NIR Slurry Application

Has anyone used NIR technology for slurry application? We are considering it for installation on our dribble bar, to monitor the nutrient being applied and help plan our chemical fertiliser applications around our digestate spreading in conjunction with our SOYL maps.

I have seen several - JD Harvest Lab, Veenhuis Nutriflow, Fritzmeier Isaria and Dinamica Generale to name a few.

Has anyone seen it in action yet, specifically on an umbilical applicator?
 
Ok so a bit of an update - I have now bought a HarvestLab 3000, manure kit and a JD 4640 screen. I'll update this thread with how I get on - the first mission is to modify our existing dribble bar to make room for the skateboard and to get the HL mounted on it. Will be running it on a Fendt 516, so will post any findings I have along the way in case it might be of help to someone else considering doing the same! (y)
 

sjt01

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
North Norfolk
Ok so a bit of an update - I have now bought a HarvestLab 3000, manure kit and a JD 4640 screen. I'll update this thread with how I get on - the first mission is to modify our existing dribble bar to make room for the skateboard and to get the HL mounted on it. Will be running it on a Fendt 516, so will post any findings I have along the way in case it might be of help to someone else considering doing the same! (y)
I am always very wary of NIR kit. I spent time a few years ago trying to use NIR in tea manufacture. On the fresh material, you could get an excellent calibration, then the next day with a different variety (clone) or different agronomy you would need a completely different calibration. I would invest as much in checking the calibration against wet chemistry lab samples as I had spent on the kit, to make sure you are not being totally misled.
On our AD digestate, there is so little variation in analysis from year to year (basically how much it has been diluted by rainfall) that one well mixed sample a year is fine for us.
 
I am always very wary of NIR kit. I spent time a few years ago trying to use NIR in tea manufacture. On the fresh material, you could get an excellent calibration, then the next day with a different variety (clone) or different agronomy you would need a completely different calibration. I would invest as much in checking the calibration against wet chemistry lab samples as I had spent on the kit, to make sure you are not being totally misled.
On our AD digestate, there is so little variation in analysis from year to year (basically how much it has been diluted by rainfall) that one well mixed sample a year is fine for us.

Hi Stephen, appreciate your input. Our digestate is noticeable thinner in the early part of a spreading job, we mix it continuously whilst spreading but it still gets thicker towards the end. Our goal is to keep the nutrient within our control to help plan chemical fert application.

With the JD system you can refine the calibration by taking both a sample and a photograph of the live data on the HL and sending them both off to the lab to calibrate the calibration curve.

I will post my findings up here for all to see, good or bad. We also plan to put it on our contractors harvester, for auto chop length and auto silage additive application based on tonnage and dry matter. I have high hopes the additive savings alone will pay for the HarvestLab in the long term.
 

Speedstar

Member
Location
Scottish Borders
Hi Stephen, appreciate your input. Our digestate is noticeable thinner in the early part of a spreading job, we mix it continuously whilst spreading but it still gets thicker towards the end. Our goal is to keep the nutrient within our control to help plan chemical fert application.

With the JD system you can refine the calibration by taking both a sample and a photograph of the live data on the HL and sending them both off to the lab to calibrate the calibration curve.

I will post my findings up here for all to see, good or bad. We also plan to put it on our contractors harvester, for auto chop length and auto silage additive application based on tonnage and dry matter. I have high hopes the additive savings alone will pay for the HarvestLab in the long term.
Will be interesting to see how you get on but i know people that have tried this in the past & it did not work , bit of a waste of money , works better on crops working in the same width spreading & cutting
 

Hindsight

Member
Location
Lincolnshire
Ok so a bit of an update - I have now bought a HarvestLab 3000, manure kit and a JD 4640 screen. I'll update this thread with how I get on - the first mission is to modify our existing dribble bar to make room for the skateboard and to get the HL mounted on it. Will be running it on a Fendt 516, so will post any findings I have along the way in case it might be of help to someone else considering doing the same! (y)
Getting grant aid for this?
 
Getting grant aid for this?

No, unfortunately no grants available for it in NI. Bought HarvestLab second hand, a new JD universal display and have a cable on order from Solsteer to make it talk to the Novatel receiver in the Fendt. Next hurdle is getting the dribble bar modified to accept the Harvest Lab.
 

