MF 4700,5700,6700 global series tractors, anyone got one?

[pudding]

how are they going, what are you doing with them, I am impressed with them from the outside, trying to convince someone to buy one, there is no local dealer near him, but where these things are built and sold does it really matter! i know this is there developing country tractor, built for emerging markets, and honestly believe this chassis will be round for years now.

there are lots of them appearing on livestock farms here and i have not heard any disaster stories, keen to see if they are what you high class european farmers are buying too.

 

[Jim B]

Had a look round one at Grassland. To be honest I'd prefer a Kubota, looks a much better built and finished tractor, and 5 year warranty. Japanese build quality and reliability.

There's no getting away from the fact the MF is built in China and the type of product people associate with that, regardless of their QC.

Anyone know what sort of money these MF are? Doubt there's much in it vs a like for like spec Kubota?

 

[Glaws]

Had a look round one at Grassland. To be honest I'd prefer a Kubota, looks a much better built and finished tractor, and 5 year warranty. Japanese build quality and reliability.

There's no getting away from the fact the MF is built in China and the type of product people associate with that, regardless of their QC.

Anyone know what sort of money these MF are? Doubt there's much in it vs a like for like spec Kubota?

The one at Grassland was built in the Beauvais factory in France.

My iPhone was made in China, pretty good quality to be fair.
By all accounts the Agco factory in China is state of the art and the view that if a product comes from China it must be bad, is a bit dated.

 

[Cowabunga]

The cab tractors are assembled in France with a locally made cab. I believe they come to France in CKD form.
The Chinese transmission factory is brand spanking new and state of the art, so I'm told. I have no issues with Chinese products built to Western quality standards. How could I with several Apple products, three Panasonic cameras and several lenses, plus DECT phones and components for very many high and low-tech products, all made in China and top quality.

The main issue with these Global series tractors is apparently the time it takes from order to delivery. Dealers locally have had many on order for six months and much longer and have seen very few come through. Obviously if some of these are unsold, then a customer won't have to wait that long, but it makes a dealer's life very difficult.

Whether someone prefers a Kubota or not is up to them entirely. The driver environment is very different and I know which I'd prefer all other things being equal. Both will do the same job, no doubt about it. These are basic no-frills machines of a traditional type, but modernised.

Give me a Dyna4 any day, but for some a basic synchromesh transmission, a linkage that lifts and drops with a pseudo-lever, is all they need.

 

[Dave6170]

I think they should of had a splitter gearbox

 

[Jim B]

The 4700 I jumped in was a splitter, seemed very plasticy and flimsy in the cab.

 

[Celtic Driver]

Terrible , we had a factory here in Coventry Banner Lane and they turn it into a housing estate and bring tractors in from China , the world has gone mad .

 

[Cowabunga]

Terrible , we had a factory here in Coventry Banner Lane and they turn it into a housing estate and bring tractors in from China , the world has gone mad .

Coventry factory was only running at around ⅓ capacity by the end, producing antiquated tractors with inadequate gearboxes [couldn't start off with a load in high range for instance] at a very high cost. The factory was doomed from the day in the early 1980's that the decision was made to build the next generation clean-sheet design in Beauvais. Richard Markham, recently retired Beauvais factory boss, had a big say in that decision as I understand it. It was probably based on the appalling labour relations of the 1970's as well as the Pound fluctuating against the Euro because the UK insisted on staying out of it.
As it happens you cannot fault their decision long term. For the greater part of the last 40 years the Pound has been overvalued against the Euro and now, ultimately, the UK has decided to divorce from the EU. AGCO must be thanking the lord that they no longer have any assets or commitments to UK manufacturing and very little management structure left here either.

Sounds harsh? Sorry, but that is the way it is whether you like it or not. Decisions at Government level and labour politics, even though these were historical, have consequences for the here and now. No manufacturing company would be daft enough to invest in new production facilities in the UK currently. Especially for a model built mainly to compete in developing countries and against savage competition in a saturated mature market.

