Machinery Student Cock Up!

[Dave W]

Go on then name someone your thinking of.

Wasn't thinking of anyone specific. Just going on the state of some of the "genuine" trade ins I get

 

[puntabrava]

Wasn't thinking of anyone specific. Just going on the state of some of the "genuine" trade ins I get

The mistake the lad made on my Hilux was “genuine” the mistake made on the OP’s vehicle would be “genuine”. I do not really get your angle here!

 

[Dave W]

The mistake the lad made on my Hilux was “genuine” the mistake made on the OP’s vehicle would be “genuine”. I do not really get your angle here!

There's lots on this thread jumping on the kid for an honest mistake.
Have none of them ever made a mistake before?

 

[Cowabunga]

Always find it remarkable that a lot of folks on here won't even know what a sump plug is let alone ever changed oil. Yet very quick to hide behind a keyboard and condemn someone else's efforts

I wonder who you mean by that? Lots of them are there?

 

[Dave W]

I wonder who you mean by that? Lots of them are there?

As above. Want anyone specific. Just don't think it's fair to jump on the kid for a mistake doing something they don't know how to do themselves

 

[Cowabunga]

I wouldn’t trust a student to do an oil change

I was doing oil changes at 11 years of age. If I didn’t they would all be like my father’s 1964 MF135, absolute scrap by 1970. Ruined through neglect within 2500 hours and fit only for recycling.
In college I despaired at the completely wrong method being taught by lecturer and workshop technicians to adjust the traction clutch of a MF 165.

 

[Lofty1984]

Think I must of been 12/13 when I was servicing our tractors at home

 

[Cowabunga]

As above. Want anyone specific. Just don't think it's fair to jump on the kid for a mistake doing something they don't know how to do themselves

He’s an agricultural engineering student. Changing engine oil really shouldn’t even need to be taught by anyone. It is so basic that anyone with an ounce of sense should be self-taught. The tightening torque of both sump plug and the filter or filter housing and checking one’s own work are the only tricky bits that need some mechanical sympathy and nouse. Brain surgery it is not!

Who are the commentators you assume that don’t know how to do it themselves. Many farmers such as myself will change the oil and filter of a tractor during a 45 minute lunch break while also giving it the once over for general fluid levels, loose fasteners, impending or actual fluid leaks, belt condition and so on. Next break the greasing would be done and so on.
I don’t expect a schoolchild or student to do what I have done straight off, but do expect a certain basic standard, an interest in the job and a minimum competence. Yes we all make mistakes, so he’d get a second chance, maybe even a third, by which time I’d know whether he was either an asset or a complete liability. Believe me, there’s as many liabilities out there as there are assets.

 

[Dave W]

Believe me, there’s as many liabilities out there as there are assets.

You've answered your own question there

 

[Cowabunga]

Think I must of been 12/13 when I was servicing our tractors at home

When I was fourteen I helped choose a new MF165. Failed to persuade my father to get a 185 for its extra two gears. First job I did was to remove the rear wheels, on my own, and use a bituminous paint to thoroughly coat the underneath parts of the rear mudguards including the outer toolbox and inner box sections of the thin pressed steel stiffeners. The mudguards remained in good condition from new in 1972 until the tractor was sold in 2003.

 

[Timbo]

He’s an agricultural engineering student. Changing engine oil really shouldn’t even need to be taught by anyone. It is so basic that anyone with an ounce of sense should be self-taught. The tightening torque of both sump plug and the filter or filter housing and checking one’s own work are the only tricky bits that need some mechanical sympathy and nouse. Brain surgery it is not!

Who are the commentators you assume that don’t know how to do it themselves. Many farmers such as myself will change the oil and filter of a tractor during a 45 minute lunch break while also giving it the once over for general fluid levels, loose fasteners, impending or actual fluid leaks, belt condition and so on. Next break the greasing would be done and so on.
I don’t expect a schoolchild or student to do what I have done straight off, but do expect a certain basic standard, an interest in the job and a minimum competence. Yes we all make mistakes, so he’d get a second chance, maybe even a third, by which time I’d know whether he was either an asset or a complete liability. Believe me, there’s as many liabilities out there as there are assets.

There are some "unseen" skills in doing just an oil change that take it from just about managing it, to doing it properly proper.

- warming the engine enough to thin the oil but not so much there's a risk of burns.
- positioning the wheels correctly so you can access areas you need to before loosing out the oil
- Slackening the filler cap before removing the sump bung so it doesnt air lock
- removing the filter such it doesnt cascade oil everywhere
- lubing the new filter seal and if vertical, filling the new filter with oil before putting it on hand tight.
- new sealing washer on sump bung and torquing it up to spec, opposed to "possibly tight enough" (i.e strips the thread or comes loose in service.)
- rags etc around the filler hole so not to pour new oil everywhere.
- appreciating the right amount of time to allow the level to settle to bring it up to correct on the dipstick depending on where the filler is (rocker cover or direct to sump)

no doubt afew other things too, but you get the idea. Eg forgetting to tighten the plug so it falls out or grossly overfilling the sump can rapidly kill the engine in work, it needs to be done right.
-

 

[Mc115reed]

Maybe the college is at fault with their teaching methods
Our sparky was saying when he did day release, 25 years ago, each apprentice had bench space. They had to wire up a fuse board ( or whatever ) with the tutor checking what they did.

