Mig welder power supply

Should be 115-165 on 3.2, 150-220 on 4.0 (assuming you are using standard 7018) 7018 is the only one that will give you any hope of getting penetration without cleaning but will still make it weaker, especially if you aren't even burning the rods extra hot to get through the crap, which you definitely aren't if you are running 4.0 at 140. I usually run 130 on 3.2 as my default setting then tweak from there.
I remembered afterwards... I was told by the guy at Harrington that the welder always works at higher amperage than what it's set at
Also if welding conditions are not ideal like rust or paint there's extra load on engine so different rod angle is needed I have used 6013 for everything for years with no problems
 
Most farmers have never heard of 7018 rods.( I have never had any because I haven't got any where to store them) Local farm supplies shops will have a couple of boxes of 6013 and ,unless it's for very thick section, your amperages look very high. Photo is 8mm angle on the side of a solid trailer axle,one pass with 4 mm on a parweld inverter at 135 amps on a fifty metre extension lead. It ain't coming off soon.View attachment 1004774
That's good
 

dave mountain

Member
Livestock Farmer
If you note I posted that it needs a competent electrician , without a close knowledge of the machine I cannot say if it could run off a 3 phase supply, but trust me many older machines can and did, as they are not specific about voltage. A lot of later machines only actually need the neutral to run the motor drive for the wire. Obviously if it is one of these it must have the neutral
What a load of tosh. You can't run anything single phase off 4 pin 3 phase. That would be the same as wiring a household appliance to earth instead of neutral. Would trip the rcd instantly. You may well have seen welders running off 4 pin 3 phase. Have you ever heard of 3 phase welders?
 

dave mountain

Member
Livestock Farmer
Most farmers have never heard of 7018 rods.( I have never had any because I haven't got any where to store them) Local farm supplies shops will have a couple of boxes of 6013 and ,unless it's for very thick section, your amperages look very high. Photo is 8mm angle on the side of a solid trailer axle,one pass with 4 mm on a parweld inverter at 135 amps on a fifty metre extension lead. It ain't coming off soon.View attachment 1004774
I always keep a dozen of the individually wrapped 7018s. They aren't cheap but it's a godsend to have perfect condition ones whenever you need them, without having to drive to town. I don't like doing anything with e6013 it's for hobbyists really, but if it works it works.
 

colhonk

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Darlington
Only ever used my stick welder once in the last 27 years. Mig for everything (y) (y) been very lucky that I have been able to get things into workshop to weld.
 

Exfarmer

Member
Location
Bury St Edmunds
What a load of tosh. You can't run anything single phase off 4 pin 3 phase. That would be the same as wiring a household appliance to earth instead of neutral. Would trip the rcd instantly. You may well have seen welders running off 4 pin 3 phase. Have you ever heard of 3 phase welders?
Dave all the old Oxford oil cooled were happy to run off single or three phase or single. And just used the same wiring , in fact they could run off 110 supply but had to be 3 phase then.
Since then some migs have been able to do the same trick but it is critical to ensure the welder is made for this and only a competent person must do the wiring
 

dave mountain

Member
Livestock Farmer
Dave all the old Oxford oil cooled were happy to run off single or three phase or single. And just used the same wiring , in fact they could run off 110 supply but had to be 3 phase then.
Since then some migs have been able to do the same trick but it is critical to ensure the welder is made for this and only a competent person must do the wiring
i know i have one. you cannot run it on single phase from a 4pin 3 phase socket.

disposing of the transformer oil is a bit precarious
 

Exfarmer

Member
Location
Bury St Edmunds
i know i have one. you cannot run it on single phase from a 4pin 3 phase socket.

disposing of the transformer oil is a bit precarious
You can just put a new 3 pin socket on it and it will run fine.
The oil is carcinogenic so do not touch and do get it disposed of properly it contains some really horrendous chemicals
Saying that do change the oil regularly as condensation builds up in them and kills them. Been there got the Tee shirt!
Also had the pleasure of going round the old Oxford factory in Rothwell. They were made in a house which was old when Henry the eighth was on the throne!
 

dave mountain

Member
Livestock Farmer
You can just put a new 3 pin socket on it and it will run fine.
The oil is carcinogenic so do not touch and do get it disposed of properly it contains some really horrendous chemicals
Saying that do change the oil regularly as condensation builds up in them and kills them. Been there got the Tee shirt!
Also had the pleasure of going round the old Oxford factory in Rothwell. They were made in a house which was old when Henry the eighth was on the throne!
you dont know what you are talking about. please explain how you would wire that up. imagine ive already got my 3 pin single phase plug on the welder (which i do actually), where does each pin need to go on the 4 pin supply? ill start you off. the earth goes to earth, the live goes to any of the 3 phases, but where does the neutral go?

i know all of that, hence why i said that about the oil. please stop assuming you know more than everyone else.
 

