Massey 6190 lift arms stopped

[Ludan]

Hi, my massey 6190 lift arms have stopped working completely.
A few days ago they were working fine, then randomly they wouldn't activate. So I turned tractor off then on and tried again and they worked.
It did this again the following day, but has not worked since. I checked the fuses by steering column, and all look fine. Took the side panel off next to handbrake and found a 3 amp fuse that looked fine also. There's power to the activate/ lift/ lower switch. Someone mentioned alternator may not be kicking enough out, but there's 14.6 volts. Another suggested possibility is the draught sensors on the arms, which I aim to disconnect tommorow to see if that helps.. Just wondered if anyone has had this happen and if I should check any other places for fuses or bad connections, or has any ideas? Thanks in advance!!

 

[masseybreaker]

have you checked to two fuses above the battery ? does the linkage work if you use the two buttons for the pickup hitch ?

 

[Lincs Lass]

Not acidently caught the max height lift dial and turned it

 

[Ludan]

Yes fuses above the battery are fine. Moved the draught settings and arm height knobs and dials but theres nothing. it appears dead. There's normally red LEDs that flash/ or stay lit, but there's nothing now. It has the yellow buttons at the back of the console by the rear window and two pairs on the wings, but nothing out of any of them.. Thanks for your thoughts

 

[MF-ANDY]

Broken wire feeding the 2 front fuses from the battery. Broken red or black wire above panel behind rh step??. Test for 12v here with a light bulb

 

[Ludan]

Right, both the fuses above the battery are fine and there's 14.3 volts when tractors running. There's power to the red and black wires under the cab where the wiring is behind step. Have read in manual and the panel should light when first starting the tractor. This does not happen now. It also says that the outside buttons on wings stop the internal controls, so I wonder if there's a switch contact stuck outside. Going to disconnect each one to see if that does anything.
Tried the activator switch with test light and it appears to be lighting up various terminals when in each position. There's also an earth lead down to the pump so will check that.
Hoping its something simple, but may well be the circuit board in the control panel. Can't see or smell anything burnt..!

 

[Mur Huwcun]

Had something similar with an early 62. Where you found the 3 amp fuse I found a corroded wire in a plug connector way down the bottom there, IIRC about 6 wires in the block connector, one was a live feed.

 

[Two Tone]

Having checked the 2 main fuses above the battery, make sure all the negative Wires to the battery are good and that the connections from the wire to the banjos aren’t corroded. Especially on the 2 smaller wires connected to the negative side of the battery.

When the arms fail to work, it’s usually this that is the problem. It has happened to us on both our 6180 and our 3080.

 

[Ludan]

Thanks guys. I will go and check these now. Will get the leads off the battery and clean everything up. Ill have a dig around by that 3 amp fuse too. Greatly appreciated!

 

[wasted years]

Take the multi plug out of the lift arm control console and it should have 3 lives when running.
1 is permanent
2nd comes on with ignition switch
3rd comes on when running.
Lift arms will not work without all 3.
A full English pound says it is the permanent live.

 

[Ludan]

Thanks for all the help and suggestions!! Having disconnected, cleaned, reconnected battery leads and wires. re checked all fuses, disconnected the draught sensors, checked and cleaned all earths, with still no arms working, I went back to square one. I have traced the yellow wire from the battery to under the steps, which is a permanent live. I havent however found a permanent live in the harnesses in the cab. so I unplugged the multi socket from the control panel to see if it is there. Nothing is live when key off. One is live when the key is on. Only used a 12v bulb tester. Will double check with multi meter tomorrow in case the 9.5 volt went undetected maybe.. I have just looked at wiring diagram again, as I can't find this permanent live coming into the cab, and i got your message Wasted years. I have put that pound on the table for you! I now need to know which it should be. It's a 37 pin round plug for the control panel. Am I right that the 12 volt power runs from the 7.5amp fuse above battery to under the cab where the bunch of wiring is, then up to the control panel's 37 pin plug on one of the terminals?? Or does it go to the computer first then to the control panel? The manual mentions no1 being +12v - lighting on the 37 pin control panel plug, no.3 being 9.5volt power supply, no.23 power supply + engine running, and no.37 +12 volts after contact for autotronic signal. I am thinking there's a break in wire between control panel and cab steps as it appears.. Could I simply run a wire from behind steps where the feed is fine from 7.5amp fused supply and connect up to the no. 1 terminal on control panel plug? Or should it go via computer??

