Low mood in agriculture

[7610 super q]

I'm just scratching my head wondering what the Mercosur deal has to do with the last 40 years of your patently miserable farming life. . Perhaps you can explain?

Latest in a very long list.... Intervention, milk quotas, set aside, goal post moving subsidies, silly enviro schemes, 3 crop rule...

 

[Skimmer]

If doom and gloom was fore sale some farmers would buy it ready to use on brighter days.

 

[Cowabunga]

Latest in a very long list.... Intervention, milk quotas, set aside, goal post moving subsidies, silly enviro schemes, 3 crop rule...

Let's see now..
Intervention, bought excess production if the price hit the safety-net limit and therefore gave a bottom to the market

Milk quotas. Worked to limit production for many years, was tradeable and made at least one of the most vocal anti-EU contributors here into a multi-millionaire landowner when he legitimately cashed in the asset that was given free by the EU.

Set Aside. Paid a subsidy from the EU on land for not growing a crop. A subsidy that was entirely voluntary and neither the payment not set-aside need have been taken up by farmer.

Goal posts in the form of policy goals and inducements always change with the political imperatives. Mostly those of the domestic country within which there is massive scope to deviate from general EU policy.

Silly enviro schemes. All voluntary and none of which I have ever entered into.

Three crop rule. Only if you want the subsidy. You do not have to take the subsidy.


How have any of these, which turn out to be ways of subsidising your income rather than penalising you, with the exception of quotas which were a supply management tool introduced because of grossly excessive production increases, really given you such a shitty 40 year plus career in farming while others around you have thrived?

 

[Cowabunga]

Oh and Mercosur… Yes it allows a reduced tariff of 7.5% on 99,000 tons of South American beef annually. That's roughly 0.13kgs per head of European population that will be imported but still charged a tax of 7.5%.
French and German farmers are up in arms about it of course and can't understand how their EU would have signed off such a deal. I'm not about to justify it one way or another but it is nothing compared to the deals the UK will have to do individually with a whole ruck of nations with nothing more than food to send our way, if we leave the EU without a deal.

 

[Cropper]

If doom and gloom was fore sale some farmers would buy it ready to use on brighter days.

That’s really made me laugh, thank you

 

[7610 super q]

Oh and Mercosur… Yes it allows a reduced tariff of 7.5% on 99,000 tons of South American beef annually. That's roughly 0.13kgs per head of European population that will be imported but still charged a tax of 7.5%.
French and German farmers are up in arms about it of course and can't understand how their EU would have signed off such a deal. I'm not about to justify it one way or another but it is nothing compared to the deals the UK will have to do individually with a whole ruck of nations with nothing more than food to send our way, if we leave the EU without a deal.

OK, so you're happy about importing South American beef, in exchange for exporting German cars. Alrighty then.

 

[Cowabunga]

OK, so you're happy about importing South American beef, in exchange for exporting German cars. Alrighty then.

I fail to see how my opinion on this makes any difference. The EU negotiators must have decided that there is mutual economical advantage to the deal and I am not privy to that information or whether the prospects for German car exports will be significantly improved or not, any more than for British car experts should we remain in the EU and party to that agreement.
I know that outside the EU's various trade agreements, the UK will need to negotiate our own. This one took all of ten years to complete, so best of luck with that.
If we do eventually have a hard brexit, you ain't seen nothing yet. You really will have something to bitch about within a couple of years and you might be full time cleaning your local sewers or sweeping streets. No doubt still blaming someone else foreign.

 

[ollie989898]

Let's see now..
Intervention, bought excess production if the price hit the safety-net limit and therefore gave a bottom to the market

Milk quotas. Worked to limit production for many years, was tradeable and made at least one of the most vocal anti-EU contributors here into a multi-millionaire landowner when he legitimately cashed in the asset that was given free by the EU.

Set Aside. Paid a subsidy from the EU on land for not growing a crop. A subsidy that was entirely voluntary and neither the payment not set-aside need have been taken up by farmer.

Goal posts in the form of policy goals and inducements always change with the political imperatives. Mostly those of the domestic country within which there is massive scope to deviate from general EU policy.

Silly enviro schemes. All voluntary and none of which I have ever entered into.

Three crop rule. Only if you want the subsidy. You do not have to take the subsidy.


How have any of these, which turn out to be ways of subsidising your income rather than penalising you, with the exception of quotas which were a supply management tool introduced because of grossly excessive production increases, really given you such a shitty 40 year plus career in farming while others around you have thrived?

I'm confused. One minute you say subsidies are essential, the next you are saying they are a waste of time?