Netherfield

Member
Location
West Yorkshire
you dont know what you are talking about. please explain how you would wire that up. imagine ive already got my 3 pin single phase plug on the welder (which i do actually), where does each pin need to go on the 4 pin supply? ill start you off. the earth goes to earth, the live goes to any of the 3 phases, but where does the neutral go?

i know all of that, hence why i said that about the oil. please stop assuming you know more than everyone else.
It doesn't go anywhere because you're lacking a neutral on that setup, you'd actually need a 5 pin plug and socket.
 

Mur Huwcun

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
North West Wales
I think you can wire arc welders off two phases and earth therefore would work on a 4 pin plug, we had ones on 4 pins years ago. Most Mig welders won’t though as they need a neutral because the wire feed motor and gas solenoids etc run off single phase.

Someone on here will know but is that not what the 480v pin on the welder connections are for, for the second phase?
 

dave mountain

Member
Livestock Farmer
I think you can wire arc welders off two phases and earth therefore would work on a 4 pin plug, we had ones on 4 pins years ago. Most Mig welders won’t though as they need a neutral because the wire feed motor and gas solenoids etc run off single phase.

Someone on here will know but is that not what the 480v pin on the welder connections are for, for the second phase?
You can't on a system with an rcd as the residual currente from the 2 phases will trip the rcd. There is not residual current from a balanced load across 3 phases. Hence why you don't need a neutral but do for single or 2 phase.
 

Exfarmer

Member
Location
Bury St Edmunds
you dont know what you are talking about. please explain how you would wire that up. imagine ive already got my 3 pin single phase plug on the welder (which i do actually), where does each pin need to go on the 4 pin supply? ill start you off. the earth goes to earth, the live goes to any of the 3 phases, but where does the neutral go?

i know all of that, hence why i said that about the oil. please stop assuming you know more than everyone else.
Google “Oxford oil filled wiring “ top result on youtube is changing wiring from 3 phase to single.
It is a 2 minute job any fool can do, but in your case I would not recommend it!
You do not at any time use a 4 pin plug designed for three phase
If you have 3 phase why would you want to use single

That is why I said, find a competent electrician!
 

dave mountain

Member
Livestock Farmer
Google “Oxford oil filled wiring “ top result on youtube is changing wiring from 3 phase to single.
It is a 2 minute job any fool can do, but in your case I would not recommend it!
You do not at any time use a 4 pin plug designed for three phase
If you have 3 phase why would you want to use single

That is why I said, find a competent electrician!
Of course you can run them off single phase, like I do. You have spent the last however many posts telling me you can run a single phase machine off 4 pin 3 phase which is utter nonsense. If you are right then what do I wire the neutral to? Utter moron, won't admit your wrong no matter how obvious.
Typical cyclist
 

Exfarmer

Member
Location
Bury St Edmunds
Of course you can run them off single phase, like I do. You have spent the last however many posts telling me you can run a single phase machine off 4 pin 3 phase which is utter nonsense. If you are right then what do I wire the neutral to? Utter moron, won't admit your wrong no matter how obvious.
Typical cyclist
Perhaps you should read my posts through. I said no such thing, I did suggest that some single phase machines will run on 3 phase with no neutral..
That video shows some machines are equally happy with a single phase set up or 3 phase.
However this applies to only a few Mig machines
 

David.

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
J11 M40
If I remember correctly, the earth wire on an Oxford went to the central spike that held the cover on. The Neutral to the 0 pole, and the live to the 230 pole.
Something tells me there were also 380 and 415 poles, and for split phase you connected your Earth to the centre spike, and the 2 phase wires to 230 & 380?
Tbh it's 20yrs ago. Have now got 3ph inverter mig that runs off a 4 pin 16a plug happily enough..
 

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