 

[wasted years]

I can't tell you exactly which the 3 should be as I have only learned through trial and error but the 3 lives are either 2pins on the top right of the plug as you look at it with one on the row underneath or one on the top and 2 underneath.
It does sound like the perm live is missing.
On one of mine there was a multi pin connecter under the lift arm control console with a corroded wire, it is just a case of following the power til you find where it isn't!

 

[Ludan]

Thank you wasted years. Not had much time on it today, but I did check the power to the control panel. There's nothing reading at all when key off. Key on and pin 37 reads 13volts. Engine started and pin 23 goes on and both 37 and 23 remain on reading over 14 volts each. According to the manual, pin number 3 should have 9.5 volts on from the electronic lift control computer. This is reading nothing at all so is likely something to do with the issue, but I can't yet find a broken wire or bad connection. Will resume again tommorow. Hoping its not an internal problem in the computer as that will involve some head scratching & hair pulling. Ps there's power going into the transmission control box behind the rh step which is fed from 7.5 amp fuse above battery. Haven't pulled a plug off in case it causes anything to need re calibrating.. As I believe that had to be done prior to me buying the tractor. Whether that could be related to this problem..?!!

 

[davedb]

Have a look around the bell housing area sometimes people cut the wires that come from the battery (separate little loom) when splitting the tractor you might have a problem there

 

[PaulNix]

On our 6180 there was another fuse behind the panel on the right of the seat by the handbrake, single fuse by itself running the linkage, very annoying to find the fault on ours and tried everything, in the end turned out was just that bloody fuse that wasn't mentioned anywhere on the instructions booklet or online, the fitter who was advising me over the phone almost cried when it suddenly came to him after a few days of advice over the phone.

 

[Ludan]

Thanks for all the suggestions and experiences with these masseys. We had another look today and found a very badly oxidised joint within a heat shrink in the wiring behind the RH step under the cab. We cut the heatshrink off and it fell apart! Was very pleased to find that!! New connection and arms are back again!! The lift arm computer and control panel rely on a constant 12 volt feed along with the two switched lives, as Wasted years mentioned. So thanks again for all the help!!

 

[Jimmy 91]

We have a 6190 were the round buttons at back of cab and mudgaurds buttons work except one but the rocker switch isn't anyone any idea what it could be ? Used to be temperamental every now and then but flick switch half dozen times and worked again , it's had a new rocker switch

 

[Two Tone]

There is a separate live and earth wire to from the battery for the hydraulic arms. Often the Earth gets rusty or corroded and stops the arms from working.
Clean or renew them and it’ll cure the problem.

 

[Jimmy 91]

Would the mudgaurds buttons still work when that wires at fault ? Will have a look at those wires

 

[Ludan]

Would the mudgaurds buttons still work when that wires at fault ? Will have a look at those wires

When ours went, nothing worked. No rocker switch or round buttons on the arches or in cab. Have you removed the panel underneath the console where your rocker switch is and found the fuse? I had half the cab panels out in the end to check for a broken wire. The likely places are behind the panel under the step (where ours was) or under the console. Another suggestion we had was to check the alternator output. Needs to be over 14 volts apparently for some electrics to work right.. Also there’s two fuses up above the battery. Check those. Try unplugging the draft pin plugs above the upper arms at the back right of tractor. They can cause problems. If I think of any other suggestions I will post. Good luck with it.