newbe dd crop advice please!

[Case140]

Hi. As a complete newbe to dd and cover crops (but it makes complete sense to me) I am looking for some starter advice for two plots which I will be sowing in the spring.
Plot1 Medium land Lea for 12 years being grazed off with sheep at moment..level... weed free.. ph 6.36 index 2 for np&k. I was planning to plough (sorry guys!) and put in s barley. (i know wheat would be better but we have always had a hard time with s wheat here for many reasons) and sbarley will fit in with my other crops. Am only getting the use of these 2small fields from Jan 1 so no option to put in wwheat which would have been my choice. My thought is roundup as soon as weather is ok, (should be v little residue) and dd barley and normal routine.
Plot2: Very peaty wet field in long term lea ph 5.7 in spite of regular lime. index 2 for np&k. Difficult field if wet year. In dry year yields grass well. Would I be asking for trouble dd oats in and if so any suggestions for rotation. Or maybe just grass.....buy a few cattle!
Also does anybody dd beans into stubble (pretty good soil structure) with a simba miniflow- I dont think I would have trouble getting to 3plus inches with new narrow points. It is set up on std 8/metre 5in spacings.
What advice for spacing (block off half the pipes??) Any advice much appreciated. Thanks, Nigel

 

[SilliamWhale]

What drill?

 

[Case140]

Probably my miniflow

 

[Badshot]

I doubt the miniflow will dd into grass, mine hated trash, but maybe only because it was loose.

 

[Case140]

Ok. I. have option of contractor with clayton if needed. But as I have it I will try! Am thinking of widening to 8in spacing and fitting dale or similar legs as am going down dd route anyway and have to sow covers for glas scheme.. Cant justify new drill on small acreage! I have successfully dd to stubble before though straw was baled. Maybe it wont work but if not no harm done!
You had problem with loose grass. Would I be better to delay spray to a couple of days before drilling then grass would stay put?

 

[SilliamWhale]

I don't know much about the drill but if you are confident you can get plenty of seed into soil and not standing in an open trench and not block your drill up go for it.

Maybe use some calcifert close to the low pH one. I'd chuck a bit of N on a week before.

My advice is to roundup in March and drill from beginning of April

 

[Case140]

Im not worried about getting seed into ground - if my drill doesnt work the claydon (apologies for previous spell!) will be called in. What spacing do you recommend for cereals and also beans? How do you feel about oats in a bit of wet ground? would you bother and if so would you follow with catch and then dd sbarley next yr? I feel even with lime I will struggle to get ph up but would have a much better chance of growing crops if I dont have to plough as the sod is not bad and is ok for traffic most of the year. The problem will be getting oats sown early enough as it takes a while to dry in spring. or maybe leave in grass till autumn....? Thanks a million for the imput - much appreciated! I think I will have to fall on my face a few times before I have this worked out!! N

 

[SilliamWhale]

Dont think spacings matter too much. Mine is at 7.5".


Be prepared that it may not work quite as you want to start but make sure you find out how to improve. Thats where lots fall down and give up or claim it doesnt work

 

[Case140]

7.5 for both beans and cereals? What drill do you use? Zero till/min till or mixture? I am well prepared for it to be a long term project - and the only way to find out what works for me on my land is to try. If it doesnt work out at first Ill try something else. All I know for definite is we cannot go on the way we are going with conventional tillage only (I will plough if necessary) as the only winners are the seed and spray companies and the loosers are the farmer and the environment. If I can reduce my costs, reduce my fertilizer and sprays ill be happy. Dont expect to for a few years though till I can get the soil in better shape! N

 

[SilliamWhale]

Yeah 7.5" is the only setting I have. Well unless its rape and I've done 15" then. I don't think it matters what the spacing is really. I don't even put beans that deep anyway. I think it can work on anyones land but you need to get your head right and make sure you find out when things go wrong why they do.

I wouldn't expect much spray saving to be honest. Fert will depend on nutrient status anyway. It does save you money but don't think of doing it on the cheap just to save money

 

[SimonD]

I'd be hesistent to go into it purely with a financial savings expectation. I had improving the farm soil structure as a priority with financial savings seen as a benefit if realised.
With some planning and good timing you should avoid pitfalls. If you go drilling with the ground in an unsuitable condition you're probably lining yourself up for failure. I try to drill when the ground is suitable, even if I have to come back once it's dried out. There's more risk than a ploughing operation but will offer good reward in my opinion, I don't regret it and can see the soil improving even in year 2.

 

[Case140]

I dont expect to have savings, especially in the first few years, but I hope that I will be working with rather than against nature which is much more like "real" farming to me. My priority is the same as yours and one thing I have found is that there are lots of farmers out there who are doing this successfully and are willing to share their knowledge. Also there are lots doing it without spending vast amounts on machinery - some of the innovation here is amazing! I just need to learn what will and what wont work on my farm (some of which could be painfull and hurt the pocket!).

 

[damaged]

Oats seem okay on lower ph. Suggest, from experience, spray off grass soon as possible. Drill oats straight in, no till. The bare ground takes better, warms and dries easier. Now dursban has gone the oats are good call. Good dose of N at drilling, some to offset grass root decay. Prilled lime possibly.

 

[Case140]

Thanks for that. It is what I am thinking but what I am concerned about is the Harvest (assuming it grows!) Spring oats can be late here (700 ft plus) so harvest can be late. So any ideas for the second crop?
Also what is your opinion on slug pellets at sowing?