NC Cheviots
- Thread starter abitdaft
- Start date
- Location
- Ceredigion, wales
Only one way to find out....
Sheepfog
Member
- Location
- Southern England
All Blackies here been crossed out with NCC lairg type. Most ewes now 3/4 & 7/8 Cheviot. No change to lambing percentage. Lambs also worth more as stores as buyers seem to prefer them. Only problem is we used to breed Scotch mules for the upland flock. Not sure if Cheviot mules would be tough enough for our hill. May try an Aberfield.
That sounds about what we are aiming for. we normally put our 4 crop blackies to a BFL for mules on inbye ground. We have a neighbour with Cheviot mules on the hill at around 900 ft and he says he wouldn't go back to the Blackie. We are finding the Blackie lambs are just taking longer to finish than in the past. This breeding for big flashy heads and big flashy tup prices at Lanark, Dalmally etc hasn't done much for the breed.
west coast angus
Member
Skip blackie and go straight to Hill Cheviots, If subs go Blackies will go with them!!!
Then you've got the cost to change.
Aye, I suspect you are right. How does the hardy type ( lairg ) compare to the Blackie ewe for hardiness. Our winters are very variable, the hill can take a massive hit of snow compared to a couple of miles away. I don't know a massive amount about the Cheviot, what I do know is that the Blackie is about done as far as finished lambs are concerned in that what used to finish on fresh air has changed, however the ewe is one tough lassie.
CharcoalWally
Member
- Location
- West of Scotland
Once again the Blackie , despite being the most numerous sheep breed in the country , is about to disappear according to the NCC people......
Rumours of it's demise have been exaggerated before and no doubt will be again.
We've had this fight on here several times before @abitdaft . I had a small dabble with them many years ago and thought they were next door to useless. Low prolificacy , bad on maternal traits. All the NCC folk tell me I must have had bad ewes , and maybe they're right , but they cost me a reasonable trade and were off a hard hill on Skye , so I would have looked for a much better performance on my ground.
It's an easy question for me - which breed left money behind them? Answer , the Blackie.
Rumours of it's demise have been exaggerated before and no doubt will be again.
We've had this fight on here several times before @abitdaft . I had a small dabble with them many years ago and thought they were next door to useless. Low prolificacy , bad on maternal traits. All the NCC folk tell me I must have had bad ewes , and maybe they're right , but they cost me a reasonable trade and were off a hard hill on Skye , so I would have looked for a much better performance on my ground.
It's an easy question for me - which breed left money behind them? Answer , the Blackie.
You may well be right hence me asking for other's experiences before taking the plunge. Another reason to start with just the one heft, if it goes badly at least it's not 1800 ewes badly. Main reason for looking for a change is the length of time the Blackie lambs are taking to finish the past couple of years. We lost the wintering for the hoggs a couple of years ago ( someone was prepared to pay silly money ), so hoggs are wintered at home on inbye fields which ties up some of the grazing for overwintering lambs.Once again the Blackie , despite being the most numerous sheep breed in the country , is about to disappear according to the NCC people......
Rumours of it's demise have been exaggerated before and no doubt will be again.
We've had this fight on here several times before @abitdaft . I had a small dabble with them many years ago and thought they were next door to useless. Low prolificacy , bad on maternal traits. All the NCC folk tell me I must have had bad ewes , and maybe they're right , but they cost me a reasonable trade and were off a hard hill on Skye , so I would have looked for a much better performance on my ground.
It's an easy question for me - which breed left money behind them? Answer , the Blackie.
CharcoalWally
Member
- Location
- West of Scotland
That would be an understandable concern for your business. I don't run pure Blackie lambs myself so don't have much experience of finishing them other than a few years back when I had a break in from a neighbours Blackie tup on to my ewes when they were away at the Wintering.
I was pleasantly surprised at how well the BF wethers finished at the time and they sold really well , but that was only on a very small group of lambs so you couldn't call it a scientific result.
What kind of system are you finishing on? Is it grass only or are you feeding the lambs?
I only ask as I finish mine on grass alone , and with the kind of Winters the last couple have been , I would certainly say that they have been a little slower to finish due to the weather alone.
We generally finish on grass alone but last winter we were left with about 200 wedders and had to feed silage and bought in turnips, another issue from that was that through the winter they were on the silage fields which meant that we were slow to get grass growth started and obviously between that and the weather this year we are now behind with silage.
Crex
Member
- Location
- Innse Gall, Alba
The chap on This Farming Life had achieved fairly significant improvements in carcass traits in his blackies, so maybe the breeding you are looking for is out there?
This dabble you had seems to have really scarred you,I wouldn't write off a whole breed on the strength of one experience. I have spoken to so many that have had the opposite experience whose only regret is that they should have made the change earlier.Once again the Blackie , despite being the most numerous sheep breed in the country , is about to disappear according to the NCC people......
Rumours of it's demise have been exaggerated before and no doubt will be again.
We've had this fight on here several times before @abitdaft . I had a small dabble with them many years ago and thought they were next door to useless. Low prolificacy , bad on maternal traits. All the NCC folk tell me I must have had bad ewes , and maybe they're right , but they cost me a reasonable trade and were off a hard hill on Skye , so I would have looked for a much better performance on my ground.
It's an easy question for me - which breed left money behind them? Answer , the Blackie.
CharcoalWally
Member
- Location
- West of Scotland
Yes it's true @Top Tip. , that experience did put me off. I had heard good things about the breed and had hoped for better from them. It's only after I'd had them that people came out of the woodwork to offer opinions that they'd had them and had found them disappointing.
You and I have often argued this on this subject. I accept that up with you boys , these sheep have to work and have to do the job on these hills , or they wouldn't survive , that' s just common sense.
What I have never been able to get my head round , is that sheep off hard hills should have performed so poorly on my ground. Not just them , but their Cheviot Mule daughters too.
So , no , I don't think I would try them again , but plenty of other people will.
west coast angus
Member
Top Tip this has happened time and time again, i contract for a man who crossed out his blackies with Lairg tups, and this is a very hard wet hill, and has all so seen a big increase in lambing% and store lamb value, not to forget his wool clip is worth double!! and he his cast ewes are all correct in the mouth with very few broken unlike the blackies!!
Funny thing is he has just sold a load of 6 shear tups to a man crossing out his blackie flock, the said the only place he'd seen blackface 6 shear tups going was a hole in the ground !!
One of the biggest problems with the blackie is 90% of the Tups are bred on good understocked lowland farms!!
cheviot53
Member
- Location
- Dumfries & Galloway
Started changing a BF /SWALE flock 11yrs ago , this will be the first year no horns of any kind in the ewe lambs . The pluses - the xbred ewes even tougher than the bf , they are lasting longer and sell for more as culls . The lambs have always sold for £5-10 more than the bf . The ewes carry a little more condition and a few more lambs than the bf
I think that is the nub of the matter, being BRED on to lower better ground. When you bring old Blackie ewes off the hill, sometimes they can't take the better grass as opposed to the ones bred to it. We see it here, bring the 4 crop, healthy girl off a hard hill and a week later she is dead on good grass.