Log fired domestic heating system

[Kidds]

Thinking about a new heating system, currently the DHW and heating are from a log burner in the living room. Missus wants the luxury of oil so the heating will come on in the morning without having to light the fire. Am I right in thinking a thermal store will/can do this?
We have unlimited supply of logs and I would prefer not to buy oil.
My ideal system would be log fired cooker that does hot water and central heating and a heat store to run heating in morning. Is that feasible/possible?

Also, can you get RHI for new log burning system? Not important but would be handy.

 

[renewablejohn]

Get a lohberger fired cooker with pellet option. Then you can use your logs but can also have auto light facility so you dont even have to get out of bed in the morning to light the fire its auto light on a timer. Will also run the hot water and central heating as well as cook. Just sit down when you look at the price but worth every penny if you have unlimited supply of logs.

 

[ISCO]

We have eco angus log boiler heating 2 farmhouses with 4000 litre thermal store providing heating on a morning. We get RHI on this but not sure how system currently works

 

[HolzKopf]

We had thermal store - a relatively modern set-up installed in 2007. That gave us mains pressure showers by storing mains pressure cold within a long, tight coil within the thermal store cylinder. It was ok in the main but two (hot enough) showers within 20 minutes was an impossibility. The thermal store was fed from our oil burning aga. We then added an oil condensing boiler for assisting the aga when the dhw struggled.
The nail in the coffin was last early year when the cylinder rotted out and p*ssed water all over the place. Turned out that our very expensive copper cylinder was as porous as it comes due to oxygenation caused by the mains water and iron issues from the aga.
After talking to an aga bod at aga he admitted that the boiler in an aga was a very expensive way of heating water. We now use our Grant condensing boiler for water and heating and tbh the consumption has not altered much and the water is kept at a constant 60o.
We've also got two efficient log burners and a not so efficient large open hearth where most of the heat goes up the chimney. The wood burners give a lot of our ground floor heat - we rarely have heating upstairs save the bathroom - and distribution is via 3 x VonHaus sterling engine fans.
I liked the idea of thermal store and it was good boring the pants off of people explaining how it all worked but experience has shown that the ability to heat water in volume was just not there. A decent oil boiler and controls + good insulation assists the woodburners nicely

HK

 

[Tomr10]

Got a oil burner with hot water tank. Log burner is the main oil is the back up. Run with under floor heating more cost effective to have doors open when it gets hot than turn the heating off

 

[Kidds]

We have eco angus log boiler heating 2 farmhouses with 4000 litre thermal store providing heating on a morning. We get RHI on this but not sure how system currently works

I have looked at them but I don’t want to heat two houses. Am I right in thinking you burn them flat out to heat the store up and use that heat until you need to light the fire again? Batch burning rather than having the burner on slumber?
If that is right then I guess that would work.

I want to be able to cook on a wood stove, have done so for years but have moved house and no range cooker (yet). In my old place the only cooker I had was the wood fuelled range.
Plan to have wood range, hopefully this will do DHW and central heating. It’s just that first thing in the morning heat I want to sort. If it is best to have oil for this it’s ok but would prefer if if a heat store would suffice, not if it’s going to fail in a short time though!

 

[Kidds]

Heat produced to cook food is not eligible for RHI

 

[Tomr10]

Have a hot water tank. Fire is so efficient have to have heating on or run water as it can boil the tank
Can you not sh!t the stove down so the fire is kept in

 

[sodbuster2]

We use a 13kw log boiler stove to heat a 500 litre DHW tank (using a coil inside the tank) which then passes into a 1000 litre space heating tank ( this supplies underfloor as demanded ).
Only light stove every 3rd day for 4 months of year but plan to avoid this by installing approx 5kw of PV which will then heat the immersion in the base of the DHW tank.
Both tanks have 100mm of polyfoam which helps reduce parasitic loss.

 

[Poorbuthappy]

I want to be able to cook on a wood stove, have done so for years but have moved house and no range cooker (yet). In my old place the only cooker I had was the wood fuelled range.
Plan to have wood range, hopefully this will do DHW and central heating. It’s just that first thing in the morning heat I want to sort. If it is best to have oil for this it’s ok but would prefer if if a heat store would suffice, not if it’s going to fail in a short time though!

