Michael Gove's Lost Arm

[puppet]

So, Michael, do you feel that removing the guard on your saw bench to get the log pile cleared was wrong?
"Look, I was following the best scientific advice and it was absolutely appropriate to remove the guard at that time as the logs were piling up"
But it looks as if a lot of arms have been lost as a result?
"It is not right to compare the number of arms lost compared to say, Sweden who had a different policy of managing logs, as we don't know if they were right or left arms. The important thing is that everyone has been working very hard to count the number of arms and the government has made a huge investment by increasing capacity for new guards.
But the old guards are already there lying on the floor along with the arms?
"Well, obviously there are a lot of guards available and that is why we are recruiting an army of guard-replacers who will be in place in 4 weeks time."
But that could lead to more loss of arms in the interim?
"The scientific advice states that further loss of arms is very unlikely."
Is that because it is very difficult to work a saw with one arm?
"No, we have implemented measures to reduce the risk."
Can you outline some of these measures?
"When we were elected in December we promised to increase the fitting of guards and that is our absolute priority in these unprecedented times. Now is not the time to question whether that has led to an in increased loss of arms and there will be plenty opportunity to examine the evidence at a later date."
So, will it be safe to use a saw with a guard in the future?
"It will be absolutely safe to use a saw. There is risk in any activity but you are at higher risk of a paper cut reading your Amputation Weekly."
So how is your own arm?
"We are working night and day to find a solution but I am confident that by the end of the year it will have grown back."

 

[DrWazzock]

Story of this crisis.
Big announcements without any planning or thought for the detail.
Mrs to go back to work soon as teacher. No masks available. Nobody managing supply, no info, nothing. Well maybe we can make our own. All elastic sold out in town. Don’t know when it’s back in stock.
A big modern country like Britain and we can’t even get hold of elastic.
Friends sending masks from Germany. Plenty there.
Says it all.
Sorry, rant over, but it really does annoy me that folk are asked to put themselves at increased risk without any thought at all for the simple and cheap measures that could save lives, money, grief and heartache.

 

[DrWazzock]

And that man, Michael Gove, who finished OSR and forage brassica growing in this country without a thought for the knock on effects, well he really does boil my pee. A self appointed expert in matters he knows nothing about.

 

[arcobob]

So, Michael, do you feel that removing the guard on your saw bench to get the log pile cleared was wrong?
"Look, I was following the best scientific advice and it was absolutely appropriate to remove the guard at that time as the logs were piling up"
But it looks as if a lot of arms have been lost as a result?
"It is not right to compare the number of arms lost compared to say, Sweden who had a different policy of managing logs, as we don't know if they were right or left arms. The important thing is that everyone has been working very hard to count the number of arms and the government has made a huge investment by increasing capacity for new guards.
But the old guards are already there lying on the floor along with the arms?
"Well, obviously there are a lot of guards available and that is why we are recruiting an army of guard-replacers who will be in place in 4 weeks time."
But that could lead to more loss of arms in the interim?
"The scientific advice states that further loss of arms is very unlikely."
Is that because it is very difficult to work a saw with one arm?
"No, we have implemented measures to reduce the risk."
Can you outline some of these measures?
"When we were elected in December we promised to increase the fitting of guards and that is our absolute priority in these unprecedented times. Now is not the time to question whether that has led to an in increased loss of arms and there will be plenty opportunity to examine the evidence at a later date."
So, will it be safe to use a saw with a guard in the future?
"It will be absolutely safe to use a saw. There is risk in any activity but you are at higher risk of a paper cut reading your Amputation Weekly."
So how is your own arm?
"We are working night and day to find a solution but I am confident that by the end of the year it will have grown back."

Brilliant analogy.

 

[DrWazzock]

We are always told that health and safety is about taking all reasonable and practical measures to minimise risk to an acceptable level. Well why doesn’t the government listen to their own advice.
If I asked a worker to walk across an asbestos roof without netting beneath I’d go to gaol. Yet the government makes similar requests before ensuring adequate mitigation measures are in place.
For once why can’t they make sure the necessary measures are in place before asking people to put themselves at risk, out of respect, consideration and good manners if nothing else.

 

[Happy]

I think they are realising they have over done the fear factor, scared everyone shitless and now don’t quite know how to get the country back up and running.

Mrs has one old age ward in hospital where over the course of the past 3 weeks every single one of 25 patients has tested positive for the virus. Of those 25, three have sadly died. The rest have all recovered.
I think they were expecting pretty much all of them to succumb to it.

I genuinely think govt has realised they over estimated the effects of the virus on most people and are looking for a way out of bankrupting the country as soon as possible.

As an interesting aside 53% of people in care homes are in their last year of life. Never hear that said as it sounds heartless but would give some perspective of overall death totals.

 

[DrWazzock]

My view is that unless suitable planning and cheap and basic precautions are put in place before asking schools and other public facing businesses to reopen then there will undoubtedly be a substantial second peak.

 

[DrWazzock]

The worst of it is the first thing my wife knows about her return to work is an announcement on telly by a government minister saying schools will reopen on 1st of June. No consultation, no planning, no preparation in advance of making a big promise to the public. Nothing at our level.
It’s an appalling way to manage a workforce and then they wonder why they get people’s backs up.