 

[Celtic Driver]

I see your point , but what about the skilled jobs lost 1000 or more people out of work , we say back British farming , why cant british farmers have backed Banner Lane , it works two ways and althought i dont farm anymore due to a serious spinal injury, my sister and her husband still run a dairy herd and i am still interested in the farming industry , i have made a lot of non farming friends since i was in the spinal unit in Cardiff and they say farmers must be making a fortune with their flash 4x4s and tractors , just something for farmers to think about , how they are looked upon by the public .

 

[Cowabunga]

Its not down to British farmers. Its down to antiquated tractor chassis that were past their sell-by date along with a massively under-utilised factory that used to export something like 90% of its production overseas. In fact British buyers did keep buying Coventry tractors remarkably loyally until the very end.

What farmers look like to the public shouldn't bother them much. If it comes to it, farmers should be more assertive rather than defensive about running, in some cases, quite big businesses. If local small coastal town shop owners can run RR Sport plus Evoques, it is absolutely ridiculous that people like you denigrate farmers who run far bigger, riskier and more complex businesses with lower returns because a small number can run equally nice cars.
By the way, the only local farmer I know that runs the current model RRS is married to a doctor that brings home double the cash that the rather large farm does.

 

[Celtic Driver]

I am not attacking farmers at all , just saying what feedback i have had from non farming people , i think farmers need to to out there and talk to the public themselves and not rely on the farming unions .

 

[Cowabunga]

I am not attacking farmers at all , just saying what feedback i have had from non farming people , i think farmers need to to out there and talk to the public themselves and not rely on the farming unions .

Why? Why the defensive strategy of needing to explain yourself? The shopkeeper that I mentioned doesn't need to explain himself, and neither does the doctor or my mate the financial adviser who owns a Range Rover Sport. Why should I [or you] need to talk to anyone to justify anything we do any more than they do?

I reckon its born from farmer's own inferiority complex and insecurity. I'm certainly not about to justify anything I legally do to any f**ker.

 

[FarmyStu]

I'm certainly not about to justify anything I legally do to any fudgeer.

Nor should you have to. If I run a successful business it's got bugger all to do with anyone else how I spend my profits.

The problem is that the public is very used to seeing farmers on TV claiming poverty and destitution. Has that David Handley (FFA) given up dairy farming yet as he kept threatening due to losing so much money? Or is he still shoveling cash in to his business just so he can milk in a morning?

Farmers present one image when asked, but quite another when seen at a farm sale in a flash 4wd spending money willy nilly. If it wasn't for that subsidy cheque, it really would have nothing to do with the public.......

 

[Cowabunga]

Nor should you have to. If I run a successful business it's got bugger all to do with anyone else how I spend my profits.

The problem is that the public is very used to seeing farmers on TV claiming poverty and destitution. Has that David Handley (FFA) given up dairy farming yet as he kept threatening due to losing so much money? Or is he still shoveling cash in to his business just so he can milk in a morning?

Farmers present one image when asked, but quite another when seen at a farm sale in a flash 4wd spending money willy nilly. If it wasn't for that subsidy cheque, it really would have nothing to do with the public.......

I just wonder what sort of farm sales you attend? Most of the ones I go to have the car parks mainly populated by Vauxhall Astra and pickup trucks covered in shite. You must come from the Home Counties.
What kind of farming do you do again and at what scale? Are YOU making a fortune out of it?

These are rhetorical questions from me that you should be asking yourself before anyone else.

Perhaps we should enquire about exactly what everyone who takes money from the taxpayer does for their money. What exactly is it that you do and do you receive money from the State taxpayers in any way? If you do, go ahead and try and justify it to us farmers.

 

[FarmyStu]

I just wonder what sort of farm sales you attend? Most of the ones I go to have the car parks mainly populated by Vauxhall Astra and pickup trucks covered in shite. You must come from the Home Counties.
What kind of farming do you do again and at what scale? Are YOU making a fortune out of it?

These are rhetorical questions from me that you should be asking yourself before anyone else.

