NSA launches survey to investigate claims of poor ram longevity

[andybk]

I'm amazed at how many folk stand at the ring side and bid on tups that they have never laid a hand on.

At sales I'm always in the lead up alley to the ring. Can see feet and locomotion, handle for teeth, testicles wool etc.

same here , feet / legs are critical , after initial body feel in the pen to narrow down selection , you cant really judge feet in the ring or pen . hocks (over straight) is another thing that take a hammering with overfeeding at a young age .

 

[Ysgythan]

so unlike the good doc and the nsa you dont see a problem?
therefore no need for change?
Change is the law of life. And those who look only to the past or present are certain to miss the future.
jfk

I can change my flock totally in two years. All I have to do is buy one ram and four ewes. ET will do the rest. Why then breed for some indeterminate future market? Why listen to the authors of that report who have only managed thus far to contribute a 50kg hatstand you can't finish to the market?

Don't get me wrong, there's a lot of good and technical advice in there, but there's also some terrible advice. It's all good intentioned of course, but if you were starting off with a clean sheet and only had that as your guide, it would be a blueprint for struggling to give shearlings away for £100.

 

[Global ovine]

I've never heard of that one. Maybe down to a mineral imbalance somewhere? Perhaps @Global ovine has heard of it?

What a pity us non-organic farmers can't get hold of this magical clover stuff to put in our grass leys.

Never heard of clover stones. As many on this forum will be aware, the NZ pastoral industry is based on the clover component. All management decisions are about maximising clover, as clover looks after the grass component. one would think that if white clover in particular caused a problem, it would be very evident throughout NZ, whether in the sub tropical north, or in the cool temperate south.

 

[Ysgythan]

Never heard of clover stones. As many on this forum will be aware, the NZ pastoral industry is based on the clover component. All management decisions are about maximising clover, as clover looks after the grass component. one would think that if white clover in particular caused a problem, it would be very evident throughout NZ, whether in the sub tropical north, or in the cool temperate south.

Forgive me then, but if that's the case the accuracy of that claim must be questioned...together with just how much other bulls**t has been trotted out in that publicly funded publication...

I know they mean well, but replacing an anecdotal orthodoxy with a pseudo science orthodoxy seems a bit pointless.

 

[baabaa]

I can change my flock totally in two years. All I have to do is buy one ram and four ewes. ET will do the rest. Why then breed for some indeterminate future market? Why listen to the authors of that report who have only managed thus far to contribute a 50kg hatstand you can't finish to the market?

Don't get me wrong, there's a lot of good and technical advice in there, but there's also some terrible advice. It's all good intentioned of course, but if you were starting off with a clean sheet and only had that as your guide, it would be a blueprint for struggling to give shearlings away for £100.

yadayada
is there a problem or not?????

 

[Ysgythan]

yadayada
is there a problem or not?????

I'll rise above that and keep the ad hominem retort to myself. No, there's no problem. If you want good, workable tups they are to be had and cheaply enough. As an industry we do an awful lot of farming other people's farms for them. If other people want to buy overfed, over pampered, trimmed, coloured, show blunted, cabbage stuffed, ad lib grubbed fatty panters, and at a premium, let them. If you see that as a problem then have some faith in the market which will adjust to sort it out.

 

[baabaa]

I'll rise above that and keep the ad hominem retort to myself. No, there's no problem. If you want good, workable tups they are to be had and cheaply enough. As an industry we do an awful lot of farming other people's farms for them. If other people want to buy overfed, over pampered, trimmed, coloured, show blunted, cabbage stuffed, ad lib grubbed fatty panters, and at a premium, let them. If you see that as a problem then have some faith in the market which will adjust to sort it out.

the market is sorting it, the lad i buy my "mongrels"(your term) from, last two years has been sold out from his yard by mid july and already has a waiting list for next year!

 

[Ysgythan]

the market is sorting it, the lad i buy my "mongrels"(your term) from, last two years has been sold out from his yard by mid july and already has a waiting list for next year!

So what's the problem?

 

[neilo]

I just received a phone call from the NSA, trying to drum up numbers for the focus groups on this. I was asked if I could attend the meeting in Brecon next Monday evening (I can't).
They are looking for farmers with commercial flocks of more than 200 ewes and who can give figures on what they've paid for Rams, mortality, etc over the last 5 years or so.

There's free food to be had too apparently, if any freeloaders are interested...

Anyone interested can book a place by ringing the NSA at Malvern.

 

[h3n3rz101]

@neilo is that tup on your profile picture a rouge? I seem to quite like them recently, are they a long living breed and what else are good about them, I'm liking their shape especially crossed onto a beltex as I nearly bought one a few month back

 

[andybk]

@neilo is that tup on your profile picture a rouge? I seem to quite like them recently, are they a long living breed and what else are good about them, I'm liking their shape especially crossed onto a beltex as I nearly bought one a few month back

lol , take cover !

 

[neilo]

@neilo is that tup on your profile picture a rouge? I seem to quite like them recently, are they a long living breed and what else are good about them, I'm liking their shape especially crossed onto a beltex as I nearly bought one a few month back

Lol. No, no and not a lot (in that order).

Any sheep 'crossed onto a Beltex' should have shape shouldn't it? That's the one thing a Beltex brings to the party, taking out growth rate along the way. Where you're happy to draw the compromise, is up to you and whether you can achieve a worthwhile premium for the trouble.

 

[dogandstick]

I'll rise above that and keep the ad hominem retort to myself. No, there's no problem. If you want good, workable tups they are to be had and cheaply enough. As an industry we do an awful lot of farming other people's farms for them. If other people want to buy overfed, over pampered, trimmed, coloured, show blunted, cabbage stuffed, ad lib grubbed fatty panters, and at a premium, let them. If you see that as a problem then have some faith in the market which will adjust to sort it out.

Hear, hear. Why do we, as an industry, want our competitors (other farmers) to get better at what they do? If they fail in what they do and fall by the wayside, that's another opportunity for the successful to expand.

I can't imagine a car maker sharing their good ideas with their competitors

 

[andybk]

Hear, hear. Why do we, as an industry, want our competitors (other farmers) to get better at what they do? If they fail in what they do and fall by the wayside, that's another opportunity for the successful to expand.

I can't imagine a car maker sharing their good ideas with their competitors

but you dont want a load of poor bred overfed crap being sold in the name of your chosen breed , everyone looses .history is littered with good intentions , suffolk a good case in point . brilliant breed in the 60/70s spoiled by a circle monopoly of showring edinburgh sellers in the 80s . A lesson that should be held up for all breeders to learn from .