Opinions on this farm scenario?

Hagri

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Ireland
Bit more info would be useful...

Location.

Owner occupier/tenanted?
Is the current system making a profit/loss?

What crops are you growing on the arable area now?

Have you any experience milking?

Could you get a contract?

Just in from lambing shed ,so away off to bed now. Will look in with interest tomorrow to see what the TFF brains trust has come up with 🙂
Midland ireland

All owned

On paper it makes a decent profit that should sustain 2 people but the reality seems much different.

Spring and winter cereals, maize on contract

No experience milking (maybe why the robots appeal 😅)
 

Hagri

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Ireland
Siblings?
The line of succession needs sorting. There are too many stories of one doing all the work for others to expect to be in line for a large share.
No siblings in the equation. Succession partnership is a conversation we are having as dad is open to reducing his workload and requires help. I would like to have a good 5 year plan when coming home so hence the post. Gathering ideas.
 

nxy

Member
Mixed Farmer
What I find amazing is that anyone finds a six figure debt a worry on a 370 acre farm. Dad here sounds like a driven man who has worked hard to build up a busy business. I know plenty like him who would not bat an eyelid at going to the bank to borrow half a million to buy 50 acres next door after their 70th birthday and then ask for thirty years to pay it off.
 

Farmer Roy

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
NSW, Newstralya
What I find amazing is that anyone finds a six figure debt a worry on a 370 acre farm. Dad here sounds like a driven man who has worked hard to build up a busy business. I know plenty like him who would not bat an eyelid at going to the bank to borrow half a million to buy 50 acres next door after their 70th birthday and then ask for thirty years to pay it off.

exactly, 6 figures is nothing . . .
 

Hagri

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Ireland
Is your father open to such a degree of change? Or are you open to running it a bit closer to how your father is?

If the answer to these questions is no, you will spend your days fighting with each other and a partnership would not work. Doesn't mean you couldn't farm, but the buyout route would possibly be better.

Why did you start working off farm?
He is open to change if I am committed to coming home. I think he's almost bit fed up of
200 dairy cows would most likely set you back £250 to £300 000 would it not @Bald Rick ? Then the robots....same again I would imagine.....Might end up being 7 figures owed.....plus your SEVERELY underestimating the work load......All goes pear shaped and you go back to your job....Where does that leave your father........
Would essentially swapping current stock for dairy cows not alleviate that cost?
 

cows sh#t me to tears

Member
Livestock Farmer
He is open to change if I am committed to coming home. I think he's almost bit fed up of

Would essentially swapping current stock for dairy cows not alleviate that cost?
Depends how many you currently run, and how many you intend to milk. A.d your still underestimating the work. I've milked cows for the last 33 years . Trust me, it's no walk in the park.
 
What I find amazing is that anyone finds a six figure debt a worry on a 370 acre farm. Dad here sounds like a driven man who has worked hard to build up a busy business. I know plenty like him who would not bat an eyelid at going to the bank to borrow half a million to buy 50 acres next door after their 70th birthday and then ask for thirty years to pay it off.
neighbour who we do work for is 85 this year
works and goes like he is 30 yesr younger
walked 60 acre with nap sack last year spot sprayed sow thistles did 8 loads some man
 

DKnD

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Exmoor
How much farming experience do you yourself have? (We have no idea, you could have lots or none) The only reason I ask is because, either way, I'd of thought the best thing to do is carry on as is and improve things here and there. You can make things simple or complicated.
 

Hagri

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Ireland
How much farming experience do you yourself have? (We have no idea, you could have lots or none)
Currently working on the farm every evening and weekend. Never been fulltime at home other than school/college holidays.

I have 50 acres rented in my own name the last 5 years. This is about 10km away which is in tillage, growing maize, winter wheat, winter barley currently.

Only experience I have in dairy is a 4 month placement on a 180 cow dairy farm, although I mainly spread slurry while I was there.
 

Hagri

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Ireland
What I find amazing is that anyone finds a six figure debt a worry on a 370 acre farm. Dad here sounds like a driven man who has worked hard to build up a busy business. I know plenty like him who would not bat an eyelid at going to the bank to borrow half a million to buy 50 acres next door after their 70th birthday and then ask for thirty years to pay it off.
And he would do it too.

Maybe it is nothing to be worried about but I prefer the idea of being clear of it. But maybe that will never be the case in such a business
 

Hagri

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Ireland
Sounds like you've got a golden opportunity
but might absorb far more of your time and energy .
Are you going back at a young enough age ?
That is the way I see it. I much prefer the daily hardship on a farm to sitting in an office doing something I don't enjoy, even if it's secure financially.. I am 28 this year. My accountant thinks that if I was taking a 3yr career break I should do it sooner rather than later before I get commitments myself. The farm should easily be viable for two people if a plan is put in place, and this is what I want full time meaning no more office life. If not I will have the career to fall back on and in that case the farm would need to run a system with minimal labour input.

But for now it's considering what can be done with the farm to best support the two of us, while still farming it ourselves.
 

Jdunn55

Member
That is the way I see it. I much prefer the daily hardship on a farm to sitting in an office doing something I don't enjoy, even if it's secure financially.. I am 28 this year. My accountant thinks that if I was taking a 3yr career break I should do it sooner rather than later before I get commitments myself. The farm should easily be viable for two people if a plan is put in place, and this is what I want full time meaning no more office life. If not I will have the career to fall back on and in that case the farm would need to run a system with minimal labour input.

But for now it's considering what can be done with the farm to best support the two of us, while still farming it ourselves.
If your dad and you are both keen go for it, but don't buy dairy cows without working with them elsewhere, it'll be a recipe for disaster
 

Hagri

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Ireland
The only reason I ask is because, either way, I'd of thought the best thing to do is carry on as is and improve things here and there. You can make things simple or complicated.
Aye the most straightforward method is focus the current efforts, maybe remove an enterprise or two and try maximise the efficiency from the others. Efficiency isn't something being maximised at the moment, for example calving is split spring and autumn but neither are compact enough, ends up dragging out the workload. First step could be bringing all to spring calving
 

Surface Tension

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Scotland
Strange that the OP thinks he can get the 6 figure debt down with what looks like a minimum half million investment. Presumably taking at least a 20-25 year long view of things but why take the risk.

If it was me I'd sell the sheep and stick with the sucklers on the 200 acre farm. Aim to calve them end March/early April. Get the calves off them at the end of the year and shift them onto 160 acre block, you should have enough grass to outwinter cows and calves for an extended period but will need reserves of silage/cereals if they need fed. Next spring older calves stay on 160 acres and sucklers once again calve on 200 acres. Should be able to finish older calves in the second year outside at 20 months old. Calculate how much ground you need to grow enough silage and either grow or buy in cereals when needed.
 

Hagri

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Ireland
Obviously never milked cows. If you want to reduce the work load, robots or not, milking cows won't do that. Also, reducing debt and buying 2nd hand robots....What about the capital cost of the cows
Its not so much the workload, I understand I'll be working hard for it whatever I do. I guess what I'm trying to get at is focusing our efforts more. To me dairy seems to provide the best source of income longterm (albeit I'm aware there would be initial investment costs) rather than being divided between the different enterprises we have now and not getting very far. Maybe as an initial step and to avoid any large investments I am better to focus on what we have and making it more efficient. I am open to ideas
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

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Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

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As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
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