Next bull for suckler herd

[JSmith]

 

[aled1590]

We’ve just sold our Simmental

Cattle are usually as wild as the man looking after them.

And a very able stockman reckons Salers are the ideal suckler cow, apart for their temperament. My own opinion is that Limousins would be the ideal suckler cow if they were a bit milkier.

And for that reason we bought a simm bull to put on our limmy and lim x cows. Very happy with their offspring

 

[thorpe]

We’ve just sold our Simmental

And for that reason we bought a simm bull to put on our limmy and lim x cows. Very happy with their offspring View attachment 925024

i bet you are!

 

[Optimus]

Just sold an Angus heifer this week out of a simmy cow.417kg u=3+ was £7 short of £1700 .was cracking beast would of kept her but got too many breeding heifers this year.

 

[JohnAC]

We changed from limmys to stabilisers over the last 5-6 years it’s the best thing we have done calving difficulty is way down and finishing bulls has definitely reduced time to slaughter and make good wee cows too seem to suit our system well working up from dairy bred cows

 

[Woolless]

We changed from limmys to stabilisers over the last 5-6 years it’s the best thing we have done calving difficulty is way down and finishing bulls has definitely reduced time to slaughter and make good wee cows too seem to suit our system well working up from dairy bred cows

I think the Achilles heel of the Stabiliser is that store buyers are a little wary but if you're finishing your own, they've got to be a consideration.

 

[M-J-G]

You'll get every suggestion under the sun on here.

I'd go for a Simmental again, I'd get a polled one.
Cow size won't be an issue if you avoid big rough framed types.
I have a pure Simmental cow on a neighbours farm running with Her. AA and BBx cows and she's smaller than all but a few of them.

 

[M-J-G]

I think the Achilles heel of the Stabiliser is that store buyers are a little wary but if you're finishing your own, they've got to be a consideration.

They're more than a little wary.

 

[Woolless]

They're more than a little wary.

It's a rarity to see them mentioned in a store sale report. Just still an unknown quantity to many, I suppose.

 

[M-J-G]

It's a rarity to see them mentioned in a store sale report. Just still an unknown quantity to many, I suppose.

Why is that?
Haven't they been around for about 30 years

 

[Woolless]

Why is that?
Haven't they been around for about 30 years

Fair point. I'm no expert but would guess that a lot of breeders would take full advantage of their own genetics and finish their own bulls. Maybe @Poorbuthappy could shed more light on why Stabilisers aren't a regular fixture at store sales?

 

[M-J-G]

Fair point. I'm no expert but would guess that a lot of breeders would take full advantage of their own genetics and finish their own bulls. Maybe @Poorbuthappy could shed more light on why Stabilisers aren't a regular fixture at store sales?

I take it goes are a lowland cow and aren't kept on uplands since most of those on harder farms have no option but to sell as calves/stores.

 

[Woolless]

I take it goes are a lowland cow and aren't kept on uplands since most of those on harder farms have no option but to sell as calves/stores.

The Givendale herd (original British?) certainly wouldn't be roughing it in the East Yorkshire Wolds. IIRC there's a big herd in Northumberland that winter their cows on the hill.

 

[Poorbuthappy]

I take it goes are a lowland cow and aren't kept on uplands since most of those on harder farms have no option but to sell as calves/stores.

Why no option?
Plenty stabiliser breeders finish their bulls intensively indoors.
Best heifers retained or sold for breeding. Cows wintered on a hill as @Woolless says.

They seem to be rather marmite cattle, but I don't know many (any?) haters who've actually kept a herd of stabilisers.

Wouldn't recommend to anyone selling store, suspect its still cos of the "unknown" factor, as most breeders I know finish their own. I do know of 1 or 2 selling store to regular private buyer, who are quite happy with the arrangement.

The op finishes all their own, so I wouldn't be afraid to say try a good stabiliser. Good all rounder that will make excellent cows and finish well.

But if the haters want to hate, doesn't bother me. I'm very happy with them.

 

[tr250]

They're more than a little wary.

If your a store buyer calving issues don’t worry you as your sleeping tight that’s why they want charalais and lims why wouldn’t they

 

[JMTHORNLEY]

What would you class as a hard calving cow ? having to assist any of them ?
We run all sorts of cows and wouldn't find the British Blues or Blue crosses any more hard calving than anything else, we have had a few char cross cows as well and they were not a problem

Interesting post.... I have run pure Shorthorn for a number of years now and year before last billed with a British Blue, had absolutely no trouble craving the cows at all, not a single assist. When I was bulling with the shorthorn I had more bother than anything I’ve ever seen. Tried many different bulls through AI or a stock bull and would have to help at least five to clave, I only have a small heard so five was an unacceptable number for me. I have since bulled again with the Blue and have no intention of changing. Unreal calves from the blue and they really are growing like rocket ships

 

[M-J-G]

Why no option?
Plenty stabiliser breeders finish their bulls intensively indoors.
Best heifers retained or sold for breeding. Cows wintered on a hill as @Woolless says.

Hill farms generally aren't equipped to hold onto their cattle to finish them combined with being further from cereal and straw supplies.
Calve in the spring and sell calves at weaning usually suits best with winter being longer and more expensive in the hills.

It tends to make more sense to move cattle to the feed than to move feed to the cattle.

.
Wouldn't recommend to anyone selling store, suspect its still cos of the "unknown" factor

Why are they still such an unknown?
Haven't they been on the go for about 30 years? Maybe more for all I know.

most breeders I know finish their own.

Which brings me back to the point that they mustn't be a hill cow if males are better finished.

Personally I'd always want the option to sell stores.

 

[Poorbuthappy]

Hill farms generally aren't equipped to hold onto their cattle to finish them combined with being further from cereal and straw supplies.
Calve in the spring and sell calves at weaning usually suits best with winter being longer and more expensive in the hills.

It tends to make more sense to move cattle to the feed than to move feed to the cattle.

Why are they still such an unknown?
Haven't they been on the go for about 30 years? Maybe more for all I know.


Which brings me back to the point that they mustn't be a hill cow if males are better finished.

Personally I'd always want the option to sell stores.

I'm not a hill farmer, but I hear of plenty wintering them on a hill.

Depends where you're hill is i guess, but straw is dear enough here and I'm 3 miles from good arable land, just not in large quantities.
From prices on here, we're dearer for straw and fodder here this year than "up north"

But I'm not forcing anyone.

 

[M-J-G]

Sorry if taking thread further of topic but is anyone else finding Simmentals have become wilder as the breed has changed colour to the darker red type most seem to be now or have I just been unlucky?

Been keeping our own replacement ones for 35 years but been having to cull out a temperament problem since buying such a bull in 2012. Unsure if his similarly coloured replacement is producing calves the same or whether they are getting it through their mothers by the 2012 bull

I'd say Raceview King has done a lot of harm to the breeds temperament in the past 15 years.

He was a hard muscled, bad tempered little sh!t who got a reputation for being some fantastic bull that he never actually was. Ironically many who thought he was great never saw him in the flesh.
I saw him at around 18 months and saw nothing useful about him unless you wanted the garden dug up.

The problem is the Irish and NI breeders used him very heavily, and he appears on (IMO) far too many pedigrees (in some cases several times).
Tyson, Vio, Volvo, Warrior...... and so many of those common AI bulls go back to that line and I'm regularly hearing of flare ups in temperament where they are used.

There are one or two others that may have contributed, but King is a definite major offender in my view.

 

[Ribble]

Breed bias aside, what features do buyers of stores look for/ discriminate against, generally speaking?