stimulant and is it any good? The price seems awful cheap for what it is and usually if somethings seems to good to be true it is. 1000L IBC will do 50 hectares so that's all my mowing ground covered in two split applications.

I have sprayer so can do it all myself but wanted to advice of you chaps as I know there are some seriously well educated people on here when it comes to liquid N. Do I cancel my prilled order and go for this with my usual application of P&K?

Thanks
 

Farmer Fin

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Aberdeenshire
Good morning all,

I have only ever used prilled N so liquid is a new one for me...

Been offered some Quantum N + C300 18.4%w/w (20%w/v) Nitrogen I've no idea what it is other than 18% N what's the C300 is it a root stimulant and is it any good? The price seems awful cheap for what it is and usually if somethings seems to good to be true it is. 1000L IBC will do 50 hectares so that's all my mowing ground covered in two split applications.

I have sprayer so can do it all myself but wanted to advice of you chaps as I know there are some seriously well educated people on here when it comes to liquid N. Do I cancel my prilled order and go for this with my usual application of P&K?

Thanks
So an IBC contains 200kg of nitrogen.
A bag of prilled would be 34% nitrogen so a 600 kg bag would be 204kgs of nitrogen.
So you would normally split one bag over 50ha twice?
 

daithi

Member
Good morning all,

I have only ever used prilled N so liquid is a new one for me...

Been offered some Quantum N + C300 18.4%w/w (20%w/v) Nitrogen I've no idea what it is other than 18% N what's the C300 is it a root stimulant and is it any good? The price seems awful cheap for what it is and usually if somethings seems to good to be true it is. 1000L IBC will do 50 hectares so that's all my mowing ground covered in two split applications.

I have sprayer so can do it all myself but wanted to advice of you chaps as I know there are some seriously well educated people on here when it comes to liquid N. Do I cancel my prilled order and go for this with my usual application of P&K?

Thanks
I have bought some efficient 28, the way it was explained to me was that 20l/ha is the equivalent of applying 40kg of N .They don't recommend applying anymore than 20l per application as the leaf won't take it up and will be wasted. Not really any good for grazing unless you have a long rotation and it has to go onto the leaf therefore after cutting you will have to wait until it green's up before applying.
 

Farmer Fin

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Aberdeenshire
I have bought some efficient 28, the way it was explained to me was that 20l/ha is the equivalent of applying 40kg of N .They don't recommend applying anymore than 20l per application as the leaf won't take it up and will be wasted. Not really any good for grazing unless you have a long rotation and it has to go onto the leaf therefore after cutting you will have to wait until it green's up before applying.
So in 20l there is 40kg of Nitrogen? I think someone is lifting your leg.
 

Farmer Fin

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Aberdeenshire
It's not liquid N it is foliar N, It os absorbed through the leaf rather than the soil. From what I have been told as it is absorbed through the leaf 20l/ha containing about 7kg gives you the same response as 40kg granular N/ha. I think that @scholland has been using it for a few years.
I understand it’s foliar I still don’t get it. The quoted NUE for wheat is about 70%. For ease of maths 70% of the 40kg of N is 28 kg used. So even if your foliar used 100% of the N that’s still only 7kg of N.
Have you seen any independent trail data?
I may be being completely hoodwinked by the fert industry. Who knows?
 

Sincock

Member
Trade
Location
Cornwall
Granular applied N is between 40-60% efficient (on a good day). Any nitrates applied through the soil are easily taken in by the plant but remember it is a poison and requires / uses significant energy from the plant to turn NO3 into NH2. This means energy is wasted on turning the Nitrates (poison) into something useable (NH2), energy that could have been used for growing / driving yield. The typical "flush" of grow / greening you see following an application of AN, for example, is no more than the plant cells filling with water. This results in lower DM, increased risk of lodging and a significant increase in risk of disease. Granular applied N works by applying loads on in the hope that when the N is actually needed by the plant there is enough left. Take maize, roughly 40% of it's N requirement is after tasseling yet we apply N in the seed bed which means we have to apply more in the seed bed in the hope it doesn't all volatilise or leach before its needed.

We don't eat all our food for the week on a Sunday night, we need little and often. Crops are the same.

Foliar N is applied directly onto the leaf, it is extremely sticky, rain fast and slow release. Depending on the polymer content, and there is a big difference so be careful, it wont cause scorch and thanks to the form the N is supplied in, it is easily and efficiently absorbed through the leaf, no poison. The NUE of Foliar N depends on the Polymer %, the higher the percentage of Polymer the higher the NUE. The rest is Free Urea, which is no more or no less, dissolved urea. This is what causes scorch so as I said before be careful.

