New information about local nature recovery and landscape recovery

Still Farming

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
South Wales UK
I think we have already had this debate on this thread!! If the Treasury " loans" 1 billion per annum until 2024 then they can pay us all to start ELMS now if we wish to( voluntary) and provide real feedback to their unbudgeted ideas and it fills the " hole" for BPS loss of 50% in the interim whilst we all try to avoid going bust and most importantly our businesses can adjust... fat chance of any common sense there and the whole rural industry will suffer as a result... sorry for being so pragmatic folks but the solution is that simple...
They wont listen to end users just suits in office allegedly.
 

J 1177

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Durham, UK
Strictly speaking, we Farmers have been providing foodstuffs, at or below the cost of production to provide the retailers and food processors with "cheap" products. This was made possible by support payments.

In effect, the subsidies were really for the benefit of the Supermarkets profit margins...
Iv said this for years. It also supported hundreds of rural jobs associated with agriculture
 

Vader

Member
Mixed Farmer

Seems warmer climate helps small birds through winter.
So climate change is good for recovery of these low bird numbers.
But defra want to limit climate change....
Thought they wanted more wildlife??
Nothing is as simple as the experts think.
That's why gov departments like defra [email protected] things up fo much....
 

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk
I think we have already had this debate on this thread!! If the Treasury " loans" 1 billion per annum until 2024 then they can pay us all to start ELMS now if we wish to( voluntary) and provide real feedback to their unbudgeted ideas and it fills the " hole" for BPS loss of 50% in the interim whilst we all try to avoid going bust and most importantly our businesses can adjust... fat chance of any common sense there and the whole rural industry will suffer as a result... sorry for being so pragmatic folks but the solution is that simple...
We have had long enough warning to at least start the adjustment process.
 

Jackov Altraids

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Devon
64 pages into this thread and what seems to becoming obvious is that SFI/LR/LNR in its current guise will have a net negative effect on the environment.

This is because it is clear that the money will be given to those who have planned to do environmental things anyway. Whether they are a charity with responsibilities in that regard anyway, private estates that want the kudos/ extra cover for shooting or large corporations that were planting trees to offset their carbon[a joke in itself].

By choosing to reduce support for all marginal land which has always been such a rich and diverse habitat, it is very likely that this will be farmed much more intensively.

A failing scheme is bad, one that uses huge resources to make things worse is diabolical.
 

Grass And Grain

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Yorks
64 pages into this thread and what seems to becoming obvious is that SFI/LR/LNR in its current guise will have a net negative effect on the environment.

This is because it is clear that the money will be given to those who have planned to do environmental things anyway. Whether they are a charity with responsibilities in that regard anyway, private estates that want the kudos/ extra cover for shooting or large corporations that were planting trees to offset their carbon[a joke in itself].

By choosing to reduce support for all marginal land which has always been such a rich and diverse habitat, it is very likely that this will be farmed much more intensively.

A failing scheme is bad, one that uses huge resources to make things worse is diabolical.
If rest of the SFI payment rates and requirements follow on in a similar manner to what has been already announced (and LNR + LR also require lots doing for little reward), then I think you're correct...

It won't be worth someone changing their farming system to pick up such a small payment. That means any ELMS environmental options only being taken up by those who are already doing it as part of their farming system.

We've some low lying river meadows. Entering them into Mid Tier options or the SFI grassland options will cost us more in lost production than we will gain in subsidy payment.

Those grasses are currently farmed in a balanced way, somewhere between intensive and extensive production. Would soon be a weedy mess if no herbicides allowed. Too wet to be confident of getting clover/herb rich awards established. You've to take the grass when the weather is right, so don't want to be stuck to a hay cutting date of 1st July.

Problem is DEFRA want a big area of grass in environmental options for a tiny area payment. They are going to get none, because not worth all the production compromises.

If they paid 3 x the payment.rate per acre, but on 1/3rd of the area, then DEFRA would get 1/3rd in a really good environmental option. Then leave me be to farm the other 2/3rds as I wish.
 

Wombat

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
East yorks
If rest of the SFI payment rates and requirements follow on in a similar manner to what has been already announced (and LNR + LR also require lots doing for little reward), then I think you're correct...

It won't be worth someone changing their farming system to pick up such a small payment. That means any ELMS environmental options only being taken up by those who are already doing it as part of their farming system.

