One size fits all sprayer testing !,,

[Bury the Trash]

I wouldnt say mine is the biggest.... but its what i do with it that matters......
.
.It is Kept under cover and nozzle output checked regularly.......
.Seriously tho, and as a matter of interest the 'tester i use runs a sprayer repair / refurb business -so he knows a lot more about the job than the chap who just got the testers ticket.and a clipboard.and to be positive i do learn a fair bit from him each time.
Also there is a big acres guy round here - good up together sprayer -fine,..- but ive watched him over lap a times - following others inaccurate tramlines...i suppose

 

[Brisel]

i am probably leaving FA....but it grates that i'm suddenly 'not good enough' after growing malting barley for thirty years

me paying an annual mot is like you paying for 100 mots/year based on your £300k figure

people can 'willie wave' all they like about their sprayers and training...but i've seen no evidence that noroso has reduced pesticide residue in cereals or decreased diffuse pollution

http://www.voluntaryinitiative.org....voluntary-initiative-at-annual-steering-group
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/river-water-quality-indicator Click on the annual results. England has shown a steady increase in water quality. I can't find anything newer than that because the funding for these stats was cut during the recession.

We don't have a pesticide tax. Just thought I'd point that one out too.

We'll agree to disagree on whether the Voluntary Initiative provides any benefit. I believe that it has improved the professionalism of operators and the industry as a whole. The days of giving sprayer drivers a hand written rec on the back of a fag packet are over. Now, sprays have a better chance of actually being applied accurately, efficiently and responsibly. There's always exceptions to the rule of course.

 

[spin cycle]

http://www.voluntaryinitiative.org....voluntary-initiative-at-annual-steering-group
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/river-water-quality-indicator Click on the annual results. England has shown a steady increase in water quality. I can't find anything newer than that because the funding for these stats was cut during the recession.

We don't have a pesticide tax. Just thought I'd point that one out too.

We'll agree to disagree on whether the Voluntary Initiative provides any benefit. I believe that it has improved the professionalism of operators and the industry as a whole. The days of giving sprayer drivers a hand written rec on the back of a fag packet are over. Now, sprays have a better chance of actually being applied accurately, efficiently and responsibly. There's always exceptions to the rule of course.

well the first bit is just chummy backslapping....the second bit is quite old (2010) considering 2009 -14 was the period for the EU wqfd....if there is an improvement why isn't it being flagged up ar noroso or csf meetings ? why also have the aims of the wqfd been put back to 2020,,,,and then again to 2027?....perhaps because they know they've no chance of meeting them?

whats the point of you having a tip top outfit only to do your gamecover with a 'hedgemaster hardi'?...probably do more harm with that than i do with my little hardi that's stored undercover

i saw a local big outfits operator with the recs written on his arm last year....perhaps he doesn't smoke?

 

[Brisel]

well the first bit is just chummy backslapping....the second bit is quite old (2010) considering 2009 -14 was the period for the EU wqfd....if there is an improvement why isn't it being flagged up ar noroso or csf meetings ? why also have the aims of the wqfd been put back to 2020,,,,and then again to 2027?....perhaps because they know they've no chance of meeting them?

whats the point of you having a tip top outfit only to do your gamecover with a 'hedgemaster hardi'?...probably do more harm with that than i do with my little hardi that's stored undercover

i saw a local big outfits operator with the recs written on his arm last year....perhaps he doesn't smoke?

Read the sentence I typed about no new DEFRA stats since 2009 & budget cuts. Why don't you prove to me that British rivers are getting worse then? You're right about the WFD being put back (as it is elswhere is Europe too). Results take time to filter through. IPU & atrazine is still turning up in water despite being banned in 2007. That either illegal use which no NSTS/NROSO/VI will stop, or it's slow release diffuse pollution. Nitrates can take 50+ years to come through - we may still be on the way up after all that grass was ploughed up for the WW2.

Call it chummy backslapping if you like. I'm glad it has shaken a few cowboys out of the system frankly.