 

[Hindsight]

I think they are realising they have over done the fear factor, scared everyone shitless and now don’t quite know how to get the country back up and running.

Mrs has one old age ward in hospital where over the course of the past 3 weeks every single one of 25 patients has tested positive for the virus. Of those 25, three have sadly died. The rest have all recovered.
I think they were expecting pretty much all of them to succumb to it.

I genuinely think govt has realised they over estimated the effects of the virus on most people and are looking for a way out of bankrupting the country as soon as possible.

As an interesting aside 53% of people in care homes are in their last year of life. Never hear that said as it sounds heartless but would give some perspective of overall death totals.

I would like to see the private polling I assume is undertaken by the Tory Party on electorate / public attitude to reopening the economy. I suspect it is negative, which would mirror some of the sentiment on here. Stay locked down. But the Treasury know that this is financially almost as disastrous. The quarantine rule will destroy aviation. And for what. Well I assume to appease and quell the part of the population that is scared and fearful. But how is this going to be paid for. Boris and his mates do not want to be seen as unpopular and forcing folk out to work but that is where they are. Hey ho.

 

[Happy]

I would like to see the private polling I assume is undertaken by the Tory Party on electorate / public attitude to reopening the economy. I suspect it is negative, which would mirror some of the sentiment on here. Stay locked down. But the Treasury know that this is financially almost as disastrous. The quarantine rule will destroy aviation. And for what. Well I assume to appease and quell the part of the population that is scared and fearful. But how is this going to be paid for. Boris and his mates do not want to be seen as unpopular and forcing folk out to work but that is where they are. Hey ho.

They drip, dripped us into lockdown and desperately trying to drip, drip, us out.
Proving a lot harder the other way round.

 

[Hindsight]

They drip, dripped us into lockdown and desperately trying to drip, drip, us out.
Proving a lot harder the other way round.

Yep, folk are fearful. Going to be interesting to see what the teachers do. I shall follow Dr W posts with interest. The difficulty for us all is age profile and those at home and in our circle of contacts - any that are 'vulnerable.' And that is many for most of us. I have been surprised by how many of our social circuit, close friends and folk in general in the village, who are taking some form of treatment that weakens potentially the immune system or something else. My wife for example who I consider healthy is waiting for a hospital appointment to stop and restart her heart due to a dicky timing in it. So many people will be in this 'fear' stage. Going to be a right muddle. What a shambles. All I can do is to retaliate at the Chinese state by wherever possible if I know to not buy Chinese goods. But then that hurts the ordinary Chinese worker for whom I have no argument. Hey ho.

 

[DrWazzock]

I do appreciate schools will have to return and some risk will have to be taken.
I just don't like the way the government goes about. It makes an announcement to the public before we have even heard of a timetable for a managed return and we have had no communication whatsoever at grass roots level as to timings and precautionary measures.
Its confrontational politics in my view, and who do they get to front it up : the man who did more to entangle teachers in unnecessary bureaucracy than any education minister who went before him.
They used to say in the drawing office, "yes you can have it tomorrow, or you can it all correct at the end of the week."

So they say we will have 15 in a class. Well where do the other 15 go and who teaches them? How do you maintain social distancing on school buses? Is the driver protected? How old is he? Is he in a vulnerable category? The kids have to bring packed lunches and eat in class. So how does that help those who get free school meals who they are so desperate to help?

Its a shambles, believe me it really is. Almost impossible to mitigate the risks in such a high density environment.

 

[Hindsight]

I do appreciate schools will have to return and some risk will have to be taken.
I just don't like the way the government goes about. It makes an announcement to the public before we have even heard of a timetable for a managed return and we have had no communication whatsoever at grass roots level as to timings and precautionary measures.
Its confrontational politics in my view, and who do they get to front it up : the man who did more to entangle teachers in unnecessary bureaucracy than any education minister who went before him.
They used to say in the drawing office, "yes you can have it tomorrow, or you can it all correct at the end of the week."

So they say we will have 15 in a class. Well where do the other 15 go and who teaches them? How do you maintain social distancing on school buses? Is the driver protected? How old is he? Is he in a vulnerable category? The kids have to bring packed lunches and eat in class. So how does that help those who get free school meals who they are so desperate to help?

Its a shambles, believe me it really is. Almost impossible to mitigate the risks in such a high density environment.

Everything you say is correct. I used to be a Primary School Govenor when the stupid Blair introduced the maximum class size of 30 for years 1&2. That could be managed in a large town school with several classes. But posed tremendous difficulties for village schools with less classrooms especially when the years 3 and above maximum class ize was 36 and thus how did a village school reconcile the numbers and the need for maximum pupils to ensure the financial budget. Wrote to Blair - no sensible response.

I also wrote to Gove when Education Minister disagreeing with his return to exams, exams, exams rather than valuing course work. A sop to the Tory right and blue rinse brigade. Not at all reflective of the modern work place which is about team work and supporting each other. But Gove being a 'Grammar School' boy would be good at exams and not appreciate the deflation suffered by those perfectly reasonable folk who find that pressure situation difficult.