We've some low lying river meadows. Entering them into Mid Tier options or the SFI grassland options will cost us more in lost production than we will gain in subsidy payment.

Those grasses are currently farmed in a balanced way, somewhere between intensive and extensive production. Would soon be a weedy mess if no herbicides allowed. Too wet to be confident of getting clover/herb rich awards established. You've to take the grass when the weather is right, so don't want to be stuck to a hay cutting date of 1st July.

Problem is DEFRA want a big area of grass in environmental options for a tiny area payment. They are going to get none, because not worth all the production compromises.

If they paid 3 x the payment.rate per acre, but on 1/3rd of the area, then DEFRA would get 1/3rd in a really good environmental option. Then leave me be to farm the other 2/3rds as I wish.
There is also the minimum amount we need to get to deal with the hassle of defra and the rpa. If I cannot get to that threshold then I will not consider the time, the stress, hassle and general agro worth it and will just pass and for me that is around 4-5k if we cannot get over that then I will not do anything and will make that money back in other ways that are less likely to put me in hospital.
 

tepapa

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
North Wales
If they paid 3 x the payment.rate per acre, but on 1/3rd of the area, then DEFRA would get 1/3rd in a really good environmental option. Then leave me be to farm the other 2/3rds as I wish.
That's how I see it could work but they need to pay more than 3x the payment.

If a farmer had 100 acres but had to keep 10 acres to environmental standard, which could include some habitat creation with certain plant species present or other biodiversity, and they were checked on that 10 acres to make sure you complied but it was worth

A) £1000/acre so £10,000 in payment there's a good chance he's going to look after it for the environment and not jeopardize his £10,000. So for example he won't put feeders on it or poach it with cattle in the winter in case he lost his substantial payment.

Now
B) you imagine you gave him £10/acre so it's worth £100 to him, do you think he's going to care if he gets caught with a with a ring feeder on it or if he cuts it on a certain day? Probably save more in straw then the payment.

Then the other 90 acres was his to farm. The environment will benefit from the 10 acres of better environmental benefit by better management and the farmer gets to farm unhindered on his 90 acres of productive land.
Both systems working alongside each other in harmony without being tied In government red tape on the whole farm business. There would be mozzaic of 10% of land area in high level environmental options dotted all around.
 
Last edited:

Hindsight

Member
Location
Lincolnshire
BEN GOLDSMITH

Wilder farming is the best thing for our countryside​


Ben Goldsmith

Wednesday January 26 2022, 9.00pm, The Times
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Our countryside is one of the wonders of the world, but our sad little secret is that England ranks among its most nature-depleted countries. The EU’s gigantic common agricultural policy (CAP) has provided a significant impetus for what has gone wrong.

Under the CAP, subsidies have been doled out each year to farmers according simply to how much farmable land they own, in the process condemning any remaining pockets of nature as ineligible features.

The impact has been especially harsh in our remoter, less productive landscapes, including our national parks. Britain is one of the least wild countries in Europe, principally because our uplands have been systematically stripped of nature to make way for millions of sheep. Even with CAP handouts, in much of Britain intensive farming just does not pay.


The Agriculture Act 2020 marks a turning point, setting in motion a new Environmental Land Management scheme (ELM) created on the premise of public money for public good.
ELM comprises three tiers. The Sustainable Farming Incentive will reward farmers for adopting sounder practices, such as no longer ploughing the soil and working with rather than against nature in the control of pests.

ADVERTISEMENT​


The second, Local Nature Recovery, will pay farmers to create wildlife habitat such as hedgerows, ponds and natural streams within farmed landscapes.
The third, Landscape Recovery, will provide funding for rewilding projects envisaged by individual landowners or clusters of farmers across whole landscapes. It is this third tier which has attracted the most attention, good and bad.
We are told that prioritising nature will hit food production and rural employment. These arguments are wrong. Turning the least productive fifth of our farmland towards nature recovery would lead to less than a 3 per cent reduction in food production.
Intensive sheep farming in our overgrazed uplands has such a low yield as to be net-negative in terms of food production. Moreover, farming does not cease in wilder landscapes. Wilder farming, the extensive grazing of native cattle through semi-open woodland mosaics, may be a more apt term than rewilding. Rural employment is shown to increase by 50 per cent on average in such areas.

