Moore vs. 750A - pros and cons ??

[Hartwig]

Running a Moore Unidrill for several years in DDing and have never used a JD 750A myself as comparison I would really like to get other peoples opinions who have experiences with both machines eventually !!

I like the Moore because of its simplicity - one disc and one seedboot, adjustable with a spanner in minutes, central depth adjusting, etc. The downside is certainly not so accurate depthcontrol and a fair bit of soil disturbance.

And what me really frustrates in some conditions is that it is sometimes blocking off with straw and wet earth, the more residue and the deeper drilling (beans in stripped straw.....) the worse it can become.

Are there any issues like that with the 750A or is it just going through everything, cutting the furrow and placing the seed at constant depth ??

 

[Hartwig]

 

[Clive]

I can't compare the Moore as I've not used one

I can tell you that I think a 750a is almost unblockable though and certainly would have no problems with the straw in your picture

 

[Jim Bullock]

Hartwig
We used both a 750A and a Moore back in 1997/8 and when conditions were right for direct-drilling both worked well.
The problems we had with the Moore was that the Sulky seed box fitted at that time was very nearly impossible to calibrate, and that straw used to get stuck between the disc and the seed coulter which stopped the disc turning and as a consequence blocked the drill...stones could do the same when working in a min-till situation again blocking the drill and before you knew it you were pulling along several tons of soil...but it never broke down and we grew some really good wheat and rape crops using it...why didn't we buy one..? 1) beacause one of our farm contracts did not like the drill and we couldn't afford to run two drilling systems.. 2) At that time the Moore distribution system in the UK was a bit of an unknown so we were a bit concerned about parts and back-up..
The JD 750 worked well but we had "slotting and hairpinning problems" which encouraged slugs and reduced emergence (probably now overcome with the Guttler closers)..when it was really wet it took half a day with a pressure washer to clean the soil out from between the disc and the rubber depth wheels (OK.. we should not have been drilling in such wet conditions), I did not like having to climb under the drill to adjust the position of the seed-boot when adjusting the drilling depth again it took several hours to set up the drill from cereals to beans...this was a 1998 drill and the openers are much easier to adjust now...But again why didn't we buy one? Because JD were really not very keen to sell us a drill - we wanted a 4 meter drill and at the time they were not sure if it was going to be available and as to cost it was anybodies guess...
So when our local Kuhn dealer came along with the SD 4000 which worked as well as the Moore and the JD and was able to offer us a good trade in for a Kuhn 4 metre combi drill, a Kuhn 5 furrow reversible plough and a set of 4 metre Kuhn discs...it was an offer we could not miss...! There are occasions when perhaps I wish we had kept the discs (best discs I have ever used) and perhaps the plough...and maybe even the combi-drill..
Our Kuhn is now 15 years old and in desperate need of replacement but what to go for is a real dilemma...nothing available at present seems to tick all our boxes...(I have seen some photos of the 8 meter Simtech-T-Sem which is getting pretty close to what we are looking for..its a bit more advanced than the present machines)...but unless harvest 2013 exceeds all present expectations it looks like another year with the Kuhn..

 

[Elmsted]

Hartwig.

You have I reckon the drill entirely wrongly set up as often explained. Get the draw bar hitched straight to tractor not your system as in previous pictures. get rid of depth control with ram on the move if you have. The angle of seed tube is in wrong holes. the spring set up as can be seen is not quite what one should have. I think your discs are too far worn. Replace with serrated. Set the basics up right on a Moore and what you show does not happen. Look at shine on discs look at seed tube clamps which indicate in conjunction the wear on seed tubes. You is almost trying to plough with that level of depth on discs.

Having said all that the model which you show in the picture would cost more than it's worth to put right. Just get a newer Moore or maybe a JD depending on Price. Never get a sulky. IMH and Sams opinion.

 

[Hartwig]

Stephen,

I`m a little confused with your advice:
- hydraulic depth control on the move is brilliant from my view, what is the downside from your experience ??
- what`s wrong with the springs ??
- discs are maybe 100 or 150ha old, got new ones last year plain ones like the advice of Sam was !
- seedboots are a little worn but have tungsten faces, so there is abolutely no problem or straw plugging between discs and seedboots - what do you think is wrong with the tubes ??

Yes, of course that is deep drilling the beans at 4 or 5 cm which is some kind of ploughing in the row......the problem with the straw and dirt does not happen in shallow seeding with cereals !

 

[stroller]

Hartwig
Don't worry about getting spring beans so deep, mine never go in deeper than 1-2"(25-50mm) if that http://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/how-are-your-crops-looking.783/page-4

 

[Elmsted]

Stephen,

I`m a little confused with your advice:
- hydraulic depth control on the move is brilliant from my view, what is the downside from your experience ??
- what`s wrong with the springs ??
- discs are maybe 100 or 150ha old, got new ones last year plain ones like the advice of Sam was !
- seedboots are a little worn but have tungsten faces, so there is abolutely no problem or straw plugging between discs and seedboots - what do you think is wrong with the tubes ??
Yes, of course that is deep drilling the beans at 4 or 5 cm which is some kind of ploughing in the row......the problem with the straw and dirt does not happen in shallow seeding with cereals !

Hartwig in a considered way of the forum. On the move depth........... Now what sensing system have you got to know the depth other than a " Feeling" it is F**** impossible to know from bum on seat what depth you are planting at without stopping getting off and looking in which case manual can be used. Set the thing up it will remain constant the way Old man Sam invented it. Get rid of your wheels for compaction between tractor wheels. and looking at picture you is trying to pull something with more bits of welded on metal down in to the centre of the earth whilst not remaining true to the concept of a Moore drill.

Just look at the springs surely that plus the front hangers ( which Sulky changed ) indicates your hitch and spring and on move depth are all fighting each other.
You should have bought serrated but guess who has plain.
A tungsten face changes nothing except wear rates. What is essential is distance from tip of seed coulter to disc circumference. About a finger or two. The next is the distance between the seed coulter to the disc. A cigarette paper at the closest point about right. Which ever way one looks at it a Moore is a disc and tine drill. The tine works in the shadow of an inclined disc. It is depth controlled by front on hitch and back by roller.
hence set it up on concrete using a bit of wood so that each seed boot is same distance from disc periphery. This of course covers two rows. Also on older ones check wear blocks on the rear vertical risers where the back of the beam for each pair of rows goes when under compression are not worn too much. they are reversible.

There are as you no doubt know many holes in the planter set up to allow fine tuning. Such that you can choose to minimise or maximise the the seed delivery system to seed tubes to give flexibility regarding things like rate per hectare in KG or seed dimensions.

Meanwhile I remain as Stroller with my view on rule of thumb on how deep to plant things.

just jottings.