 

[Hindsight]

I do appreciate schools will have to return and some risk will have to be taken.
I just don't like the way the government goes about. It makes an announcement to the public before we have even heard of a timetable for a managed return and we have had no communication whatsoever at grass roots level as to timings and precautionary measures.
Its confrontational politics in my view, and who do they get to front it up : the man who did more to entangle teachers in unnecessary bureaucracy than any education minister who went before him.
They used to say in the drawing office, "yes you can have it tomorrow, or you can it all correct at the end of the week."

So they say we will have 15 in a class. Well where do the other 15 go and who teaches them? How do you maintain social distancing on school buses? Is the driver protected? How old is he? Is he in a vulnerable category? The kids have to bring packed lunches and eat in class. So how does that help those who get free school meals who they are so desperate to help?

Its a shambles, believe me it really is. Almost impossible to mitigate the risks in such a high density environment.

To turn to your various Covid point Well yes, the new normal. Lets take bus driver, say 56 years of age, bit overweight, bit asthmatic, on blood pressure pills that slightly suppress immune system. Could be me!! Who is responsible for him and his future. Is the employer required to protect him - well yes, with what, presumably bus disinfected every night ready for next day? Masks, goggles while in bus, gloves, hand washing sanitising facility in the bus. A screen around the driver station - what about taking money ? contact less only. Cash?

Social distance on the bus - well yes, if bus was picking up 40 children - now maybe only can take 12. So we need four times more buses - where from? Who pays?? Lincs County Council?? If so - where does that come from ? Central government - local rates? Agree free school meals essential for many families and children of those families - where now. And what about those businesses that set to operate the scheme - I presume the meal will become a packed lunch type meal.

So the new normal is upon us.

 

[Nearly]

Agree completely.
Ours are a bit big for school but I can't imagine under what circumstances a family would send kids back to school before September - if there was any alternative.
In extended families where there is a grandparent or two around then why would you risk bringing it back home from school?

perhaps there will only be half the kids in the classes anyway?

I know we've all got to be exposed to it at some point but let some other bugger send their kids back first.

 

[arcobob]

Several points have been made. 1. Free school meals. Who has been feeding the kids while they have been away?. 2. Only year 6 are going back therefore no staffing problem. 3. The school should not be allowed to open until proper provision for protection is in place for all.
Some children live with elderly grandparents or vulnerable parents. I would not worry too much about the kids but releasing a large number of asymptomatic carriers into the wider community has got to be managed and minimised.

 

[Hindsight]

Agree completely.
Ours are a bit big for school but I can't imagine under what circumstances a family would send kids back to school before September - if there was any alternative.
In extended families where there is a grandparent or two around then why would you risk bringing it back home from school?

perhaps there will only be half the kids in the classes anyway?

I know we've all got to be exposed to it at some point but let some other bugger send their kids back first.

Hi, good points. But can I ponder that you and your family are in fortunate position of a family farm with an income. Many folk will need to get back to work. Not everyone is furloughed. And not everyone will be in a furlough position.

So yes, let some other bugger send their kids back first. Then lift ones head up and say a little prayer that one is in that fortunate position.

Regards

 

[arcobob]

For various reasons parents take children to school in their own transport. Family`s with more than one child of school age then have to return home in time to commence home teaching the remainder. Will provision be made for this?
My daughter has three children all at the same school. She has to take the one in year six to school, then return to teach the other two who are in year 3. She is self employed and cannot go back to work, nor is she furloughed though she lives on a farm and is not deprived in the sense that many people are. She is keen for normal education to commence but there are problems for almost every family.

 

[Hindsight]

For various reasons parents take children to school in their own transport. Family`s with more than one child of school age then have to return home in time to commence home teaching the remainder. Will provision be made for this?
My daughter has three children all at the same school. She has to take the one in year six to school, then return to teach the other two who are in year 3. She is self employed and cannot go back to work, nor is she furloughed though she lives on a farm and is not deprived in the sense that many people are. She is keen for normal education to commence but there are problems for almost every family.

And your post typifies why the country is and will grind to a halt of sorts. The new industry as far as I can see is social distance monitors! As we hear this morning the Rail Companies have hired crowd management staff to organise the queues. So an new cost against a backdrop of reduced revenue from passengers as train load limit reduced to meet social distancing. Goodness knows where this will end up. Hey ho.

 

[arcobob]

And your post typifies why the country is and will grind to a halt of sorts. The new industry as far as I can see is social distance monitors! As we hear this morning the Rail Companies have hired crowd management staff to organise the queues. So an new cost against a backdrop of reduced revenue from passengers as train load limit reduced to meet social distancing. Goodness knows where this will end up. Hey ho.

I am sure you did not mean it that way but it sounds as though it is all my fault! I think there are many who will dream up any excuse not to go back to work as long as the government keeps handing out money. Such is human nature, but the government cannot advise codes of conduct, employ the police to crack down and then expect people to return to work in conditions which are not compliant with their own rules.