SPONSORED​



The real issues when it comes to food security are the 250,000 acres of our most productive land that is used to grow crops to feed bioenergy reactors, the three million tonnes of homegrown grain fed to animals on highly inefficient intensive livestock units and the 9.5 million tonnes of food in the UK each year that is wasted.
Ben Goldsmith is a non-executive board member of the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs



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Jackov Altraids

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Devon
BEN GOLDSMITH

Wilder farming is the best thing for our countryside​


Ben Goldsmith

Wednesday January 26 2022, 9.00pm, The Times
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Our countryside is one of the wonders of the world, but our sad little secret is that England ranks among its most nature-depleted countries. The EU’s gigantic common agricultural policy (CAP) has provided a significant impetus for what has gone wrong.

Under the CAP, subsidies have been doled out each year to farmers according simply to how much farmable land they own, in the process condemning any remaining pockets of nature as ineligible features.

The impact has been especially harsh in our remoter, less productive landscapes, including our national parks. Britain is one of the least wild countries in Europe, principally because our uplands have been systematically stripped of nature to make way for millions of sheep. Even with CAP handouts, in much of Britain intensive farming just does not pay.


The Agriculture Act 2020 marks a turning point, setting in motion a new Environmental Land Management scheme (ELM) created on the premise of public money for public good.
ELM comprises three tiers. The Sustainable Farming Incentive will reward farmers for adopting sounder practices, such as no longer ploughing the soil and working with rather than against nature in the control of pests.

ADVERTISEMENT​


The second, Local Nature Recovery, will pay farmers to create wildlife habitat such as hedgerows, ponds and natural streams within farmed landscapes.
The third, Landscape Recovery, will provide funding for rewilding projects envisaged by individual landowners or clusters of farmers across whole landscapes. It is this third tier which has attracted the most attention, good and bad.
We are told that prioritising nature will hit food production and rural employment. These arguments are wrong. Turning the least productive fifth of our farmland towards nature recovery would lead to less than a 3 per cent reduction in food production.
Intensive sheep farming in our overgrazed uplands has such a low yield as to be net-negative in terms of food production. Moreover, farming does not cease in wilder landscapes. Wilder farming, the extensive grazing of native cattle through semi-open woodland mosaics, may be a more apt term than rewilding. Rural employment is shown to increase by 50 per cent on average in such areas.

SPONSORED​



The real issues when it comes to food security are the 250,000 acres of our most productive land that is used to grow crops to feed bioenergy reactors, the three million tonnes of homegrown grain fed to animals on highly inefficient intensive livestock units and the 9.5 million tonnes of food in the UK each year that is wasted.
Ben Goldsmith is a non-executive board member of the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs



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Comments(155)​

How the hell does Ben Goldsmith become a non-executive board member of Defra when he is so ignorant of farming and rural affairs?

He clearly doesn't understand the situation or the problem, so is inevitably clueless about the solution.

He contradicts himself within a sentence and obviously hasn't read the schemes as they stand as they don't match his vision.

I would love to interview him about this statement as it is simply incoherent.
 

J 1177

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Durham, UK
How the hell does Ben Goldsmith become a non-executive board member of Defra when he is so ignorant of farming and rural affairs?

He clearly doesn't understand the situation or the problem, so is inevitably clueless about the solution.

He contradicts himself within a sentence and obviously hasn't read the schemes as they stand as they don't match his vision.

I would love to interview him about this statement as it is simply incoherent.
As has been shown in the past the man is staggeringly arrogant.
Do as i say plebs....
I voted for boris but im praying this grey report proves his downfall if only to get rid of Carrie and the goldsmith brothers.
They and they alone will be the cause of mass food shortages in this country.
Let them eat cake indeed.
What really gets on my tits is the way the speak about land as its theirs to do what they want with and not privatley owned. They may be in for a shock.
 

Henarar

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Somerset
BEN GOLDSMITH

Wilder farming is the best thing for our countryside​


Ben Goldsmith

Wednesday January 26 2022, 9.00pm, The Times
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Our countryside is one of the wonders of the world, but our sad little secret is that England ranks among its most nature-depleted countries. The EU’s gigantic common agricultural policy (CAP) has provided a significant impetus for what has gone wrong.