Agri-oplossingen

Member
Trade
Ok so a bit of an update - I have now bought a HarvestLab 3000, manure kit and a JD 4640 screen. I'll update this thread with how I get on - the first mission is to modify our existing dribble bar to make room for the skateboard and to get the HL mounted on it. Will be running it on a Fendt 516, so will post any findings I have along the way in case it might be of help to someone else considering doing the same! (y)
Hello Rob,

nice to hear that you have bought an harvestlab. i've worked for years at a john deere company and do the latest 5 years only things with harvestlabs. so maybe i can help you to setup the system.

with kind regards,

gosse koerts
 
A start has been made 💪

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Previously looked like this. Should lower the whole thing down too for better view out the back window

IMG_4185.JPG
 
As the French would say… sacré bleu!!

Cheers to Chaunce from Solsteer for the wiring harness to get it working. HL is plugged into the Fendt isobus port, and JD screen is then plugged into two sockets inside the cab using the Solsteer harness. They are both seeing each other on the Fendt bus network which is a great start. Didn’t get tractor out of the shed so had no gps signal to test if the JD screen was receiving a signal off the Fendt Novatel receiver, job for another day..

B45E6A39-7515-4C20-84E2-22CF723BE8F7.jpeg
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How did this work out in the end @Rob_AD

A total waste of time and resources. We found the NIR sensor to be really inaccurate compared with lab results taken whilst spreading. I took the issue to my local dealer who escalated it to John Deere, and their response was "we are right and you are wrong". Typical German attitude.

They told me that firstly their NIR sensor was completely reliable, and how could I be sure that my lab was accurate? (Even though it's NRM, the best known UCAS accredited lab in the UK) And secondly, they said that if I was feeding our AD plant chicken manure or any other feedstock that didn't consist mainly of maize and whole crop, the results would not be accurate. I told them this was a load of nonsense and that every AD plant uses a different mix of feedstocks so they would need to have some way to tailor the calibration to suit. They had not and in the end I was left with no choice but to remove the HarvestLab and I sold it back to the dealer last year.

Very very disappointing.

Here's a screenshot showing the many tests we did whilst spreading. We held a bucket under the dribble bar and took a screenshot of the HarvestLab at the exact same moment, so we could compare the data sets side by side. During the season we took the HarvestLab in to our local dealer who did a "Black and White Calibration" on it which did help but it was still too far out to be relied upon. Dry Matter % was the most surprising, of all the results I would have expected it to be spot on.

Screenshot 2023-09-10 at 07.54.27.png

Screenshot 2023-09-10 at 08.01.41.png



@cowboysupper
 
Last edited:

RTK

Member
@Rob_AD Hi Rob, jumping on this post a little late, sorry. I'm trying to achieve a similar layout to yourself, with the HL going on a dribble bar and through a 4640 and was hoping you could answer a couple of questions?

With regards to the SolSteer harnesses, I'm guessing I need to connect to the Novatel Smart 7, and through the screen etc. Do you know what these looms were, and did you need any other harnesses/looms?

Can the HL control the forward speed of the Fendt like it can with a Deere, or do you lose this functionality?

Were there any other teething problems or issues you found along the way? Other than the lack of accuracy of course!

Thank you!
 

GeoPard

Member
Location
Germany, Cologne
Has anyone used NIR technology for slurry application? We are considering it for installation on our dribble bar, to monitor the nutrient being applied and help plan our chemical fertiliser applications around our digestate spreading in conjunction with our SOYL maps.

I have seen several - JD Harvest Lab, Veenhuis Nutriflow, Fritzmeier Isaria and Dinamica Generale to name a few.

Has anyone seen it in action yet, specifically on an umbilical applicator?
Take a look at the use case: NUE calculation with Harveslab protein, yield, and as-applied data. The case was highlighted by John Deere at Agritechnica 23.

https://geopard.tech/blog/nitrogen-use-efficiency-use-case-from-lva-john-deere-dealer-from-germany/

https://geopard.tech/johndeere - it's auto-synced with the JohnDeere Ops center.
 

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