The "hedgemaster Hardi" is also calibrated regularly & has 2 sets of new nozzles. It lives under cover too.

Recs written on the arm? Like I said, there are exceptions to the rule. As long as his records are written up properly afterwards there's no problem.

 

[Boomerang]

But your spray operator is NOT a qualified ntst

@spin cycle to a degree we do, our sprayer gets checked over to nsts level by its operator at least once a week in the season, nozzles flow checked etc. what's the routine maintanence schedule on your sprayer??

If it takes annual checking to keep customers further down the food chain on side I don't think it's a major issue.

James

I'll ask my local NSTS tester next time I see him as to which are more likely to fail an inspection The 800 litre Hardi one I bought at an auction for the field margins & game covers had 3 different nozzle sizes on the boom! It also had an NSTS sticker on the side!

Mine gets £300k of products through it every year. Like @Jetemp 's machine it is jug calibrated at least once a fortnight in the main spraying season and the computer also does the overall flow test every load... I don't quibble about a set of £4 nozzles if they get beyond 5% variance in dose rate give the value of what goes through them. With such regular checking I think that surpasses the little machine dragged out fo the nettles every once in a while.

I support the concept of a degree of hours sprayed dictating the testing interval rather than the arbitrary once per year regardless.

The quickest answer to this has already been mentioned - leave farm assurance & you can drop to 1 year in 5 testing.

'The little sprayer dragged out of the nettles' is condecending and a gross generalization.
My 'little' 800l sprayer is 6 years old in as new condition stored undercover and well maintained.
I can ill afford a sprayer that does not apply chemicals correctly , i dont want to be paying for chemicals i dont need or suffer crop damage from inaccurate application. and as an owner any additional costs come out of MY pocket not someone elses Mr Brisel as in your case .
just because we dont have an all singing dancing mega money machine dosnt mean we dont take care and do a proper job.

 

[Jetemp]

But your spray operator is NOT a qualified ntst


'The little sprayer dragged out of the nettles' is condecending and a gross generalization.
My 'little' 800l sprayer is 6 years old in as new condition stored undercover and well maintained.
I can ill afford a sprayer that does not apply chemicals correctly , i dont want to be paying for chemicals i dont need or suffer crop damage from inaccurate application. and as an owner any additional costs come out of MY pocket not someone elses Mr Brisel as in your case .
just because we dont have an all singing dancing mega money machine dosnt mean we dont take care and do a proper job.

I'm in a similar situation to @Brisel do you seriously think that because we are employed rather than land owners that any additional costs are swept under the carpet and that there are no repercussions?

James

 

[spin cycle]

I'll ask my local NSTS tester next time I see him as to which are more likely to fail an inspection The 800 litre Hardi one I bought at an auction for the field margins & game covers had 3 different nozzle sizes on the boom! It also had an NSTS sticker on the side!

With such regular checking I think that surpasses the little machine dragged out fo the nettles every once in a while.

QUOTE=.

The "hedgemaster Hardi" is also calibrated regularly & has 2 sets of new nozzles. It lives under cover too.

not what you said originally

the rivers might be getting better??...but A/we don't seem to hear about it .. B/ the same message as years ago seems to be banged out still and C/ VI can't claim all (perhaps none) of the credit...stewardship buffers and the like are probably doing a better job?...with the decline in stewardship renewals we'll soon know perhaps

two of the chemicals they're worried about now are propyzamide and chloryplid.....the decline in osr growing may help the former more than any VI IMO

of course metaldehyde is the other big offender....at the last csf meeting i went to (fortnight ago) i questioned the essex & suffolk water company rep and he admitted ONE slug pellet in the wrong place could send the water sample some distance away over 5ppb....hence the fuss over pelleters i guess
he was nice straight talking bloke...he said to the meeting that winter rainfall has the most influence over pesticide spikes

i get the feeling that the only way to achieve the wqfd is to ban spraying sept-march....the powers that be know this and thats why it's been put back to 2027

 

[Boomerang]

I'm in a similar situation to @Brisel do you seriously think that because we are employed rather than land owners that any additional costs are swept under the carpet and that there are no repercussions?