As renewable John says Lohberger will do this. Can set a timer so it lights up before you get out of bed using pellets but it switches automatically to logs if you leave logs in it ready overnight.
But no, not eligible for rhi.

Wood Pellet Burning Cookers

Lohberger cookers that burn wood pellets.

www.zerocookers.co.uk

 

[renewablejohn]

As renewable John says Lohberger will do this. Can set a timer so it lights up before you get out of bed using pellets but it switches automatically to logs if you leave logs in it ready overnight.
But no, not eligible for rhi.

Wood Pellet Burning Cookers

Lohberger cookers that burn wood pellets.

www.zerocookers.co.uk

View attachment 836279

I see you fitted the Laddomat. Has it helped with the oven temperature regulation and did you go for the standard thermostat in the Laddomat or go for the high temperature one. Sorry to derail thread.

 

[ISCO]

I have looked at them but I don’t want to heat two houses. Am I right in thinking you burn them flat out to heat the store up and use that heat until you need to light the fire again? Batch burning rather than having the burner on slumber?
If that is right then I guess that would work.

I want to be able to cook on a wood stove, have done so for years but have moved house and no range cooker (yet). In my old place the only cooker I had was the wood fuelled range.
Plan to have wood range, hopefully this will do DHW and central heating. It’s just that first thing in the morning heat I want to sort. If it is best to have oil for this it’s ok but would prefer if if a heat store would suffice, not if it’s going to fail in a short time though!

Yes that is correct. We batch burn. In winter it is burning almost constantly but does keep houses very warm.
Key as always is dry logs.

 

[Poorbuthappy]

I see you fitted the Laddomat. Has it helped with the oven temperature regulation and did you go for the standard thermostat in the Laddomat or go for the high temperature one. Sorry to derail thread.

That was installed at outset.
Had the thermostat as supplied by zeroridge. I think we ought to be trying the high temp one.

 

[br jones]

Pipe it all into a dunsley neutraliser

 

[Lincs Lass]

Pipe it all into a dunsley neutraliser

View attachment 836346

Knit one ,pearl one ,,strewth ,that lot looks complicated

 

[Kidds]

Pipe it all into a dunsley neutraliser

The cost of all those earth straps would scare me.

 

[Dave645]

Thinking about a new heating system, currently the DHW and heating are from a log burner in the living room. Missus wants the luxury of oil so the heating will come on in the morning without having to light the fire. Am I right in thinking a thermal store will/can do this?
We have unlimited supply of logs and I would prefer not to buy oil.
My ideal system would be log fired cooker that does hot water and central heating and a heat store to run heating in morning. Is that feasible/possible?

Also, can you get RHI for new log burning system? Not important but would be handy.

Ok I would avoid oil, and look at a ground or air source heat pump, the very large thermal stores are ok but are expensive and require heating up to high temps I suggest you could go to a similar system to me,
I have a solar store which is about 700l which is heated from roof solar, which acts as a pre heat for my ground source heat pump which runs my heating and hot water, so in your system your wood burning stove replaces my solar roof, in your system, and the ground source heat pump runs the heating and hot water on the automatic side, they get RHI
My heat pump also has a 200l thermal water tank that my solar water also can heat via. A mini hot water loop which pumps hot water from the 700l tank to the 200l tank.

It’s very efficient the tanks are open so are on closed loops, so your wood burner pumps a closed loop of raddator fluid and the tank let’s you get mains pressure hot water out, the ground source heat pump can then control the whole system, it can direct heat the hot water flowing around the radiator system or draw heat from the body of the 700l thermal store, if it’s on tap.
That tank size can fit though a normal door size, but one litre of water is 1kg so it’s about a tonne filled 250kg empty.
JKL renewals fitted mine, he lives in my village but he used to work for a big company and is now an independent, he knew more about these systems than anyone I talked to, and I talked to a lot of companies.