Now his apprentice sits & watches the tutor wire a fuse board, at the end told to take a picture of the finished job & put it in his file.

I know which method will produce the best results

I’ll never forget when I did my fabrication apprenticeship we were practicing welding.. just a simple T joint… spent days just welding the same T joint, cutting metal, welding the T joint, I was first one in our class get a perfect test,.. took it over the instructor proud as punch saying I’d done it finally got it sussed… he just smiled, looked me in the eye… picked it up… threw it in the scrap bin and said “bet you can’t do 3 more of them in a row” and the pansy was right

 

[Lofty1984]

There are some "unseen" skills in doing just an oil change that take it from just about managing it, to doing it properly proper.

- warming the engine enough to thin the oil but not so much there's a risk of burns.
- positioning the wheels correctly so you can access areas you need to before loosing out the oil
- Slackening the filler cap before removing the sump bung so it doesnt air lock
- removing the filter such it doesnt cascade oil everywhere
- lubing the new filter seal and if vertical, filling the new filter with oil before putting it on hand tight.
- new sealing washer on sump bung and torquing it up to spec, opposed to "possibly tight enough" (i.e strips the thread or comes loose in service.)
- rags etc around the filler hole so not to pour new oil everywhere.
- appreciating the right amount of time to allow the level to settle to bring it up to correct on the dipstick depending on where the filler is (rocker cover or direct to sump)

no doubt afew other things too, but you get the idea. Eg forgetting to tighten the plug so it falls out or grossly overfilling the sump can rapidly kill the engine in work, it needs to be done right.
-

When you put it like that you do kind of take for granted that everyone knows its second Nature all that

 

[Frank-the-Wool]

Many thanks for all the replies and the hopeful solution to the problem.
The lad is not stupid, just a typical teenager who thinks he knows everything.
I took him at his word that he knew what he was doing. It appears after I queried whether he had actually done oil changes at College, they had watched it being done.

My fault perhaps for not supervising more, but I find students perform better if given some leeway and not put under pressure over time.

College training is not what it was or should be.

 

[Timbo]

The lad is not stupid, just a typical teenager who thinks he knows everything.
I took him at his word that he knew what he was doing. It appears after I queried whether he had actually done oil changes at College, they had watched it being done.

My fault perhaps for not supervising more, but I find students perform better if given some leeway and not put under pressure over time.

College training is not what it was or should be.

Difficult, cos you dont want to stand over them as they roll their eyes at you talking them through each move because "they apparently know it all, cos college has taught them"...!

 

[vantage]

Always find it remarkable that a lot of folks on here won't even know what a sump plug is let alone ever changed oil. Yet very quick to hide behind a keyboard and condemn someone else's efforts

Yes I do, it’s the thing at the base of the engine that annoyingly comes off when you drive over a boulder, which then leaves a mess everywhere. Then an annoying light comes up on the dash, quick tip here, a piece of insulation tape over it and you can drive on happy as Larry!

 

[Y Fan Wen]

I was doing oil changes at 11 years of age. If I didn’t they would all be like my father’s 1964 MF135, absolute scrap by 1970. Ruined through neglect within 2500 hours and fit only for recycling.
In college I despaired at the completely wrong method being taught by lecturer and workshop technicians to adjust the traction clutch of a MF 165.

Ah, you had a father like mine then! I'm afraid I've given up doing oil changes. It's too difficult for me to get up off the ground after removing the plug. Now I take the atvs to my local bike specialist and just pay out and feel happy that I'm not doing it.

https://www.gwionprys.co.uk

 

[melted welly]

Think I must of been 12/13 when I was servicing our tractors at home

I was about that age when I helped dad service the fourtrak. He had to go off to the office and left me to “fill it up with oil” which I did, right to the top.

Have you seen the ww2 films where the destroyers “make smoke” in order to escape a larger foe? It was a bit like that on the run home.

 

[Bogweevil]

Silly boy, no initiative these youngsters, nip into Halfords, get a universal plug, back at college by the time it falls. Did similar loads of times when a student - araldite was my best friend.

 

[Robt]

In his skull with a blunt chisel.

I’m afraid that much of the ‘talent’ that comes out from certain institutions is of this standard. Ask him to name the five events of the Otto Cycle as a basic test of knowledge which I learnt for myself at about 11 years of age. Don’t be surprised if all you get is an open-mouthed blank stare.

You never cross thread a bolt? #Aroganttwat