National Food Strategy: open letter

[Clive]

there is massive opportunity to differentiate over the meat debate that UK producers should be using to their advantage

UK - pasture fed meat = good for environment and diet

imported feedlot / soya fed intensive meat / ultra processed = bad for environment and diet

listening to Chris Evans this morning on virgin with his vegan ranting even he seemed to acknowledge this and was actually supportive of UK farmers

 

[delilah]

there is massive opportunity to differentiate over the meat debate that UK producers should be using to their advantage

UK - pasture fed meat = good for environment and diet

imported feedlot / soya fed intensive meat = bad for environment and diet

We've cattle that never go out, I can make a compelling case for their environmental sustainability.
We've cattle that never come in, I can make an equally compelling case for their environmental sustainability.

Individual producers can make a case for their own system, but at a national level the only argument that works for all producers is that eating British beef is a vital component of a sustainable farming system for UK ag.

 

[Clive]

We've cattle that never go out, I can make a compelling case for their environmental sustainability.
We've cattle that never come in, I can make an equally compelling case for their environmental sustainability.

Individual producers can make a case for their own system, but at a national level the only argument that works for all producers is that eating British beef is a vital component of a sustainable farming system for UK ag.

the case you can make is less important than what customers want if you want a successful business

“i want to eat meat but i want my meat to be as local as possible, grass fed on land that can not grow veg, grain or legume, i want my meat to have had a high welfare life witn access to outdoors “

im prepared to pay for that


i dont want to eat USA feedlot beef fed on soya from slash and burn rain forests …….. high quality UK meat needs marketing differentiation to distance itself as far as possible from that image

its a massive opportunity

 

[An Gof]

the case you can make is less important than what customers want if you want a successful business

“i want to eat meat but i want my meat to be as local as possible, grass fed on land that can not grow veg, grain or legume, i want my meat to have had a high welfare life witn access to outdoors “

im prepared to pay for that


i dont want to eat USA feedlot beef fed on soya from slash and burn rain forests …….. high quality UK meat needs marketing differentiation to distance itself as far as possible from that image

its a massive opportunity

Does the US import any soya from “slash and burn” rainforests?
Think you might be over egging it a bit there.

 

[Clive]

Does the US import any soya from “slash and burn” rainforests?
Think you might be over egging it a bit there.

The South American soya goes somewhere, doesn't it? and I think I heard that 80 or maybe even 90% of global soya feeds aminals, not humans? That is massively inefficient vs livestock eating carbon sequetering grass which humans can't

who knows ........... who cares ? what you have here is an opportunity to differentiate UK meat from the rest of the world, no one else lets the truth get in the way of marketing !! (although I think our UK truth is a LOT better than most alternatives)



I want my lamb from a welsh hillside and my beef from British pasture or Scottish hills - both must surely be better than importing anything and welfare must be better ......................... its a VERY simple story to tell and people will pay for it


MOST marketing is a lie, a lie that has destroyed our food systems and got them to the state they are right now, bad for human health, financially unviable and environmentally damaging

 

[An Gof]

The South American soya goes somewhere, doesn't it? and I think I heard that 80 or maybe even 90% of global soya feeds aminals, not humans? That is massively inefficient vs livestock eating carbon sequetering grass which humans can't

who knows ........... who cares ? what you have here is an opportunity to differentiate UK meat from the rest of the world, no one else lets the truth get in the way of marketing !! (although I think our UK truth is a LOT better than most alternatives)



I want my lamb from a welsh hillside and my beef from British pasture or Scottish hills - both must surely be better than importing anything and welfare must be better ......................... its a VERY simple story to tell and people will pay for it


MOST marketing is a lie, a lie that has destroyed our food systems and got them to the state they are right now, bad for human health, financially unviable and environmentally damaging

You have to be careful with the facts and how you put your case @Clive

You may be correct that 80-90% of global soya goes for animal feed, I don’t know the figure. But your case about the inefficiencies of using soya for livestock feed against carbon sequestering grass doesn’t acknowledge the very significant proportion used for monogastric animal production.
I know that it appears that I am “nit-picking” but we have to present an accurate and fully considered argument to ensure we maintain the high ground.

 

[Swarfmonkey]

and I think I heard that 80 or maybe even 90% of global soya feeds aminals, not humans?

That's where the enviro-loons have been sneaky. Very sneaky. They like to give the impression that livestock are eating the overwhelming majority of whole soya, but in reality the vast majority of it is byproduct that's left after the oil has been extracted. The brutal truth is that demand for soybean oil has been growing at a massive rate since palm oil got a bad rep. It's the second most widely used veg oil (by volume) on the planet - for everything from cooking oils to biodiesel. Even if all livestock disappeared tomorrow, you wouldn't see much reduction in the amount of soya grown. In fact, it might lead to more being grown in order to make up for the lack of animal sourced fats.