The attached screenshot is trial data done by the AICC (so independent) last year using KWS Extase in Crowfield. You can see a reduction in total N applied resulted in almost no change in yield across the board. 290kg N/ha from granular fertiliser yielded 11.4t/ha where as 128kg N/ha from granular and foliar yielded 11.3t/ha. There is trial data going back 15 years showing similar results in almost every crop, including grass.

Foliar N isn't going to replace all granular N and there is 100% still a place / need for it but, later applications of N can absolutely be replaced with Foliar to reduce total N applied while maintaining yields. For all the reason above and with 15 years worth of trial data, a lot of it independent, to back it up, we can say that 40kgs N/ha from granular can be replaced with just 7kgs N/ha from Efficie-N-t 28 for comparable yields. Other Foliar fertiliser are available, results will be different as they contain different Polymer and Free Urea percentages. Also beware of scorch. Efficie-N-t 28 contains 22% Polymer and 6% Free urea. Most other products contain twice the amount of free urea and therefore come with a very real scorch risk!
 

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Farmer Fin

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Aberdeenshire
Granular applied N is between 40-60% efficient (on a good day). Any nitrates applied through the soil are easily taken in by the plant but remember it is a poison and requires / uses significant energy from the plant to turn NO3 into NH2. This means energy is wasted on turning the Nitrates (poison) into something useable (NH2), energy that could have been used for growing / driving yield. The typical "flush" of grow / greening you see following an application of AN, for example, is no more than the plant cells filling with water. This results in lower DM, increased risk of lodging and a significant increase in risk of disease. Granular applied N works by applying loads on in the hope that when the N is actually needed by the plant there is enough left. Take maize, roughly 40% of it's N requirement is after tasseling yet we apply N in the seed bed which means we have to apply more in the seed bed in the hope it doesn't all volatilise or leach before its needed.

We don't eat all our food for the week on a Sunday night, we need little and often. Crops are the same.

Foliar N is applied directly onto the leaf, it is extremely sticky, rain fast and slow release. Depending on the polymer content, and there is a big difference so be careful, it wont cause scorch and thanks to the form the N is supplied in, it is easily and efficiently absorbed through the leaf, no poison. The NUE of Foliar N depends on the Polymer %, the higher the percentage of Polymer the higher the NUE. The rest is Free Urea, which is no more or no less, dissolved urea. This is what causes scorch so as I said before be careful.

The attached screenshot is trial data done by the AICC (so independent) last year using KWS Extase in Crowfield. You can see a reduction in total N applied resulted in almost no change in yield across the board. 290kg N/ha from granular fertiliser yielded 11.4t/ha where as 128kg N/ha from granular and foliar yielded 11.3t/ha. There is trial data going back 15 years showing similar results in almost every crop, including grass.

Foliar N isn't going to replace all granular N and there is 100% still a place / need for it but, later applications of N can absolutely be replaced with Foliar to reduce total N applied while maintaining yields. For all the reason above and with 15 years worth of trial data, a lot of it independent, to back it up, we can say that 40kgs N/ha from granular can be replaced with just 7kgs N/ha from Efficie-N-t 28 for comparable yields. Other Foliar fertiliser are available, results will be different as they contain different Polymer and Free Urea percentages. Also beware of scorch. Efficie-N-t 28 contains 22% Polymer and 6% Free urea. Most other products contain twice the amount of free urea and therefore come with a very real scorch risk!
So treatment 2 is no Efficie?
 

Farmer Fin

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Aberdeenshire
Granular applied N is between 40-60% efficient (on a good day). Any nitrates applied through the soil are easily taken in by the plant but remember it is a poison and requires / uses significant energy from the plant to turn NO3 into NH2. This means energy is wasted on turning the Nitrates (poison) into something useable (NH2), energy that could have been used for growing / driving yield. The typical "flush" of grow / greening you see following an application of AN, for example, is no more than the plant cells filling with water. This results in lower DM, increased risk of lodging and a significant increase in risk of disease. Granular applied N works by applying loads on in the hope that when the N is actually needed by the plant there is enough left. Take maize, roughly 40% of it's N requirement is after tasseling yet we apply N in the seed bed which means we have to apply more in the seed bed in the hope it doesn't all volatilise or leach before its needed.

We don't eat all our food for the week on a Sunday night, we need little and often. Crops are the same.

Foliar N is applied directly onto the leaf, it is extremely sticky, rain fast and slow release. Depending on the polymer content, and there is a big difference so be careful, it wont cause scorch and thanks to the form the N is supplied in, it is easily and efficiently absorbed through the leaf, no poison. The NUE of Foliar N depends on the Polymer %, the higher the percentage of Polymer the higher the NUE. The rest is Free Urea, which is no more or no less, dissolved urea. This is what causes scorch so as I said before be careful.