Under the CAP, subsidies have been doled out each year to farmers according simply to how much farmable land they own, in the process condemning any remaining pockets of nature as ineligible features.

The impact has been especially harsh in our remoter, less productive landscapes, including our national parks. Britain is one of the least wild countries in Europe, principally because our uplands have been systematically stripped of nature to make way for millions of sheep. Even with CAP handouts, in much of Britain intensive farming just does not pay.


The Agriculture Act 2020 marks a turning point, setting in motion a new Environmental Land Management scheme (ELM) created on the premise of public money for public good.
ELM comprises three tiers. The Sustainable Farming Incentive will reward farmers for adopting sounder practices, such as no longer ploughing the soil and working with rather than against nature in the control of pests.

ADVERTISEMENT​


The second, Local Nature Recovery, will pay farmers to create wildlife habitat such as hedgerows, ponds and natural streams within farmed landscapes.
The third, Landscape Recovery, will provide funding for rewilding projects envisaged by individual landowners or clusters of farmers across whole landscapes. It is this third tier which has attracted the most attention, good and bad.
We are told that prioritising nature will hit food production and rural employment. These arguments are wrong. Turning the least productive fifth of our farmland towards nature recovery would lead to less than a 3 per cent reduction in food production.
Intensive sheep farming in our overgrazed uplands has such a low yield as to be net-negative in terms of food production. Moreover, farming does not cease in wilder landscapes. Wilder farming, the extensive grazing of native cattle through semi-open woodland mosaics, may be a more apt term than rewilding. Rural employment is shown to increase by 50 per cent on average in such areas.

SPONSORED​



The real issues when it comes to food security are the 250,000 acres of our most productive land that is used to grow crops to feed bioenergy reactors, the three million tonnes of homegrown grain fed to animals on highly inefficient intensive livestock units and the 9.5 million tonnes of food in the UK each year that is wasted.
Ben Goldsmith is a non-executive board member of the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs



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Comments(155)​

Lies
 

topground

Member
Location
North Somerset.
As has been shown in the past the man is staggeringly arrogant.
Do as i say plebs....
I voted for boris but im praying this grey report proves his downfall if only to get rid of Carrie and the goldsmith brothers.
They and they alone will be the cause of mass food shortages in this country.
Let them eat cake indeed.
What really gets on my tits is the way the speak about land as its theirs to do what they want with and not privatley owned. They may be in for a shock.
Heads on pikes.
 

delilah

Member
64 pages into this thread and what seems to becoming obvious is that SFI/LR/LNR in its current guise will have a net negative effect on the environment.

This is because it is clear that the money will be given to those who have planned to do environmental things anyway. Whether they are a charity with responsibilities in that regard anyway, private estates that want the kudos/ extra cover for shooting or large corporations that were planting trees to offset their carbon[a joke in itself].

By choosing to reduce support for all marginal land which has always been such a rich and diverse habitat, it is very likely that this will be farmed much more intensively.

A failing scheme is bad, one that uses huge resources to make things worse is diabolical.

Top post.
Anyone who has means of communicating directly with your MP, try and get them to attend the Parliamentary debate on ELMS, 9.30am Tuesday.
 

egbert

Member
How the hell does Ben Goldsmith become a non-executive board member of Defra when he is so ignorant of farming and rural affairs?

He clearly doesn't understand the situation or the problem, so is inevitably clueless about the solution.

He contradicts himself within a sentence and obviously hasn't read the schemes as they stand as they don't match his vision.

I would love to interview him about this statement as it is simply incoherent.
££££
oh come on Jack, keep up!
 

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Written by Charlotte Cunningham from CPM Magazine

JCB has launched new Fastrac 4000 and 8000 Series tractors with an all-new electronics infrastructure which is claimed to deliver higher levels of performance. According to JCB, the new Fastrac iCon operator environment has three key features: iConfigure – creating a bespoke control experience for every operator iConnect – integrating advanced precision agriculture technology iControl – redefining operation through new driveline software The 175hp to 348hp (133kW to 260kW) Fastracs feature the new iCon armrest console and touch-screen display to provide flexibility in operator allocation and operator information, as well as a new transmission control strategy to enhance operator comfort and powertrain efficiency, says the manufacturer...
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