 

[holwellcourtfarm]

The South American soya goes somewhere, doesn't it? and I think I heard that 80 or maybe even 90% of global soya feeds aminals, not humans? That is massively inefficient vs livestock eating carbon sequetering grass which humans can't

who knows ........... who cares ? what you have here is an opportunity to differentiate UK meat from the rest of the world, no one else lets the truth get in the way of marketing !! (although I think our UK truth is a LOT better than most alternatives)



I want my lamb from a welsh hillside and my beef from British pasture or Scottish hills - both must surely be better than importing anything and welfare must be better ......................... its a VERY simple story to tell and people will pay for it


MOST marketing is a lie, a lie that has destroyed our food systems and got them to the state they are right now, bad for human health, financially unviable and environmentally damaging

Very little goes to dairy and beef....

More goes to fish!

 

[Swarfmonkey]

The way the data is portrayed there is sneaky, designed to give a certain impression. Notice how it says "soybeans processed to soy cake for feed", when the far more truthful version would be "majority of byproduct left after oil extraction processed to soy cake for feed".

 

[thesilentone]

For a while investing in splodge development and growth is going to be higher risk, therefore better returns for the market makers.

Lot's of loot flying in their direction, so a bit of negative PR against beef is all good for their cause, and bank accounts.

 

[Sid]

grass fed on land that can not grow veg, grain or legume

Why?

What happened to the mixed farming.
You have stated yourself you would ideally like livestock back into your rotation , but you don't want to eat the meat that comes from that part of your very own farm.

i want my meat to be as local as possible

I want my lamb from a welsh hillside and my beef from British pasture or Scottish hills

Yet again you contradict yourself.

Your understanding of livestock is very lacking!
Plenty of land closer to home that would be suitable for livestock production.

 

[Sid]

The way the data is portrayed there is sneaky, designed to give a certain impression. Notice how it says "soybeans processed to soy cake for feed", when the far more truthful version would be "majority of byproduct left after oil extraction processed to soy cake for feed".

Ah yes data, here's a good graphic to counter the antis message on how much water livestock production uses.

Rainfall that the majority of which passes through the pasture and down stream no doubt

 

[Mixedupfarmer]

View attachment 976772

Very little goes to dairy and beef....

More goes to fish!

So why does beef continually get blamed for deforestation for soya production too feed cattle, and why does no representation group for agriculture defend it?

 

[delilah]

the case you can make is less important than what customers want if you want a successful business

“i want to eat meat but i want my meat to be as local as possible, grass fed on land that can not grow veg, grain or legume, i want my meat to have had a high welfare life witn access to outdoors “

im prepared to pay for that


i dont want to eat USA feedlot beef fed on soya from slash and burn rain forests …….. high quality UK meat needs marketing differentiation to distance itself as far as possible from that image

its a massive opportunity

Read what I said.
Yes, individual farmers can promote their beef however they wish. But at a national level the message has to be that all UK reared beef is sustainable, however many days of its life it spends in a shed. For two reasons, first it's the truth, second its the only message that doesn't drive a wedge between UK producers.

 

[delilah]

https://sustainablefoodtrust.org/articles/dairy-cows-livestock-behind-growth-soya-south-america/

 

[sidjon]

The South American soya goes somewhere, doesn't it? and I think I heard that 80 or maybe even 90% of global soya feeds aminals, not humans? That is massively inefficient vs livestock eating carbon sequetering grass which humans can't

who knows ........... who cares ? what you have here is an opportunity to differentiate UK meat from the rest of the world, no one else lets the truth get in the way of marketing !! (although I think our UK truth is a LOT better than most alternatives)



I want my lamb from a welsh hillside and my beef from British pasture or Scottish hills - both must surely be better than importing anything and welfare must be better ......................... its a VERY simple story to tell and people will pay for it


MOST marketing is a lie, a lie that has destroyed our food systems and got them to the state they are right now, bad for human health, financially unviable and environmentally damaging

Soy contains 20% oil, which it's been grown for, 80% is waste from the crusting industry which is turned into other less valuable products , bit like OSR , your not growing it for feed, your growing for the oil content. With the increasing of bio oil in fuel can only see soy been grown in larger areas, livestock do use a large amount of the waste ( most fed to Chinese pig and chicken), don't think it would be grown in such large quantities without the oil industry.

 

[holwellcourtfarm]

Soy contains 20% oil, which it's been grown for, 80% is waste from the crusting industry which is turned into other less valuable products , bit like OSR , your not growing it for feed, your growing for the oil content. With the increasing of bio oil in fuel can only see soy been grown in larger areas, livestock do use a large amount of the waste ( most fed to Chinese pig and chicken), don't think it would be grown in such large quantities without the oil industry.