James

I didn't say swept under the carpet . Just that I personally have to bear the additional costs and I very much doubt that you have to find any cash ,repercussions maybe , but if you were to cost your employer say £10000 through some sort of foul up , your going to reimburse your boss are you .

 

[Jetemp]

@SIABOD50 If I cost my employer £10k through my own negligence and I showed no regard for what I had done I reckon i wouldn't have a job. The knock on effect of this would mean I couldn't pay my mortgage and support my family and 2 young kids, where would I go for the reference I would need for my next job? There is also a finite amount of jobs similar to mine, it's not a case of I could move next door and carry on, another employer could require uprooting my family and moving to another area

After building up a working relationship with my employer over 15 years though they know my good points and my not so good points, and I'm still there!

Would £10k to your business realistically leave you in a similar personal predicament? I doubt it

Out of interest have you always worked for yourself?

James

 

[Boomerang]

You appear to be saying because it's my business losing my money dosn't matter and because I'm a land owner I can afford it .you don't seem to register its MY £££ and I work hard to look after it .

 

[Jetemp]

@SIABOD50 wow, you can't try and twist what i was saying to suit you. You clearly said in a previous post that you doubted that I would have to find any cash. I wrote my previous post to show the effect it could have on my cash, my family my livelyhood.

Do you not think that I may work hard to protect not only my hard earned cash but also that of my employers.

You seem to be saying that because you don't see it as my cash that I wouldn't care about. I can categorically tell you that as employee the finances of my employer are as important to me as your finances are to you.

I really can't believe how far off the mark you are with your last post

James

 

[principal skinner]

You appear to be saying because it's my business losing my money dosn't matter and because I'm a land owner I can afford it .you don't seem to register its MY £££ and I work hard to look after it .

Surely any employee worth having would treat the landowners/employers £ as their own and do their very best to ensure it is spent wisely and I would bet that @Jetemp @Brisel and many others on here are held very accountable for every penny, just because its 'your' money should make no odds

 

[principal skinner]

well the first bit is just chummy backslapping....the second bit is quite old (2010) considering 2009 -14 was the period for the EU wqfd....if there is an improvement why isn't it being flagged up ar noroso or csf meetings ? why also have the aims of the wqfd been put back to 2020,,,,and then again to 2027?....perhaps because they know they've no chance of meeting them?

whats the point of you having a tip top outfit only to do your gamecover with a 'hedgemaster hardi'?...probably do more harm with that than i do with my little hardi that's stored undercover

i saw a local big outfits operator with the recs written on his arm last year....perhaps he doesn't smoke?

Whats wrong with that? Im always writing the amount for the next load on my hand! When filling its a quick reference, just pop the glove off and have a look, its foolproof, always got it with you, doesn't blow away or get left in the cab and after filling I wash my hands and it erased ready for the next load!

 

[roscoe erf]

HGV's on low mileage don't have to have six weekly checks, they do 8 or ten weekly I believe so if it's good enough for HGV's then why can't something similar happen with sprayers?

up to 16 weeks

 

[Brisel]

Surely any employee worth having would treat the landowners/employers £ as their own and do their very best to ensure it is spent wisely and I would bet that @Jetemp @Brisel and many others on here are held very accountable for every penny, just because its 'your' money should make no odds

Nicely put. Thank you.

up to 16 weeks

How does it work with HGVs? Is there a degree of testing based on mileage?

My car does 5,000 miles per year yet still needs an annual MOT. A sales rep's car might do 40,000 miles per year. Does anyone hear any moaning about this? No.

 

[roscoe erf]

Nicely put. Thank you.



How does it work with HGVs? Is there a degree of testing based on mileage?

My car does 5,000 miles per year yet still needs an annual MOT. A sales rep's car might do 40,000 miles per year. Does anyone hear any moaning about this? No.

its on the mileage and the type of work i.e. tippers cement lorries are more frequent regardless of the mileage

 

[roscoe erf]

Nicely put. Thank you.