The attached screenshot is trial data done by the AICC (so independent) last year using KWS Extase in Crowfield. You can see a reduction in total N applied resulted in almost no change in yield across the board. 290kg N/ha from granular fertiliser yielded 11.4t/ha where as 128kg N/ha from granular and foliar yielded 11.3t/ha. There is trial data going back 15 years showing similar results in almost every crop, including grass.

Foliar N isn't going to replace all granular N and there is 100% still a place / need for it but, later applications of N can absolutely be replaced with Foliar to reduce total N applied while maintaining yields. For all the reason above and with 15 years worth of trial data, a lot of it independent, to back it up, we can say that 40kgs N/ha from granular can be replaced with just 7kgs N/ha from Efficie-N-t 28 for comparable yields. Other Foliar fertiliser are available, results will be different as they contain different Polymer and Free Urea percentages. Also beware of scorch. Efficie-N-t 28 contains 22% Polymer and 6% Free urea. Most other products contain twice the amount of free urea and therefore come with a very real scorch risk!
Also can you share the rest of your trial data? Stats? Is this a tramline trial? Replicated etc?
 

Farmer Fin

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Aberdeenshire
Granular applied N is between 40-60% efficient (on a good day). Any nitrates applied through the soil are easily taken in by the plant but remember it is a poison and requires / uses significant energy from the plant to turn NO3 into NH2. This means energy is wasted on turning the Nitrates (poison) into something useable (NH2), energy that could have been used for growing / driving yield. The typical "flush" of grow / greening you see following an application of AN, for example, is no more than the plant cells filling with water. This results in lower DM, increased risk of lodging and a significant increase in risk of disease. Granular applied N works by applying loads on in the hope that when the N is actually needed by the plant there is enough left. Take maize, roughly 40% of it's N requirement is after tasseling yet we apply N in the seed bed which means we have to apply more in the seed bed in the hope it doesn't all volatilise or leach before its needed.

We don't eat all our food for the week on a Sunday night, we need little and often. Crops are the same.

Foliar N is applied directly onto the leaf, it is extremely sticky, rain fast and slow release. Depending on the polymer content, and there is a big difference so be careful, it wont cause scorch and thanks to the form the N is supplied in, it is easily and efficiently absorbed through the leaf, no poison. The NUE of Foliar N depends on the Polymer %, the higher the percentage of Polymer the higher the NUE. The rest is Free Urea, which is no more or no less, dissolved urea. This is what causes scorch so as I said before be careful.

The attached screenshot is trial data done by the AICC (so independent) last year using KWS Extase in Crowfield. You can see a reduction in total N applied resulted in almost no change in yield across the board. 290kg N/ha from granular fertiliser yielded 11.4t/ha where as 128kg N/ha from granular and foliar yielded 11.3t/ha. There is trial data going back 15 years showing similar results in almost every crop, including grass.

Foliar N isn't going to replace all granular N and there is 100% still a place / need for it but, later applications of N can absolutely be replaced with Foliar to reduce total N applied while maintaining yields. For all the reason above and with 15 years worth of trial data, a lot of it independent, to back it up, we can say that 40kgs N/ha from granular can be replaced with just 7kgs N/ha from Efficie-N-t 28 for comparable yields. Other Foliar fertiliser are available, results will be different as they contain different Polymer and Free Urea percentages. Also beware of scorch. Efficie-N-t 28 contains 22% Polymer and 6% Free urea. Most other products contain twice the amount of free urea and therefore come with a very real scorch risk!
You also forgot to say that 190n from granular yielded as much as 290n.
 

Sincock

Member
Trade
Location
Cornwall
So treatment 2 is no Efficie?
Correct. Only treatments 4, 5, 7, 8 and 9 had efficient28.

Also can you share the rest of your trial data? Stats? Is this a tramline trial? Replicated etc?
The graph I shared was from AICC trials last year. AICC members will be able to access all their trial data, including methodology. We haven't publicised too much of our 2021 trial data as availability of efficient28 is tight this year, increased demand as well as all the usual worldwide issues effecting supply chains etc...

You also forgot to say that 190n from granular yielded as much as 290n.
Sorry, I will rephrase... 190 kgs N / ha yielded 11.2t / ha whereas only 128 kgs N / ha yielded more with 11.3t / ha!
 

ih1455xl

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
northampton
Correct. Only treatments 4, 5, 7, 8 and 9 had efficient28.


The graph I shared was from AICC trials last year. AICC members will be able to access all their trial data, including methodology. We haven't publicised too much of our 2021 trial data as availability of efficient28 is tight this year, increased demand as well as all the usual worldwide issues effecting supply chains etc...


Sorry, I will rephrase... 190 kgs N / ha yielded 11.2t / ha whereas only 128 kgs N / ha yielded more with 11.3t / ha!
What about grain proteins
 

Farmer Fin

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Aberdeenshire
Correct. Only treatments 4, 5, 7, 8 and 9 had efficient28.