 

[milkloss]

If doom and gloom was fore sale some farmers would buy it ready to use on brighter days.

Reckon I’ve maxed out all my credit cards on the fecking stuff!

 

[7610 super q]

I fail to see how my opinion on this makes any difference. The EU negotiators must have decided that there is mutual economical advantage to the deal and I am not privy to that information or whether the prospects for German car exports will be significantly improved or not, any more than for British car experts should we remain in the EU and party to that agreement.
I know that outside the EU's various trade agreements, the UK will need to negotiate our own. This one took all of ten years to complete, so best of luck with that.
If we do eventually have a hard brexit, you ain't seen nothing yet. You really will have something to bitch about within a couple of years and you might be full time cleaning your local sewers or sweeping streets. No doubt still blaming someone else foreign.

These make interesting reading. Pre referendum, pre Brexit, so we can't blame that. Profits for lowland cattle / sheep farmers in the low £20k's. Road sweeping might actually pay better. I just don't see that the agricultural streets have been paved with gold under the CAP. So we'll just have to agree to differ.

https://www.aber.ac.uk/en/media/departmental/ibers/farmbusinesssurvey/FBS_Booklet_Eng_1516.pdf

 

[glasshouse]

Well hes positive about the country ,positve about our future and positive about British Farming

He was positive he was going to get his leg over a few weeks ago too, that didnt end well!

 

[Cowabunga]

I'm confused. One minute you say subsidies are essential, the next you are saying they are a waste of time?

You certainly are confused. Where have I said that they are a waste of time? It is 7610SuperQ that claims to be so hard done by despite all the subsidies that he doesn't seem to recognise as being subsidies, rather being in his eyes 'penalties'. Ones that, apart from quotas, he could have opted out of at the drop of a hat.

 

[Derrick Hughes]

I've got a big tree in the garden .its in a windy spot so had a ladder either side to hold it up . Last week someone took the ladders away and it broke off at the root , if I had planted a decent tree to start with and not used the ladders I would have a lovely big tree now

 

[Cowabunga]

These make interesting reading. Pre referendum, pre Brexit, so we can't blame that. Profits for lowland cattle / sheep farmers in the low £20k's. Road sweeping might actually pay better. I just don't see that the agricultural streets have been paved with gold under the CAP. So we'll just have to agree to differ.

https://www.aber.ac.uk/en/media/departmental/ibers/farmbusinesssurvey/FBS_Booklet_Eng_1516.pdf

If you want a business that pays the below-average-Joe dividends, you really should not be producing commodity goods. On average they will never yield much better than the marginal cost of production and as a result the bottom 25% of least efficient producers will always struggle no matter how high the top 25% fly.

 

[Kevtherev]

Yes indeed, I know a farmer with new car, new tractor (last one done 2000 hours) but hasn’t paid contractor for silaging 3/4 years ago, bought the machinery to do his own last 2 years, I believe there’s a machinery dealer with a major repair bill outstanding for a similar amount of time, I wouldn’t be surprised there are others too.

I had some of them sort
Glad I’m well rid.
Shameful behaviour and gives agriculture a bad name.

 

[7610 super q]

I've got a big tree in the garden .its in a windy spot so had a ladder either side to hold it up . Last week someone took the ladders away and it broke off at the root , if I had planted a decent tree to start with and not used the ladders I would have a lovely big tree now

 

[Henarar]

I don't follow your logic. Well actually, yes I do, only too well. You actually want these farmers to be forced to go bust. You want the industry to be devastated, rather like a religious fanatic who wants to see the end of the world by extreme violence in order for his sect's believers to be reborn to a new cleansed barren earth. I'll put you exactly in that category of lunatics. Unless you have a more rational explanation...

some people want to rule the world @ollie989898 just wants to watch it burn

 

[Henarar]

View attachment 818888

no it was tall until it fell over

 

[milkloss]

I don't follow your logic. Well actually, yes I do, only too well. You actually want these farmers to be forced to go bust. You want the industry to be devastated, rather like a religious fanatic who wants to see the end of the world by extreme violence in order for his sect's believers to be reborn to a new cleansed barren earth. I'll put you exactly in that category of lunatics. Unless you have a more rational explanation...

This was what the op was really on about except you used more longer words

You d be surprised how many ‘young bucks’ on this forum want to see those receiving subs crash and burn....... bugger the consequences.

carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero, Roughly translated as: Seize the day and don’t rely on what might be happening tomorrow.

 

[milkloss]

Look on the bright side:-

An ever increasing 3rd world population has to eat very cheap food!

I’m like the dark cloud that just keeps giving