How does it work with HGVs? Is there a degree of testing based on mileage?

My car does 5,000 miles per year yet still needs an annual MOT. A sales rep's car might do 40,000 miles per year. Does anyone hear any moaning about this? No.

with trucks you can see why its needed a badly maintained truck can wipe out a lot of people in one go just look at Sowerby Bridge i suppose cars are not considered a high risk do so much damage etc same as a little sprayer little used

 

[Brisel]

not what you said originally

the rivers might be getting better??...but A/we don't seem to hear about it .. B/ the same message as years ago seems to be banged out still and C/ VI can't claim all (perhaps none) of the credit...stewardship buffers and the like are probably doing a better job?...with the decline in stewardship renewals we'll soon know perhaps

two of the chemicals they're worried about now are propyzamide and chloryplid.....the decline in osr growing may help the former more than any VI IMO

of course metaldehyde is the other big offender....at the last csf meeting i went to (fortnight ago) i questioned the essex & suffolk water company rep and he admitted ONE slug pellet in the wrong place could send the water sample some distance away over 5ppb....hence the fuss over pelleters i guess
he was nice straight talking bloke...he said to the meeting that winter rainfall has the most influence over pesticide spikes

i get the feeling that the only way to achieve the wqfd is to ban spraying sept-march....the powers that be know this and thats why it's been put back to 2027

Which bit contradicts what I said originally?

You're right about Shield, Kerb & metaldehyde to that list). Less osr and drier winters will help the water quality. Banning spraying in the autumn would help a great deal, but I won't be farming here if that happens. Judging by all the chemicals being withdrawn we're heading that way already. It's ok, we can import our food

Look at some of the other European countries. The French are facing major issues to clean up their water. They have none of our agronomist/sprayer operator training & their supply industry is looking to us to see how we are trying to manage this ourselves before heavy handed legislation finishes the job.

@SIABOD50 - Jetemp has said much the same as I would have done, only more diplomatically. I have nothing further to add other than that my job & career are at stake thank you. Comments about managers not caring because it's not their money are just daft. My employer cares a lot about how much of his money I spend. I want a sustainable crop production sector in Britain so I can keep doing what I am doing now - singing for my supper.

An MOT or NSTS is just a snapshot in time. That machine was up to the minimum standard on the day of the test, that's all.

What comment do you have to my question about the frequency of car MOT tests regardless of mileage done? I haven't seen any rants about that in TFF.

 

[spin cycle]

mine gets £300k of products through it every year. Like @Jetemp 's machine it is jug calibrated at least once a fortnight in the main spraying season and the computer also does the overall flow test every load... I don't quibble about a set of £4 nozzles if they get beyond 5% variance in dose rate give the value of what goes through them. With such regular checking I think that surpasses the little machine dragged out fo the nettles every once in a while.

.

The "hedgemaster Hardi" is also calibrated regularly & has 2 sets of new nozzles. It lives under cover too.

QUOTE]

can you not see how that reads,,,,,,or are there nettles growing in the barn it's stored in

Whats wrong with that? Im always writing the amount for the next load on my hand! When filling its a quick reference, just pop the glove off and have a look, its foolproof, always got it with you, doesn't blow away or get left in the cab and after filling I wash my hands and it erased ready for the next load!

you'll have to take that up with ....he said 'the days of recs on fag packets is over' which i assumed was colloquial for recs being carried in less than ideal circumstances? in my example he had the days work on his arm...not that i give a fig if it works do it

 

[spin cycle]

.

What comment do you have to my question about the frequency of car MOT tests regardless of mileage done? I haven't seen any rants about that in TFF.

good point...fair enough....except 1/ the law of the land says we have to mot cars annually and sprayers every five years
2/your hardi hedgemaster needs an mot then
3/ with thanks to @Kidds a car mot is circa £60 and a sprayer costs £150