One of the befits for me is even if there is only a small solar effect in winter say it’s heating the water to 20-30 Degrees that effect is useful as it’s picked up because my hot water uses a large coil so as long as the water in the tank is warmer than the incoming cold water feed it pre heats the cold feed so reduces the load on the ground source heat pump, with your wood fired system it will give you mains pressure hot water, at safe temps via a balancer which caps it at 60 degrees and when your low on tank heat the ground source heat pump takes over. From it’s 200 litre internal supply.

 

[br jones]

Knit one ,pearl one ,,strewth ,that lot looks complicated

Not really ,just think of it as 3 pairs of flow and return ,and several outlets ,also a few valves to keep things safe

 

[Tomr10]

Ok I would avoid oil, and look at a ground or air source heat pump, the very large thermal stores are ok but are expensive and require heating up to high temps I suggest you could go to a similar system to me,
I have a solar store which is about 700l which is heated from roof solar, which acts as a pre heat for my ground source heat pump which runs my heating and hot water, so in your system your wood burning stove replaces my solar roof, in your system, and the ground source heat pump runs the heating and hot water on the automatic side, they get RHI
My heat pump also has a 200l thermal water tank that my solar water also can heat via. A mini hot water loop which pumps hot water from the 700l tank to the 200l tank.

It’s very efficient the tanks are open so are on closed loops, so your wood burner pumps a closed loop of raddator fluid and the tank let’s you get mains pressure hot water out, the ground source heat pump can then control the whole system, it can direct heat the hot water flowing around the radiator system or draw heat from the body of the 700l thermal store, if it’s on tap.
That tank size can fit though a normal door size, but one litre of water is 1kg so it’s about a tonne filled 250kg empty.
JKL renewals fitted mine, he lives in my village but he used to work for a big company and is now an independent, he knew more about these systems than anyone I talked to, and I talked to a lot of companies.

One of the befits for me is even if there is only a small solar effect in winter say it’s heating the water to 20-30 Degrees that effect is useful as it’s picked up because my hot water uses a large coil so as long as the water in the tank is warmer than the incoming cold water feed it pre heats the cold feed so reduces the load on the ground source heat pump, with your wood fired system it will give you mains pressure hot water, at safe temps via a balancer which caps it at 60 degrees and when your low on tank heat the ground source heat pump takes over. From it’s 200 litre internal supply.

What country you in where we are no chance

 

[Dave645]

What country you in where we are no chance

http://www.jknrenewables.co.uk/?LMCL=Bdvc5L
Is the website for the company that fitted my system.
I am in the uk, we are outside the mains gas network, so had no problem getting RHI, I have no clue now, but the system is still great.

And it was this brand of thermal store
https://www.stovesonline.co.uk/stove-chimney-documentation/AKVATERM-Accumulator-tanks.pdf

I have a large hot water coil and a solar coil, the body is connected to the radiator system but they are flexible in how they can be plumbed up, I also have expansion vessels to balance the pressure over the large operating temperature range.
Everyone house and system will be different that’s why it’s always best to talk to a good company one that will tell you what’s possible and what’s not.

I assume that for the poster that the wood burning stove is still going to be the primary heat source, he just wants something to step in and cover the mornings and mains pressure hot water side giving more flexibility while still covering the main load with wood. If this is the case heat pumps can do this even in high heat demand houses.
My solar tank tops out at 95 C, far to hot for tap water, so it has a blending valve abit like a shower valve to set a max water temp for the hot water going to the taps. It doesn’t effect the hot water pressure as it’s all at mains pressure it just allows cold to be mixed after the system before the taps to ensure water is never over 60C at the taps.

I will note balanced or direct air wood burning stoves are another big step forward, heat without drafts.
This was the company I got mine from I see they have extended the range
https://www.stovesonline.co.uk/direct-air-supply-stoves.html

If you don’t know the advantage of these types of wood burners do some research. They cover the air demand so you don’t suffer from negative air pressure forcing in cold air from outside through every little gap around your doors and windows. It’s amazing what a difference they make especially compared to open fires.