New Zealand food standards and farming practices

[Dragon]

Plenty of examples about welfare standards in NZ that wouldn't be allowed here, two examples ! leaving dairy baby calves with no milk/ shelter at the roadside for 2/3 days waiting to be killed and 2 very high losses at lambing due to no/ very little input.

That type Low input sheep farming is carried out in the UK.

 

[stewart]

Plenty of examples about welfare standards in NZ that wouldn't be allowed here, two examples ! leaving dairy baby calves with no milk/ shelter at the roadside for 2/3 days waiting to be killed and 2 very high losses at lambing due to no/ very little input.

Never seen what you describe above in the 20 years I have lived here, anyone leaving calves with no milk or shelter etc at the roadside would be dealt with by the law, very swiftly and severely. Interference at lambing tends to lead to higher losses.
Trying to denigrate another countries farming in an attempt to make your own look superior does your farming industry no favours.

 

[stewart]

A friend was in NZ and saying how bad rivers were. I have no reason to disbelieve him

Come and have a look and see for yourself.

 

[multi power]

Plenty of examples about welfare standards in NZ that wouldn't be allowed here, two examples ! leaving dairy baby calves with no milk/ shelter at the roadside for 2/3 days waiting to be killed and 2 very high losses at lambing due to no/ very little input.

Doubt any calves are left at the roadside for 2 or 3 days, definitely wasn't when I was there
As for sheep losses I would have no idea
What I do know is the average kiwi dairy cow lives twice as long as the British cow

 

[neilo]

Plenty of examples about welfare standards in NZ that wouldn't be allowed here, two examples ! leaving dairy baby calves with no milk/ shelter at the roadside for 2/3 days waiting to be killed and 2 very high losses at lambing due to no/ very little input.

I hate to pop your balloon but since changing to outdoor lambing, using kiwi maternal genetics, our lambing losses (& costs) are lower than they were when we lambed inside, and paid for a night lamber, using UK terminal sire cross ewe genetics.
I’ve no doubt I could reduce labour input at lambing further, as well as losses, by selecting even harder for easy lambing genetics, and perhaps accepting a few out of spec lambs (‘O’ grades) as a consequence.

 

[neilo]

Never seen what you describe above in the 20 years I have lived here, anyone leaving calves with no milk or shelter etc at the roadside would be dealt with by the law, very swiftly and severely. Interference at lambing tends to lead to higher losses.
Trying to denigrate another countries farming in an attempt to make your own look superior does your farming industry no favours.

And that's Our biggest problem with NZ lamb as a competitor. Ultimately it’s not an inferior product, nor is it produced to lower welfare standards or with a bigger carbon footprint.
It is a consistent, possibly ‘bland’, product that is produced in sufficient volume that a boatload can be selected & shipped to Tesco (or whoever), all meeting the same spec.

The job would be a lot easier if the kiwis just produced rubbish.

 

[M-J-G]

Looks like a half wired vegan extremist who makes crazy and absurd claims about the livestock industry has hacked GUTH's account!

Remember guys, never tell anyone your password!!

 

[kiwi pom]

A friend was in NZ and saying how bad rivers were. I have no reason to disbelieve him

I wonder where he was and what rivers he's seen?
There's certainly a big push by the Green party and fish and game to tell the world our rivers are awful but I don't see it at least round here.
There might be some bad ones in more populated areas but I think farmers are getting way too much blame. Local councils need to look at other non farming sources of pollution a lot more carefully in my opinion.
One of the biggest problems is parts or the country don't get much rain so the rivers are often dry or barely running which could create issues. Many are very wide to take huge volumes of peak flood water so when they're low it may look like a problem to someone not used to seeing empty rivers.
Fish and Game NZ seem to have taken the stance that its all farmers fault with their nitrogen and irrigation and refuse to work with them, its easier just to criticise.

 

[FonterraFarmer]

Come and have a look and see for yourself.

Slight flaw in your logic...










They might not want to return to the UK!!!

 

[FonterraFarmer]

I wonder where he was and what rivers he's seen?
There's certainly a big push by the Green party and fish and game to tell the world our rivers are awful but I don't see it at least round here.
There might be some bad ones in more populated areas but I think farmers are getting way too much blame. Local councils need to look at other non farming sources of pollution a lot more carefully in my opinion.
One of the biggest problems is parts or the country don't get much rain so the rivers are often dry or barely running which could create issues. Many are very wide to take huge volumes of peak flood water so when they're low it may look like a problem to someone not used to seeing empty rivers.
Fish and Game NZ seem to have taken the stance that its all farmers fault with their nitrogen and irrigation and refuse to work with them, its easier just to criticise.

It not as if Fish and Game ever got their facts wrong...

 

[Jamer]

Doubt any calves are left at the roadside for 2 or 3 days, definitely wasn't when I was there
As for sheep losses I would have no idea
What I do know is the average kiwi dairy cow lives twice as long as the British cow

I don't know anything about NZ but I seriously doubt the average kiwi dairy cow lives twice as long as a UK one. Certainly not from figures I've ever seen in the press nor anecdotally from people who have worked there.

 

[Farmer T]

I would swap my farm with a farm half the size in New Zealand because it’s an amazing country and wonderful people. However, their environmental standards are significantly below UK standards, at least regarding crop production.