As I understand it the value is about equally split now between the oil and the meal (so 20% of the bean achieved 50% of the gross value and the reaming 80% is worth about the same. If that's correct we can't really say it's grown for the oil but that's certainly the highest value part of the crop.

 

[kfpben]

All these folk that say x crop is grown for livestock means the land is wasted…

Well about half our cropped land is down to spring Barley (beer), OSR (industrial), and vines (wine), let alone the hay sold for horses. Is that land all wasted too or does the narrative only apply to meat?

 

[BrianV]

July 2021

Rt Hon George Eustice
Seacole Building
2 Marsham St
London SW1P 4DF

Dear Secretary of State,

Re: National Food Strategy: open letter

We are writing to you reflecting widely different experiences and communities within the farming sector, to endorse the recommendations of the National Food Strategy proposed by Henry Dimbleby.

There are some you would expect us to support. Dimbleby is forthright about the Government’s duty to protect British farming standards and suggests a practical mechanism to do so. He is clear about the need – in the public’s interest – to ring-fence the current budget for agriculture and the environment. He rightly says that Government should be explicit about the amount of land that is needed for woodland and nature restoration, and the best places for this. He says we can achieve the changes that are needed while protecting the rights and interests of all farmers, including tenants and commoners while supporting rural communities. We are glad to see him get behind your Department’s welcome plans to back practical innovation by farmers, as the driving force in regenerative, nature-friendly agriculture.

He also recommends measures that will, gradually but not insignificantly, rebalance our nation’s food culture and markets, reducing the demand for cheap, high-calorie junk food, and boosting it for fresh, high-quality produce with provenance. This can only help British farming and drive the sector’s ambition and capacity to play our full role in reversing biodiversity loss, mitigating and adapting to climate change while producing plentiful, healthy food.

Yet there are also recommendations that might make less comfortable reading for us, but which nevertheless deserve our firm backing. They are of course about eating less meat. This is such a sensitive issue, especially when UK livestock farmers are already committed to high welfare and reducing climate impacts. But as anyone who has looked seriously at the numbers knows – even those among us who champion reintroducing sheep and cattle into rotations – the reality is that people in developed countries do need to eat less meat overall, while ensuring that the meat we do eat comes from high welfare systems that support biodiversity, which the UK is well placed to achieve. The switch from industrially produced animal products, often destined for ultra-processed foods and relying on imported proteins that can drive deforestation and land use change, to regenerative systems where animals play their time-honoured role in building soil fertility and sustaining nature must happen swiftly.

The debate in farming should not be about whether this is so, but about how to make this transformation quickly and fairly, for both farmers and citizens, avoiding unintended consequences, and with the best results for the climate, nature and animal welfare, both in the UK and globally. We welcome the clarity and nuance that Dimbleby has brought to the debate and the lengths he has gone to find ways of achieving this. Specifically, his proposals that schools and hospitals should serve less but better meat, more and better fresh produce; and that the biggest businesses should show leadership by reporting what they sell, and how it is produced; are prudent first steps.

We urge you to give this report your deepest consideration, and to facilitate a positive government response rapidly. The wellbeing of future generations, and the ability of the NHS to care for society, depends on the leadership your government shows in this fundamentally important space.

Yours sincerely,

Julia Aglionby
Trustee, Susan’s Farm and Executive Director, Foundation for Common Land

Helen Browning
Farmer and Chief Executive of the Soil Association

Caroline Drummond
Chief Executive, LEAF

Jake Fiennes
Director of Conservation, Holkham Estate

Peter and Henrietta Greig
Pipers Farm

William Kendall
Farmer and entrepreneur

Alastair Leake
Director of Policy, The Game & Wildlife Trust

Martin Lines
Arable farmer and UK Chair of the Nature Friendly Farming Network

Sue Pritchard
Farmer and Chief Executive, The Food, Farming and Countryside Commission

John Shropshire
Chairman G’s Group

Craig Livingstone
Lockerley Estate

This bull crap from a so called Conservative minister, there is now no actual conservative party just various forms of the Liberal party, hope you all remember this when they next come begging for your vote!
This has surely got to be the worst agricultural minister this country has ever had & there has been a few dodgy ones in the past but never with a complete idiot sat in No 10

 

[sidjon]

As I understand it the value is about equally split now between the oil and the meal (so 20% of the bean achieved 50% of the gross value and the reaming 80% is worth about the same. If that's correct we can't really say it's grown for the oil but that's certainly the highest value part of the crop.

Think that's about correct, have a cousin who married a Argentine girl who have converted from beef to soybean and they are always looking for higher oil content varieties with lower protein, which is the more valuable part and they're not growing it for the feed value. Wonder if corn would have any value without livestock not using the crop with is out of spec