The graph I shared was from AICC trials last year. AICC members will be able to access all their trial data, including methodology. We haven't publicised too much of our 2021 trial data as availability of efficient28 is tight this year, increased demand as well as all the usual worldwide issues effecting supply chains etc...


Sorry, I will rephrase... 190 kgs N / ha yielded 11.2t / ha whereas only 128 kgs N / ha yielded more with 11.3t / ha!
Yes but how much did 128 of bagged N yield? Next question is how what does your product cost? Surely if it’s your product you are tying to sell then you have the trial data to share? Surely you have nothing to hide.
 

Sincock

Member
Trade
Location
Cornwall
Yes but how much did 128 of bagged N yield? Next question is how what does your product cost? Surely if it’s your product you are tying to sell then you have the trial data to share? Surely you have nothing to hide.
What about grain proteins
I don't know how much 128kgs granular N / ha yielded as they didn't do that quantity of granular N but they did for 247kgs N / ha. Treatments 4, 5 and 6 all had the same total N applied (207kgs) with treatments 4 & 5 receiving 7kgs from E28 and treatment 6 and additional 7kgs N from AN.

Treatment 4 yielded 10.9 t/ha with a protein % of 12.98
Treatment 5 yielded 11.1 t/ha with a protein % of 12.91
Treatment 6 yielded 11.15 t/ha with a protein % of 12.77

As a company we actively try and encourage farmers to use less total N while trying to maintain a comparable yield which is why most of our trials are comparing a reduced total N application. For me, the biggest benefit of using foliar N is in reducing the environmental impact artificial fertilisers can have as well as the improvements in both soil health and crop health.

This is the headline I would like to be talking about with Foliar N but most farmers are still only interested in yield... however, if you bare with me:
40kgs N / ha from EU produced AN = 394.2 kgs CO2 equivalents
7kgs N / ha from Efficie-N-t 28 = 67.75 kgs CO2 equivalents.

If you replaced AN with E28 over 10ha you would have saved 3,264.5kg CO2 equivalents.
That's the same CO2 emissions given off by a Ford Focus 1.5L eco-boost driving almost 15,000 miles.

We are currently operating with a monthly price and April is already sold out. We dont yet have the May price but have pretty much sold out of that as well. I would speak to your local agronomy company to find out if they have any stock and if so, at what price.

I have attached a little booklet with some information and trial results from the main crops.View attachment 1030601If you wanted to see some specific trial results for a specific crop in a specific area let me know and I will see what I can find.
 

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ih1455xl

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
northampton
I don't know how much 128kgs granular N / ha yielded as they didn't do that quantity of granular N but they did for 247kgs N / ha. Treatments 4, 5 and 6 all had the same total N applied (207kgs) with treatments 4 & 5 receiving 7kgs from E28 and treatment 6 and additional 7kgs N from AN.

Treatment 4 yielded 10.9 t/ha with a protein % of 12.98
Treatment 5 yielded 11.1 t/ha with a protein % of 12.91
Treatment 6 yielded 11.15 t/ha with a protein % of 12.77

As a company we actively try and encourage farmers to use less total N while trying to maintain a comparable yield which is why most of our trials are comparing a reduced total N application. For me, the biggest benefit of using foliar N is in reducing the environmental impact artificial fertilisers can have as well as the improvements in both soil health and crop health.

This is the headline I would like to be talking about with Foliar N but most farmers are still only interested in yield... however, if you bare with me:
40kgs N / ha from EU produced AN = 394.2 kgs CO2 equivalents
7kgs N / ha from Efficie-N-t 28 = 67.75 kgs CO2 equivalents.

If you replaced AN with E28 over 10ha you would have saved 3,264.5kg CO2 equivalents.
That's the same CO2 emissions given off by a Ford Focus 1.5L eco-boost driving almost 15,000 miles.

We are currently operating with a monthly price and April is already sold out. We dont yet have the May price but have pretty much sold out of that as well. I would speak to your local agronomy company to find out if they have any stock and if so, at what price.

I have attached a little booklet with some information and trial results from the main crops.View attachment 1030601If you wanted to see some specific trial results for a specific crop in a specific area let me know and I will see what I can find.
How many lts of product to get the 7kg of N
And how much is a ibc
 

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HSENI names new farm safety champions

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Written by William Kellett from Agriland

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The Health and Safety Executive for Northern Ireland (HSENI) alongside the Farm Safety Partnership (FSP), has named new farm safety champions and commended the outstanding work on farm safety that has been carried out in the farming community in the last 20 years.

Two of these champions are Malcom Downey, retired principal inspector for the Agri/Food team in HSENI and Harry Sinclair, current chair of the Farm Safety Partnership and former president of the Ulster Farmers’ Union (UFU).

Improving farm safety is the key aim of HSENI’s and the FSP’s work and...
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