The ‘problem’ they have with such good soil and weather, almost every N input will pay for itself regardless if half of it gets washed away.

However NZ has an auditing system being introduced to monitor all inputs, which unsurprisingly the arable farmers aren’t keen on!

I’m not saying every farmer is making environmental mistakes but I am saying as a country they are a lot more relaxed about rules and more focused on getting results.

 

[kiwi pom]

I would swap my farm with a farm half the size in New Zealand because it’s an amazing country and wonderful people. However, their environmental standards are significantly below UK standards, at least regarding crop production.

View attachment 773338

The ‘problem’ they have with such good soil and weather, almost every N input will pay for itself regardless if half of it gets washed away.

However NZ has an auditing system being introduced to monitor all inputs, which unsurprisingly the arable farmers aren’t keen on!

I’m not saying every farmer is making environmental mistakes but I am saying as a country they are a lot more relaxed about rules and more focused on getting results.

As I said upthread Fish and Game have it in for farmers, 'insisting' something is not the same as proving something.
I am curious as to what environmental standards the UK has that are significantly better than here? Not saying you don't, just wondering what they are.

 

[kiwi pom]

Plenty of examples about welfare standards in NZ that wouldn't be allowed here, two examples ! leaving dairy baby calves with no milk/ shelter at the roadside for 2/3 days waiting to be killed and 2 very high losses at lambing due to no/ very little input.

Plenty of regulations for Bobby calves here.
I was until a couple of years ago a milk tanker driver for Fonterra in my 10 years there I've probably been to 75% of the dairy farms between Culverden and Dunedin (which is a lot) and I've never seen Bobbies left at the gate for days with no food or shelter. If we did see it, it would have been reported.
Groups like Peta spend a lot of time and energy trying to catch farmers out and as there are always a few bad ones (just as the UK) they catch and prosecute people, as they should but they don't find many.
Bobbies are sometimes put in raised pens, just before the trucks due, this is because large stock trucks don't have tailboards. The driver backs up to the pen, slides the gates open and walks the calves across. Its better than chucking them in, I'm sure you'll agree.

 

[Kiwi Pete]

I wonder where he was and what rivers he's seen?
There's certainly a big push by the Green party and fish and game to tell the world our rivers are awful but I don't see it at least round here.
There might be some bad ones in more populated areas but I think farmers are getting way too much blame. Local councils need to look at other non farming sources of pollution a lot more carefully in my opinion.
One of the biggest problems is parts or the country don't get much rain so the rivers are often dry or barely running which could create issues. Many are very wide to take huge volumes of peak flood water so when they're low it may look like a problem to someone not used to seeing empty rivers.
Fish and Game NZ seem to have taken the stance that its all farmers fault with their nitrogen and irrigation and refuse to work with them, its easier just to criticise.

Most of the southern rivers are "polluted" by didymosphenia geminata or "rock snot" but I don't think that one can be attributed to any group other than touring anglers, who firstly brought it into the country and then spread it around the rivers.
That's down south, away from all the cities and their "inputs" - where there are people, there is a footprint

However the water in the creek that leaves our place has been tested to be better drinking quality than the town supply..

Most UK TFF visitors here make the comment "don't believe all you read on the forum about you guys having less rules than us, it's not what I've seen since I've been here"

 

[tinsheet]

Been there worked there got family that farm there, standards are certainly Not lower than ours, I would say on par with us, we can certainly learn a lot from them.

My experience for what it counts.

 

[willy]

The only thing I can think of is castrating lambs and tailing can be done up to 6 months in NZ it not in the Uk.

 

[kiwi pom]

@gone up the hill If you get a spare 20 mins, might be worth a watch.
Country Calendar is one of the Kiwi farming shows, plenty of episodes on you tube.
Might give an idea as to what goes on here.

 

[Farmer T]

As I said upthread Fish and Game have it in for farmers, 'insisting' something is not the same as proving something.
I am curious as to what environmental standards the UK has that are significantly better than here? Not saying you don't, just wondering what they are.

Environmental standards? Buffer strips near water. NVZs. All sprayers annually calibrated. All pesticides approved by a BASIS qualified agronomist. Buffer strips next to hedges. Many many pesticides have been banned in the UK which NZ use (although Bravo is banned in NZ but not on environmental measures). A high percentage of UK are/have been in environmental schemes. Cricky I could go on.

I enjoy the NZ farmer’s input on this forum, and if I farmed out there with no restrictions I would be tempted to cut corners as well in areas if it meant a better GM.

When I was out there in Nov/Dec it showed me I think farmers actually need some environmental restrictions otherwise you can get yourself in problems like NZ currently is.

 

[willy]

Environmental standards? Buffer strips near water. NVZs. All sprayers annually calibrated. All pesticides approved by a BASIS qualified agronomist. Buffer strips next to hedges. Many many pesticides have been banned in the UK which NZ use (although Bravo is banned in NZ but not on environmental measures). A high percentage of UK are/have been in environmental schemes. Cricky I could go on.

I enjoy the NZ farmer’s input on this forum, and if I farmed out there with no restrictions I would be tempted to cut corners as well in areas if it meant a better GM.

When I was out there in Nov/Dec it showed me I think farmers actually need some environmental restrictions otherwise you can get yourself in problems like NZ currently is.

Interesting, how are they tackling it?