Perhaps we should enquire about exactly what everyone who takes money from the taxpayer does for their money. What exactly is it that you do and do you receive money from the State taxpayers in any way? If you do, go ahead and try and justify it to us farmers.

Farm sales, shows, demos. There is not a shortage of new, non base spec 4wd vehicles. Just an observation. I'd have one too if I could afford it. I'm genuinely not bitter or jealous. I'm happy with my lot.

I get state money in 2 ways. Firstly, I receive a military pension. It was part of my contract. It's very good but I feel I earned it. Secondly, as a contractor, I have no doubt that some of the money I earn comes from my customers SFP cheques. But I earn the money I'm paid. The SFP is not earned. It's just given provided you comply with a few silly and simplistic rules.

 

[Tarw Coch]

Blinkin eck, farmers have 4x4's would you believe it! What exactly should we pull a 3.5 ton stock trailer with? And if a 4x4 ain't a suitable vehicle for a farmer to go round his fields in sometimes in less than ideal travelling conditions I don't know what they should be using.
Whilst they might not all be base spec they're likely to be at the cheaper end of the 4x4 market, land rovers and double cab pick ups are hardly the height of luxury although most are relatively posh by my standards but hardly in the league of the X5, RR or ML which aren't that common amongst farmers, although a mate of mine does have an X5, well I say he has an X5, it's actually what his wife uses to run around in and takes her to her part time job, that's the part time job that pays better than his full time job farming.

 

[Jim B]

Coventry factory was only running at around ⅓ capacity by the end, producing antiquated tractors with inadequate gearboxes [couldn't start off with a load in high range for instance] at a very high cost. The factory was doomed from the day in the early 1980's that the decision was made to build the next generation clean-sheet design in Beauvais. Richard Markham, recently retired Beauvais factory boss, had a big say in that decision as I understand it. It was probably based on the appalling labour relations of the 1970's as well as the Pound fluctuating against the Euro because the UK insisted on staying out of it.
As it happens you cannot fault their decision long term. For the greater part of the last 40 years the Pound has been overvalued against the Euro and now, ultimately, the UK has decided to divorce from the EU. AGCO must be thanking the lord that they no longer have any assets or commitments to UK manufacturing and very little management structure left here either.

Sounds harsh? Sorry, but that is the way it is whether you like it or not. Decisions at Government level and labour politics, even though these were historical, have consequences for the here and now. No manufacturing company would be daft enough to invest in new production facilities in the UK currently. Especially for a model built mainly to compete in developing countries and against savage competition in a saturated mature market.

JCB managed.

 

[Cowabunga]

Farm sales, shows, demos. There is not a shortage of new, non base spec 4wd vehicles. Just an observation. I'd have one too if I could afford it. I'm genuinely not bitter or jealous. I'm happy with my lot.

I get state money in 2 ways. Firstly, I receive a military pension. It was part of my contract. It's very good but I feel I earned it. Secondly, as a contractor, I have no doubt that some of the money I earn comes from my customers SFP cheques. But I earn the money I'm paid. The SFP is not earned. It's just given provided you comply with a few silly and simplistic rules.

You certainly sound like you are, rather consistently.

 

[Wellytrack]

JCB managed.

Not in the same kin as Agco and their various owners and their respective interests over the decades.

 

[Cowabunga]

JCB managed.

Yes, they manage to sell a few hundred specialist tractors worldwide annually, surely as a labour of love. Do you think that would have kept the vast Coventry MF plant going? A factory built for another era with tractor chassis also designed back in the 1950's and updated. There was only so much updating they could do and the replacement was to be built elsewhere for the reasons I explained above. They did a marvellous job of keeping the old chassis going as long as they did. It still forms the basis of many tractors built locally in developing countries even today. It always was a 'world tractor' and built in many locations, not just Banner Lane.

If UK labour relations had been better and a commitment made to more stable and favourable exchange rates, then I'm sure that Banner Lane would have been the preferred site for the 3000 series, but the above reasons and successive Governments that put next to no value on engineering and production put paid to it all.